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The Dundee United Thread 22/23


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1 minute ago, NorthBank said:

St Mirren's last 3 results at Tannadice are 3-0, 2-1 and 5-1. so it is no big deal winning there. Don't judge JR on another defeat at home by St Mirren as it is a regular occurrence these days.

St Mirren considering it a home game now?

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26 minutes ago, NorthBank said:

St Mirren's last 3 results at Tannadice are 3-0, 2-1 and 5-1. so it is no big deal winning there. Don't judge JR on another defeat at home by St Mirren as it is a regular occurrence these days.

I actually had memories of you winning 0-3 at Tannadice in the 1980s when George Shaw scored when I watched the highlights yesterday

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5 minutes ago, Bogbrush1903 said:

I actually had memories of you winning 0-3 at Tannadice in the 1980s when George Shaw scored when I watched the highlights yesterday

Sounds like the 1-4 game in 1989 which was the end of the great 80s team

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Dundee United's predicament is a good reason why we shouldn't listen to pundits. The Mellon season was all "consolidation and season won't be defined against by team x" (despite team x participating in the same league).

Then the Courts season was all about how great season it was and "achievement" qualifying for Europe was despite the fact that it wasn't so much that Dundee United and Motherwell did particularly well but more about how awful Aberdeen and Hibs were. Given that premise, United and Motherwell or any other team didn't need to perform particularly well to make Europe.

Then after the AZ match it was all about how brilliant United were to beat a team like AZ and how the glory European nights had returned. Well as an Aberdeen fan, I can tell you that Europe isn't that easy. For the previous seven years we had failed against teams of a similar quality to AZ and that despite having the accumulated experience of around 20 recent European rounds of football and winning about 13  of them.

It was obvious that AZ were playing well beneath themselves at Tannadice for reasons unknown and United were facing an uphill task to protect a slender one goal lead. The Tannadice leg in fact represented a missed opportunity for United to establish some more substantial to protect in The Netherlands.

Ross is part of the problem but the squad as a whole aren't good enough from the Aussie keeper, Smith and too many veterans that have lost whatever they had. I think United are in for a long, hard season.

Consolidation one season and then perceived improvement the next means nothing if you keep changing your manager and turning the squad over. 

Edited by Bogbrush1903
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26 minutes ago, Bogbrush1903 said:

Dundee United's predicament is a good reason why we shouldn't listen to pundits. The Mellon season was all "consolidation and season won't be defined against by team x" (despite team x participating in the same league).

Then the Courts season was all about how great season it was and "achievement" qualifying for Europe was despite the fact that it wasn't so much that Dundee United and Motherwell did particularly well but more about how awful Aberdeen and Hibs were. Given that premise, United and Motherwell or any other team didn't need to perform particularly well to make Europe.

Then after the AZ match it was all about how brilliant United were to beat a team like AZ and how the glory European nights had returned. Well as an Aberdeen fan, I can tell you that Europe isn't that easy. For the previous seven years we had failed against teams of a similar quality to AZ and that despite having the accumulated experience of around 20 recent European rounds of football and winning about 13  of them.

It was obvious that AZ were playing well beneath themselves at Tannadice for reasons unknown and United were facing an uphill task to protect a slender one goal lead. The Tannadice leg in fact represented a missed opportunity for United to establish some more substantial to protect in The Netherlands.

Ross is part of the problem but the squad as a whole aren't good enough from the Aussie keeper, Smith and too many veterans that have lost whatever they had. I think United are in for a long, hard season.

Consolidation one season and then perceived improvement the next means nothing if you keep changing your manager and turning the squad over. 

Pretty fair summing up. The number of single goal wins last season, mainly accomplished by having a very good goalkeeper, allied to a general poor level of quality from the other sides in the league gave United an opportunity to participate in Europe this season. Still think they'll be ok this season but might not hit the heights (at least in league position) of last year.

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11 hours ago, Hoose Rice said:

Three cup finals and a third place finish with Hibernian bottom of the league when he came in was pretty successful.

Jack Ross is a good manager.  Needs time for his side to come good. 

Hibs sacked him, nonetheless.

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3 hours ago, Granny Danger said:

The absolute brass neck of this c**t trying to offer any advice or analysis.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/62625034

TBF he's in agreement with almost all Utd fans that the problem is a missing player a la Fuchs.  Although even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

Had a conversation with a St Mirren fan at work today who is convinced Ross just needs to be given time and he will turn it around.  If the rumoured issues with players are true, I can't see how we can give him it - it simply costs less to change the manager/coach than it does to dispense with half your senior squad.

If the rumoured issues are bullshit, he should be given more time although that will likely be measured in weeks rather than months.  Without a significant improvement in performances, I dont think he will see out the autumn.

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15 minutes ago, Hoose Rice said:

Was a mistake the owner has already admitted. 

Fair enough

I'm not suggesting he is a poor manager, just that I think he has midjudged a few things in his recent career.

