The Dundee United Thread 22/23

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

29 minutes ago, ArabFC said:

“At Scottish clubs”

I have no issue with a DOF / Head Coach setup, in fact I dream of such a thing.

Build a philosophy of how you want to play the game at the club for the long term, instill it at every age level and seek coaches who buy into it.

Rather than sacking a manager every 18 months who have their own ideas and can’t work with these players.

What I do have a big fucking problem with is Ashgar thinking he’s the man to oversee it!

I mean in the world of Scottish football there are very few players who are genuine assets.

A Director of Football with powers over recruitment and playstyle is essentially in charge of managing the playing assets and making sure they keep their value in the long term opposed to a manager who is only thinking of the short term. That kind of dynamic doesn't exist in Scottish football. Almost every player is expendable and most have neglible transfer value.

 

[Granny Danger]

35 minutes ago, ArabFC said:

“At Scottish clubs”

I have no issue with a DOF / Head Coach setup, in fact I dream of such a thing.

Build a philosophy of how you want to play the game at the club for the long term, instill it at every age level and seek coaches who buy into it.

Rather than sacking a manager every 18 months who have their own ideas and can’t work with these players.

What I do have a big fucking problem with is Ashgar thinking he’s the man to oversee it!

I don’t want a manager, head coach or whatever else you want to call it who doesn’t have the final say over which players we bring in.  You cannot make someone responsible for the team on the park if someone else is deciding who those players are.

[Mark Connolly]

3 hours ago, Dundee Hibernian said:

I'm beginning to think that too, when I consider the performances of the last handful of well established choices. Mellon was, for me, the best of a bad bunch that included Mixu, McNamara, McKinnon, Neilson and Laszlo, but there wasn't much competition from them, considering the anticipation with which each appointment was received.

I'm happy to be corrected, but McNamara was fine until he started lining his pockets by selling our best players. Mellon was definitely the best since then though.

[Cardle is Magic]

7 minutes ago, Mark Connolly said:

I'm happy to be corrected, but McNamara was fine until he started lining his pockets by selling our best players. Mellon was definitely the best since then though.

Aye, wasn’t he doing great until you sold Armstrong and GMS to Celtic?

[Dee Bliss]

Agent McMullan what a fuckin game changer that was and for you’s to be contributing to his wages as well is just pure filth
 

Thank you

[Sarto Mutiny]

1 hour ago, ArabFC said:

“At Scottish clubs”

I have no issue with a DOF / Head Coach setup, in fact I dream of such a thing.

Build a philosophy of how you want to play the game at the club for the long term, instill it at every age level and seek coaches who buy into it.

Rather than sacking a manager every 18 months who have their own ideas and can’t work with these players.

What I do have a big fucking problem with is Ashgar thinking he’s the man to oversee it!

Aye, the DOF model is one that works all over Europe, so there is absolutely no inherent reason it cannot work in Scotland*. Most Scottish football journalists are too thick or insular to realise that though.

 

*depending on who the DOF actually is...

[Reverend Maynard]

I don’t want a manager, head coach or whatever else you want to call it who doesn’t have the final say over which players we bring in.  You cannot make someone responsible for the team on the park if someone else is deciding who those players are.

I think this is really important. You want a manager that instils the right attitude and belief in the team, and who players will go the extra mile for. Accountability and responsibility to each other. It’s easy to do well with a decent squad (McNamara), much more difficult with an average squad, which is what we have. Getting them to perform at a higher level will only come if they know the manager is the ultimate decision maker.

As for a director of football. Isn’t that what Strachan is meant to be doing at Funland? Questionable what impact he’s had ?

[Mark Connolly]

Just now, Reverend Maynard said:

I think this is really important. You want a manager that instils the right attitude and belief in the team, and who players will go the extra mile for. Accountability and responsibility to each other. It’s easy to do well with a decent squad (McNamara), much more difficult with an average squad, which is what we have. Getting them to perform at a higher level will only come if they know the manager is the ultimate decision maker.

As for a director of football. Isn’t that what Strachan is meant to be doing at Funland? Questionable what impact he’s had ?

Well they got promoted, so he's obviously doing a brilliant job

Spoiler

 

[Reverend Maynard]

Well they got promoted, so he's obviously doing a brilliant job
Spoiler

 

Lol, well quite. My Dee pals recon he’s done f**k all, but now they’re up, I’m sure they will change their tune.

[Robin.Hood]

15 minutes ago, Reverend Maynard said:

Lol, well quite. My Dee pals recon he’s done f**k all, but now they’re up, I’m sure they will change their tune.

Yer dee pals are idiots. He has had plenty assists to add to our promotion.

This is a fact.

[mishtergrolsch]

I think we've got a case of both parties over selling themselves here.

