Restart

[Jack Burton]

Sorry Chis but totally disagree with your point on offering alternatives to try and get clubs to change mind. I for one would like to see alternative proposals to get the big boys back in as I fear for the future of the clubs that pull out - and players move on. Dont know the details of how this works. 
Everybody was happy to play friendlies under the health restictions so dont understand the difference moving into league games.
Is it the case that all that have agree to start comply with the dressing room rules ? Do the East and others comply ? In England fans are in. If not could tempory facilities ie portakabins not be brought in so the home team uses both dressing rooms and the away team uses the temp facilities,surely not impossible. Accept that it would cost some money but for how long ? My concern is if circumstances change for the better in a months time ? the teams that have withdrawn will regret it. Govermnent or the higher echelons of SFA should be looking after the grass roots.
I know its not you but why not let fans in in a controlled manner and league appoint "crowd behaviour person" to monitor social distancing in ground.
Again it has been mentioned why not live stream and ask for subscription charge ?
I dont think the future is Rosey and have already thrown my golf clubs out and dont own bowls

You want clubs to pay players wage, buy portacabins and buy cameras etc. to stream games when they have no income coming in? The LL clubs and a lot clubs in the East of Scotland will be due at least £5k from the SFA for being licensed.

Given the number of cases, hospital admissions and deaths continue to increase there isn't a chance we will have fans back in the grounds anytime soon.

[lithgierose]

27 minutes ago, Jack Burton said:

You want clubs to pay players wage, buy portacabins and buy cameras etc. to stream games when they have no income coming in? The LL clubs and a lot clubs in the East of Scotland will be due at least £5k from the SFA for being licensed.

Given the number of cases, hospital admissions and deaths continue to increase there isn't a chance we will have fans back in the grounds anytime soon.

Why don't the sg tell us the health condition. And the ages of the people who die from covid. That would at least remove at least some of the fear factor surely. 

[theesel1994]

17 minutes ago, lithgierose said:

Why don't the sg tell us the health condition. And the ages of the people who die from covid. That would at least remove at least some of the fear factor surely. 

I'm not sure it would - given the age and health condition of those that made up a large proportion of the crowds at (former) West Junior grounds.

[albertsquare]

7 hours ago, Jack Burton said:

You want clubs to pay players wage, buy portacabins and buy cameras etc. to stream games when they have no income coming in? The LL clubs and a lot clubs in the East of Scotland will be due at least £5k from the SFA for being licensed.

Given the number of cases, hospital admissions and deaths continue to increase there isn't a chance we will have fans back in the grounds anytime soon.

I think you half pick up my point. Yes to what you point out. But my main point is that help is needed from the SG and SFA.

Streaming games could be an income for very little outlay

And by the way you can rent Portakabins. The teams that have not pulled out obviously dont need them because they presently comply / will comply with SG guidelines

These are all temporary measures. Yes its hard times but nobody said ut wasn't

So thats some of my suggestions to try and stop withdrawals - whats yours

[LongTimeLurker]

9 hours ago, Jack Burton said:

...Given the number of cases, hospital admissions and deaths continue to increase there isn't a chance we will have fans back in the grounds anytime soon.

During any epidemic with an infection that is too contagious to effectively eradicate that is going to happen until herd immunity is achieved and imposing severe lockdown restrictions just prolongs the pain involved in getting there, if there is no readily available vaccine. There is no easy painless way out of this right now. Meanwhile, the SG in its infinite wisdom appears to be loosening restrictions on care home visits:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-54523044

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-54507488

Yes, let's keep fixating over regulations surrounding football for people in age groups with infinitessimally small mortality rates where COVID-19 is concerned rather than focussing on the shielding measures needed for the age group that actually have a lot to worry about over this just as they do every winter over influenza (but nobody ever pays a blind bit of notice on that in Scotland unlike in some Asian countries). Did the SG learn nothing from the mistakes they made back in March?

Edited October 14, 2020 by LongTimeLurker

[Jack Burton]

I think you half pick up my point. Yes to what you point out. But my main point is that help is needed from the SG and SFA.
Streaming games could be an income for very little outlay
And by the way you can rent Portakabins. The teams that have not pulled out obviously dont need them because they presently comply / will comply with SG guidelines
These are all temporary measures. Yes its hard times but nobody said ut wasn't
So thats some of my suggestions to try and stop withdrawals - whats yours

It isn't as cheap as what you think to stream the games. You need to fork out for the camera, laptop, software and hardware to stream the games. Renting or buying there us still a cost attached to it. Pinning your hopes on a grant would be foolish. Even if there is one by the time it filters down to this level it won't amount to much.

The only sensible thing to do was to delay the season and review it again in January. By then the latest measures would have had time.

What is the point in clubs at this level playing behind closed doors when the majority won't be streaming the games. Plus you have no promotion or relegation. It's no surprise that it is the bigger clubs with the bigger outlays that don't think it makes sense to play.

[WilliamBragg]

14 hours ago, clash city rocker said:

Kilbirnie were not happy with starting at this point in time. When it was decided that there would be no sanctions for withdrawal the club ( and supporters ) agreed to not play. Don't believe it is a crazy decision on the contrary we believe it to be the correct one for us.  Every conference club should have been aware of consequences of playing with no promotion , that is why they should imo had a discussion with their fans. Best of luck to every club that decided it was in their interests to play.

Can only agree with what you are saying here.

I understand the frustration of clubs in the conferences regarding promotion but as soon as clubs were quite correctly given the option to withdraw for the season then to me the WOSFL had no choice.

If for example my team Beith had a bad season and finished bottom then it would be unfair that we got relegated and then the other teams come straight back in where they left off.

