Czech Republic v Scotland

[wastecoatwilly]

3 minutes ago, Morton Supporter said:

He’s not very good at anything as far as I can see.

I don’t watch English football, so maybe he is otherwise a midfield dynamo.

But I’m bamboozled that so many people think that this husk MUST be in the team despite all evidence for Scotland being that he is a terrible player - among the worst I’ve ever seen for Scotland.

Fans on here expect the same player they see for their clubs playing for Scotland this is the problem.
I don't watch English football either so i'm not influenced by what I see when they play for Scotland.
I couldn't careless what players do for their clubs,for me McTominay is a working process in the national side.
What the Czech's did yesterday is basically what Scotland does 8 times a year throw a group of players together and ask them to play.

[Aufc]

I genuinely dont get the negativity over our players. Yes we are missing quality in some positions but, on paper, the squad is as strong as its been for a while.

My biggest issue is our lack of decent wingers. Ryan fraser is decent but his attitude is questionable. We have decent attacking mids so is the alternative to have as many of them on pitch as possible and use the full backs for width? Robertson likes to get forward but he never seems to do this for us. Surely if we have two sitting midfielders then one can drop back for him when he is up the field.

Have the likes of mcginn, armstrong and christie all playing narrow and playing off dykes (or a.n other) and using robertson and palmer/tiernay as the wingers.

[Menzel]

1 hour ago, forameus said:

Wouldn't "Eastern" Europe carry a bit of a stigma of being absolute shitholes?  Completely undeserved of course.

I wouldn't use these exact words (!), but it's sort of skirting around the point here. It's a lot to do with connotations of the Soviet Union, which Czechoslovakia was never a part of, and the more unstable fallout that happened there after 1992. As there was no such thing as a 'Czech Republic' until the 90s (Lithuania, as the example @DiegoDiego offered, was already its own independent state before the Soviet Union invaded in 1940, so the deeper questions about a national identity have been sidestepped somewhat). Czechs generally disliked being lumped in with the likes of Ukraine, Belarus and so on who they share a very minimal Slavic identify with, and spent a lot of time crafting an identity as a modern, pro-European EU state; and indeed blame the 'Eastern Europeans' for bringing communism to their country anyway. There's a lot of anti-Russian sentiment here, despite Karlový Vary being a playground for rich Russians in the summer. So it's quite a loaded term here, even though the former politics of the country can often be regarded as a direct product of the region. 

ETA McTominay shouldn't be a CB. 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Menzel

[Carnoustie Young Guvnor]

39 minutes ago, Morton Supporter said:

I’m the opposite: bring Christie and even Armstrong I’m against the wee teams - safe in the knowledge that they’ll get aw the time they need on the ball.

Punt and rush against everyone else!

If these teams want to pass the ball ad nauseous - let them. I saw Spain bore the world to death doing that in 2010. I’m sure they’d have beaten us too, but I’d rather try to barge, elbow, kick and otherwise harras them in doing so than this cowardly brand we - and our club teams in Europe - have convinced ourselves needs to be played in order to be worthy of competing.

f**k that - punt and rush!

I’d love to see some of these ‘rolls Royce’ ball playing centre backs deal wi countless balls in the air and elbows to the face. A generation of players have never done it, and instead have defended one forward between four of them. We’re badly missing a trick here.

Nah that's pish.  These modern CB's you refer to are eight feet tall and made of granite.  They're absolute monsters now, and any pishy striker trying to pretend its 1975 again and acting the hardman will get wiped out immediately.

Do you think you'd be the first to try it against them?  Go and try and act the hardman with Sergio Ramos see what happens, he'd eat you for breakfast and shit you out the other side.  Physically the game is light years ahead of all that now.

[Guest Rscot]

17 minutes ago, Aufc said:

I genuinely dont get the negativity over our players. Yes we are missing quality in some positions but, on paper, the squad is as strong as its been for a while.

My biggest issue is our lack of decent wingers. Ryan fraser is decent but his attitude is questionable. We have decent attacking mids so is the alternative to have as many of them on pitch as possible and use the full backs for width? Robertson likes to get forward but he never seems to do this for us. Surely if we have two sitting midfielders then one can drop back for him when he is up the field.

Have the likes of mcginn, armstrong and christie all playing narrow and playing off dykes (or a.n other) and using robertson and palmer/tiernay as the wingers.