Tony has sold Mellon the image of a good squad full of talent thats walked the Championship, will give him loads of players to look at and he'll get the final say on who comes in and who goes.

Mellon has come in saying he'll do this and that, play all these potential champions league quality youths we've got coming out our ears, go along with signing input from Tony etc. 

There's probably been a big blow out in terms of what was agreed and what actually happened resulting in MM getting the chop, err, I mean amicably leaving.

Generic Head Coach willing to take orders from Tony will arrive two weeks before the start of the season and be punted this time next year because he didnt stir Tonys tea clockwise.

[Ludo*1]

1 hour ago, Reverend Maynard said:

I think this is really important. You want a manager that instils the right attitude and belief in the team, and who players will go the extra mile for. Accountability and responsibility to each other. It’s easy to do well with a decent squad (McNamara), much more difficult with an average squad, which is what we have. Getting them to perform at a higher level will only come if they know the manager is the ultimate decision maker.

As for a director of football. Isn’t that what Strachan is meant to be doing at Funland? Questionable what impact he’s had ?

Strachan isn't our director of football. He's the youth team equivalent. He has nothing to do with the first team except being a sound board for McPake whenever McPake picks up the phone.

[Bigmouth Strikes Again]

Ashgar throwing contract extensions to Pawlett even though Mellon didn't want him?*

*from a DAB source.

[Dundee Hibernian]

2 hours ago, Mark Connolly said:

I'm happy to be corrected, but McNamara was fine until he started lining his pockets by selling our best players. Mellon was definitely the best since then though.

Although I'm vague about when he started getting a cut, he inherited a decent squad, and played some of the guys Houstie thought couldn't carry us forward, augmented by Robertson, who I'm unsure whether he actually wanted to sign, and Nadir, who turned out to be a perfect foil for the young guys. It was either genius or luck with that, but his failure to learn in games against Tommy Wright would suggest luck.

I'd have gladly punted him after the SC Final at Parkhead in 2014. But similar to the present risky situation, we might have hired another incompetent, unlucky chancer. Eventually we did.

[East Coast Warrior]

There must have been some push back from Mellon over something but I doubt it would be Pawlett, he played him quite a lot.

Be more likely for not buying into the self-proclaimed/smoke-and-mirrors 'world class' youth project.

 

Some 'yes man' will put in place to make sure that gets used more often next season. It's. recipe for disaster if they start thinking every youth is going to make it.

[The Derry]

1 hour ago, Robin.Hood said:

Yer dee pals are idiots. He has had plenty assists to add to our promotion.

This is a fact.

They're talking about Strachan, clearly.

[Derry Alli]

1 hour ago, East Coast Warrior said:

There must have been some push back from Mellon over something but I doubt it would be Pawlett, he played him quite a lot.

Be more likely for not buying into the self-proclaimed/smoke-and-mirrors 'world class' youth project.

 

Some 'yes man' will put in place to make sure that gets used more often next season. It's. recipe for disaster if they start thinking every youth is going to make it.

Have they said how much they put into it yearly? 

[ArabFC]

16 hours ago, Granny Danger said:

I don’t want a manager, head coach or whatever else you want to call it who doesn’t have the final say over which players we bring in.  You cannot make someone responsible for the team on the park if someone else is deciding who those players are.

Except, you can and many clubs do. Obviously the head coach can still have some input into those decisions.

Anyone want to count the number of players that we've signed (wasted money on) over the last half-dozen years as each manager comes in and reinvents the wheel?

It's not pretty.

Edited May 26, 2021 by ArabFC

[Pull My Strings]

1 hour ago, ArabFC said:

Except, you can and many clubs do. Obviously the head coach can still have some input into those decisions.

Anyone want to count the number of players that we've signed (wasted money on) over the last half-dozen years as each manager comes in and reinvents the wheel?

It's not pretty.

Yup. Obviously the club have to have regard for who the manager is when deciding on recruitment but it's madness to be constantly re-shaping the squad every time the manager changes (or changes his mind). Better to pick a manager who can work within a structure than to keep changing the structure (personnel, style of play/player) to suit the whims of one (often short-lived) employee.

[Granny Danger]

1 hour ago, ArabFC said:

Except, you can and many clubs do. Obviously the head coach can still have some input into those decisions.

Anyone want to count the number of players that we've signed (wasted money on) over the last half-dozen years as each manager comes in and reinvents the wheel?

It's not pretty.

I’m sure there are clubs that do but it doesn’t mean they will be any more effective.

If a manager (coach) is failing it is an easy get out to claim it’s not his/her/their fault as it’s not their players.

For me the buck has to stop with the manager/coach and therefore they must have the power as well as the responsibility.