 

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15 minutes ago, Drooper said:

Fair enough

I'm not suggesting he is a poor manager, just that I think he has midjudged a few things in his recent career.

 

True.

He was one game away from getting Sunderland promoted and one game away from being a complete legend for Hibernian though so it really is fine margins. 

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56 minutes ago, Hoose Rice said:

True.

He was one game away from getting Sunderland promoted and one game away from being a complete legend for Hibernian though so it really is fine margins. 

Aye, its a very fickle business.

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To be fair, when Ross came into St Mirren we had some decent players (for the championship) but they were being badly managed and nobody couldn't get a tune out of them. Ross started poorly and indeed a few supporters weren't happy (he entered the stands after the QoS game). He chose to turnover a lot of the squad to get his team in during January- Shankland, Tom Walsh, Ryan Hardie, Jason Naismith, Calum Gallacher all left to name a few who were decent enough for that level at that time. 

That said, things did improve after January remarkably and the team was excellent, but hard not to when we had good players for the division and no surprise we won the league ahead of United the next year with Morgan, McGinn, Magennis etc. 

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8 minutes ago, flyingscot said:

To be fair, when Ross came into St Mirren we had some decent players (for the championship) but they were being badly managed and nobody couldn't get a tune out of them. Ross started poorly and indeed a few supporters weren't happy (he entered the stands after the QoS game). He chose to turnover a lot of the squad to get his team in during January- Shankland, Tom Walsh, Ryan Hardie, Jason Naismith, Calum Gallacher all left to name a few who were decent enough for that level at that time. 

That said, things did improve after January remarkably and the team was excellent, but hard not to when we had good players for the division and no surprise we won the league ahead of United the next year with Morgan, McGinn, Magennis etc. 

Yeah, but to be fair to him it was Ross who brought in Magennis and made him a first team regular, signed McGinn and got the best out of Morgan and Mallan. Ross turned us from the worst team in the league to the best in the space of one transfer window. As well as McGinn, it was Ross who signed guys like Eckersley, Davis and Smith who were just as vital in the turnaround in that team, and the Dundee United team he finished above were spending a lot of money and had better players on paper. If it wasn't for Ross we could easily be a Falkirk right now, or at least a Dunfermline. As much as it's funny to laugh at him a bit now, it's not really fair to play down his achievements with St Mirren.

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Yeah, but to be fair to him it was Ross who brought in Magennis and made him a first team regular, signed McGinn and got the best out of Morgan and Mallan. Ross turned us from the worst team in the league to the best in the space of one transfer window. As well as McGinn, it was Ross who signed guys like Eckersley, Davis and Smith who were just as vital in the turnaround in that team, and the Dundee United team he finished above were spending a lot of money and had better players on paper. If it wasn't for Ross we could easily be a Falkirk right now, or at least a Dunfermline. As much as it's funny to laugh at him a bit now, it's not really fair to play down his achievements with St Mirren.
In mitigation, that Dundee United team was managed by Csaba Laszlo
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6 minutes ago, GAD said:

Yeah, but to be fair to him it was Ross who brought in Magennis and made him a first team regular, signed McGinn and got the best out of Morgan and Mallan. Ross turned us from the worst team in the league to the best in the space of one transfer window. As well as McGinn, it was Ross who signed guys like Eckersley, Davis and Smith who were just as vital in the turnaround in that team, and the Dundee United team he finished above were spending a lot of money and had better players on paper. If it wasn't for Ross we could easily be a Falkirk right now, or at least a Dunfermline. As much as it's funny to laugh at him a bit now, it's not really fair to play down his achievements with St Mirren.

Oh yes, I'm not playing down what Ross did in turning that around, or picking up players from youths or other clubs. I'm more making the point that he had a poor start and needed to get his players in whilst letting good players who didn't fit his ideas go. Dundee United may well be similar- decent players there but not his players to suit the way he wants to play. 

Once Ross had his players in we only lost 2 games from the end of January and we put 6 past Ayr, 5 on Raith, 4 on Morton and 3 on Dundee United towards the end of the season, which was remarkable had you seen us in November. 

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4 minutes ago, Sarto Mutiny said:
15 minutes ago, GAD said:
Yeah, but to be fair to him it was Ross who brought in Magennis and made him a first team regular, signed McGinn and got the best out of Morgan and Mallan. Ross turned us from the worst team in the league to the best in the space of one transfer window. As well as McGinn, it was Ross who signed guys like Eckersley, Davis and Smith who were just as vital in the turnaround in that team, and the Dundee United team he finished above were spending a lot of money and had better players on paper. If it wasn't for Ross we could easily be a Falkirk right now, or at least a Dunfermline. As much as it's funny to laugh at him a bit now, it's not really fair to play down his achievements with St Mirren.

In mitigation, that Dundee United team was managed by Csaba Laszlo

Which just goes to show how much difference a good manager made!

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  • TheGreenElves changed the title to The Dundee United Thread 22/23

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