 

I’m not being negative, I’m just pointing out the reality of the situation. Yes we have some good players, but our midfield lacks balance and without it we will always underperform, we won’t get the best out of our good, forward-thinking technical players. 
You’re missing Turnbull, who looks a great prospect and will undoubtedly have leaped up the ladder with regard to inclusion into the 1st team squad now he’s moved to Celtic.

Edited September 8, 2020 by Rscot

[Carnoustie Young Guvnor]

11 minutes ago, Menzel said:

I wouldn't use these exact words (!), but it's sort of skirting around the point here. It's a lot to do with connotations of the Soviet Union, which Czechoslovakia was never a part of, and the more unstable fallout that happened there after 1992. As there was no such thing as a 'Czech Republic' until the 90s (Lithuania, as the example @DiegoDiego offered, was already its own independent state before the Soviet Union invaded in 1940, so the deeper questions about a national identity have been sidestepped somewhat). Czechs generally disliked being lumped in with the likes of Ukraine, Belarus and so on who they share a very minimal Slavic identify with, and spent a lot of time crafting an identity as a modern, pro-European EU state; and indeed blame the 'Eastern Europeans' for bringing communism to their country anyway. There's a lot of anti-Russian sentiment here, despite Karlový Vary being a playground for rich Russians in the summer. So it's quite a loaded term here, even though the former politics of the country can often be regarded as a direct product of the region. 

ETA McTominay shouldn't be a CB. 

They also rose up against the Russians in 1968.  Fair play to them, brutally suppressed but their uprising was the largest against the Soviet Union for probably its entire history.

[Carnoustie Young Guvnor]

I mean have you stood next to someone like Rio Ferdinand?  He's a fucking monster, and he's yesterday's man, today's CB's are even more severe.  You don't want to f**k around with someone like Harry Maguire, and there isn't a footballer on the planet who's going to be bullying him.

[wastecoatwilly]

25 minutes ago, Rscot said:

As I said I’m my opinion this is our biggest problem, and I believe the main reason we continue to struggle and underperform. We are missing a certain type of player in midfield.

For me it's more of a mentality thing they switch off when they lose the ball, watching Christie he defends from the front hes always the first player to react to losing the ball,getting back into position isn't enough it's lazy thinking.
For it to be successful you need 3 or 4 players closing down the ball and the next pass being made.

[Aufc]

I’m not being negative, I’m just pointing out the reality of the situation. Yes we have some good players, but our midfield lacks balance and without it we will always underperform, we won’t get the best out of our good, forward-thinking technical players. 

You’re missing Turnbull, who looks a great prospect and will undoubtedly have leaped up the ladder with regard to inclusion into the 1st team squad now he’s moved to Celtic.

 

Turnbull will be included in the decent group of youngsters who would potentially be our future alongside billy gilmour , dembele (should he choose) and the various others. However, having seen the improvement in tierney since Moving to arsenal, i am hopeful the likes of christie and turnbull will eventually end up down south at a decent level

[Guest Rscot]

Just now, wastecoatwilly said:

For me it's more of a mentality thing they switch off when they lose the ball, watching Christie he defends from the front hes always the first player to react to losing the ball,getting back into position isn't enough it's lazy thinking.
For it to be successful you need 3 or 4 players closing down the ball and the next pass being made.

I agree, but usually there is a player who will move first, who will trigger the press, the others will follow the lead. Dykes is pressing from the front, we need someone in the middle who will engage the press in the centre.

[Menzel]

2 minutes ago, Carnoustie Young Guvnor said:

They also rose up against the Russians in 1968.  Fair play to them, brutally suppressed but their uprising was the largest against the Soviet Union for probably its entire history.

Wasn't a particularly 'brutal' suppression for a few reasons, mainly because the Dubček government was very quick and clear to tell everyone to stay at home and not confront the tanks. The attempted Hungarian Revolution in 1956 was utterly devastating and they tried their best to avoid that, which to be fair they did.

By far my favourite act of disobedience was when Czechoslovakia beat the Soviet Union in 1969 at the ice hockey championships, and a bunch of lads went down and panned in the windows of the Aeroflot office. 

Realise now that this is widely deviating from the fitba chat so might be better to discuss this sort of stuff elsewhere or by PM! I find this stuff very interesting to talk about though. 

[Guest Rscot]

7 minutes ago, Aufc said:

 

Turnbull will be included in the decent group of youngsters who would potentially be our future alongside billy gilmour , dembele (should he choose) and the various others. However, having seen the improvement in tierney since Moving to arsenal, i am hopeful the likes of christie and turnbull will eventually end up down south at a decent level

Hopefully Turnbull will push Christie at Celtic, competition is good. If he does this, and he seems more than capable, he can’t be far off the 1st team squad. 
 