Every team has made the choice that suits them best and we all just have to live with it for now.

[cmontheloknow]

9 hours ago, lithgierose said:

Why don't the sg tell us the health condition. And the ages of the people who die from covid. That would at least remove at least some of the fear factor surely. 

Not entirely sure deaths are the concern as people who survive will be very quickly filling up hospital capacities. And it's not just a case of converting former gig venues into more space - you need the staff (skilled in ICU work) as well.

[cmontheloknow]

2 hours ago, albertsquare said:

I think you half pick up my point. Yes to what you point out. But my main point is that help is needed from the SG and SFA.

Streaming games could be an income for very little outlay

And by the way you can rent Portakabins. The teams that have not pulled out obviously dont need them because they presently comply / will comply with SG guidelines

These are all temporary measures. Yes its hard times but nobody said ut wasn't

So thats some of my suggestions to try and stop withdrawals - whats yours

The help will come in a month of sundays. Committing to play without it is mental.

Any help that does come IMO will go to licenced clubs. I also believe crowds will return first at licenced clubs.

[Burnieman]

32 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

The help will come in a month of sundays. Committing to play without it is mental.

Any help that does come IMO will go to licenced clubs. I also believe crowds will return first at licenced clubs.

Are the Lowland, East and South of Scotland Leagues, and the bulk of the WoS all mental?

[lowenan]

No promotion or relegation, no spectators, very little streaming available, should probably delay the season, until all teams will join, and you get promotion and relegation back.

[cmontheloknow]

38 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

Are the Lowland, East and South of Scotland Leagues, and the bulk of the WoS all mental?

Yes. Or not in need of money to go on. Take your pick.

[Derry]

The worry for the teams that pulled out I would think is what state will they be in for when they come back as I’m sure they will lose there players and talbot etc could very well lose the manager 

Edited October 14, 2020 by Derry

[cmontheloknow]

4 minutes ago, Derry said:

The worry for the teams that pulled out I would think is what state will they be in for when they come back as I’m sure they will lose there players and talbot etc could very well lose the manager 

Even though in almost all cases it was agreed with the players and management?

And would also suggest that I'd rather PFC exist at all in a year's time than have all of the staff and players remain ongoing - were that the choice. The staff and players as far as I know are of the view that the club's survival is more important than playing on in a very questionable and uncertain environment. We looked after them over lockdown and I am very happy to see they are now, in turn, looking after the club.

[football.fan]

How many believe this season will get finished ? Or won’t get stopped for a bit. Cases are on the rise and out of control and we are only in October. December and January will be horrendous. There will be no fans in until the spring at the earliest. By that time clubs will be gone

[Derry]

12 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

Even though in almost all cases it was agreed with the players and management?

And would also suggest that I'd rather PFC exist at all in a year's time than have all of the staff and players remain ongoing - were that the choice. The staff and players as far as I know are of the view that the club's survival is more important than playing on in a very questionable and uncertain environment. We looked after them over lockdown and I am very happy to see they are now, in turn, looking after the club.

So they won’t play football at all for all this season and the 6/7 month they have already missed they will be in fantastic playing condition when they come back lol 

[Burnieman]

50 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

Yes. Or not in need of money to go on. Take your pick.

A pretty one-eyed view given the clubs that have withdrawn are a very small cabal that perhaps rely far too heavily on gate money.

[Jack Burton]

A pretty one-eyed view given the clubs that have withdrawn are a very small cabal that perhaps rely far too heavily on gate money.

The majority of clubs will rely on gate money, hospitality or fund raising initiatives (golf days, player of year nights etc.) none of which are currently permitted.

The majority of the clubs from the championship down will be running at a loss this season and will be relying on fans or wealthy investors to bail them out.

[Burnieman]

35 minutes ago, football.fan said:

How many believe this season will get finished ? Or won’t get stopped for a bit. Cases are on the rise and out of control and we are only in October. December and January will be horrendous. There will be no fans in until the spring at the earliest. By that time clubs will be gone

The word is that fans in limited numbers (perhaps 10% of capacity initially) at our level will return once the latest spike is brought under control.  The Govt are already aware that it is pretty low risk and it is merely about "timing"  ie probably political.  There is also outline agreement that the game will receive funding should that not happen.  Clubs are also making arrangements regarding changing facilities, and the requirements may be slightly relaxed to make it easier.  That's what I hear from various people, let's see what happens.

Starting the season is the right thing to do, yes there will be bumps in the road, yes there may well be stoppages or other disruptions but the season will - in my opinion - carry on to a conclusion or close to one. Clubs will adapt.

Those sitting out could learn to regret their decision.

[Burnieman]

1 minute ago, Jack Burton said:

The majority of clubs will rely on gate money, hospitality or fund raising initiatives (golf days, player of year nights etc.) none of which are currently permitted.

The majority of the clubs from the championship down will be running at a loss this season and will be relying on fans or wealthy investors to bail them out.

Many clubs continue to run their weekly lotteries which is a major source of funding, many transitioning to online. Sponsors will stand-by the vast majority of clubs, they don't want to be seen as the bad guys pulling out when clubs need them most. Last Man Standing comps still being run, etc etc.  Gate revenue as a percentage of income varies greatly from club-to-club.

A lot of clubs have already spoken to players to reduce money committments to ease the weekly outlay, some have even agreed to play for expenses only until fans return, or for free.  Clubs will adapt, they have always adapted and are pretty resiliant when it comes down to it.

Hopefully before the end of November we'll either see fans or Govt money, at least that is the expectation.  If the season needs paused for a few weeks whilst that happens then so be it.