Edited September 8, 2020 by Rscot

[Carnoustie Young Guvnor]

6 minutes ago, Menzel said:

Wasn't a particularly 'brutal' suppression for a few reasons, mainly because the Dubček government was very quick and clear to tell everyone to stay at home and not confront the tanks. The attempted Hungarian Revolution in 1956 was utterly devastating and they tried their best to avoid that, which to be fair they did.

By far my favourite act of disobedience was when Czechoslovakia beat the Soviet Union in 1969 at the ice hockey championships, and a bunch of lads went down and panned in the windows of the Aeroflot office. 

Realise now that this is widely deviating from the fitba chat so might be better to discuss this sort of stuff elsewhere or by PM! I find this stuff very interesting to talk about though. 

I bow down to your superior knowledge.  Do you speak Czech?  I'm googling Brno never heard of it before, sounds like a nice city.

[Menzel]

7 minutes ago, Carnoustie Young Guvnor said:

I bow down to your superior knowledge.  Do you speak Czech?  I'm googling Brno never heard of it before, sounds like a nice city.

Aye, I did Czech studies at uni and now I work for a Czech company over here. my language isn't perfect but fine enough for a lot of the stuff I do, meetings and so on. Brno's a nice place and not so many tourists, so worth a visit if you're ever in the area. Still cheap for a pint and there's good wine about if that's also your thing. 

[Carnoustie Young Guvnor]

3 minutes ago, Menzel said:

Aye, I did Czech studies at uni and now I work for a Czech company over here. my language isn't perfect but fine enough for a lot of the stuff I do, meetings and so on. Brno's a nice place and not so many tourists, so worth a visit if you're ever in the area. Still cheap for a pint and there's good wine about if that's also your thing. 

Awesome.  All the Czechs I've met have been sound as, I would imagine its a good place to live.

[Jacksgranda]

1 hour ago, San Starko Rover said:

Czech Republic probably isn’t Eastern Europe as it’s right above Austria which wouldn’t be classed as Eastern Europe. The Czechs get lumped in as Eastern Europe purely as Czechoslovakia was part of the Warsaw Pact and those countries were “the Eastern block” back then. Funnily you wouldn’t class Greece or Finland as Eastern Europe even though both are further East. The East and Western Europe was more political than Geographical.

A/ Greece - southern Europe (practically Asia Minor)

B/ Finland - northern Europe (nearly Asia)

C/ True

Edited September 8, 2020 by Jacksgranda

[Gordon EF]

39 minutes ago, Carnoustie Young Guvnor said:

I mean have you stood next to someone like Rio Ferdinand?  He's a fucking monster, and he's yesterday's man, today's CB's are even more severe.  You don't want to f**k around with someone like Harry Maguire, and there isn't a footballer on the planet who's going to be bullying him.

Duncan Ferguson still would.

[Carnoustie Young Guvnor]

2 minutes ago, Gordon EF said:

Duncan Ferguson still would.

He's the exception.  Hands down the hardest footballer of all time.  By miles.  But we don't have a Duncan Ferguson.

[The Moonster]

3 hours ago, Rscot said:

Yes when he has filled out, but he’s still young.

McTominay is 23 and 6 ft 4. How much more are you expecting him to "fill out"?

He should be the first (and perhaps only) name in that defensive midfield role. We don't need two folk sitting in front of the defence, we need players in forward areas. He's never a centre half in a million years and a back 5 doesn't work for us. If these two games haven't confirmed that for Steve Clarke then I'm afraid he won't last long in this job.

[Jacksgranda]

38 minutes ago, Menzel said:

Wasn't a particularly 'brutal' suppression for a few reasons, mainly because the Dubček government was very quick and clear to tell everyone to stay at home and not confront the tanks. The attempted Hungarian Revolution in 1956 was utterly devastating and they tried their best to avoid that, which to be fair they did.

By far my favourite act of disobedience was when Czechoslovakia beat the Soviet Union in 1969 at the ice hockey championships, and a bunch of lads went down and panned in the windows of the Aeroflot office. 

Realise now that this is widely deviating from the fitba chat so might be better to discuss this sort of stuff elsewhere or by PM! I find this stuff very interesting to talk about though. 

It's a lot more interesting than the football, imho.