League Reconstruction 20/21 season

[Ric]

2 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

Ah, we're back to deliberately misrepresenting what I've said.

..because you didn't spend yesterday doing exactly that!

[Twinkle]

Im beginning to think that reconstruction is the way forward. 14-14-14 with Hearts going down and us, Inverness and Dundee being promoted. Then we should just ringfence the top division

[Ric]

3 minutes ago, Twinkle said:

Im beginning to think that reconstruction is the way forward. 14-14-14 with Hearts going down and us, Inverness and Dundee being promoted. Then we should just ringfence the top division

Can you imagine the face on Budge if that was the outcome? After all her banging on that reconstruction wasn't purely to benefit her team, she could hardly argue against it.

[frankthetank22]

Reconstruction of the lower leagues (if that's what the concensus wishes) but the top division to stay the same imo. 

There could maybe be an increased parachute payment for Hearts, there would be a sum available that is there that was for the 11th placed team if they went down. 

[Sparticus]

My opinion now is it would best if this did go to court.

Hearts think they're right.

The rest of the world except Partick,Stranraer and Ameins think they're wrong.

If the courts dont even see it then the world was right.

Best they could hope for is some compo? Surely?

[Sparticus]

14-14-14 would be brutal.

Season over after 26 games.Ram yer half season tickets.

[Jack Burton]

In the 'philosophy of the league style competition' it is accepted that there is no such thing as a league table until all matches in the league program; i.e. all have played each other once at home and once away in a traditional round-robin tourney; have been completed. Obviously, it's a bit different in the SPFL Premier due to their 'odd' schedule, but the point remains... there are no champions, no wooden-spoons and indeed, no other positions achieved until every planned match has been completed.
In effect, this means that any unfinished league season is naturally null and void. As much as I despise n&v, the philosophy is definite on this.
Another thing I want to mention is the argument that teams being elevated to higher divisions cause any teams already in those divisions some palpable harm. I guess that there's a truth in that these latter teams would no longer be playing matches versus the teams that they might've been playing otherwise, that'd likely have brought bigger supports with them.
However, also in that scenario, such teams swap that factor for the one in which they now likely become 'the big fish' within their newly created division, concommittant with a likely much improved playing record in a technically easier division. Which fact in itself likely draws a better average home support, due to those improved results.
The 'but we're effectively relegated to the bottom division' argument, while kinda true, is somewhat 'straw-man', as of course, their standing within their division is much improved & further proof against relegation to Tier 4. Further, they'd have greatly improved promotional chances (that itself will also build crowds) and with promotion they'd enter a Tier 2 division of rather easier average oppositional strength than before restructuring.
 

You can't use the league tables for promotion or relegation as the season isn't finished but can for league reconstruction?

The other half of your post is utter nonsense too. Clyde's average attendance in league 2 when we won promotion was 600, it's over 900 in league 1.

As well as a reduction in attendances, there would also be less prize money on offer in the new tier 3 £72.5k to £40k compared with the current £120k to £70k.

You also failed to mention that Budge wants reconstruction to be temporary and we would probably have to finish in the top 4 just remain in tier 3 just to end up facing the teams we currently play.

It also makes it much more difficult to retain our better players. If they have choice between staying with us in tier 3 or signing for similar sized clubs in tier 2 then the majority will be signing for the tier 2 clubs.

[Mark Connolly]

1 hour ago, Ric said:

Considering he option is to save Hearts and f**k everything else, I wouldn't be surprised to see a "no relegation/promotion" clause until football can "stabilise".

I doubt it will be top division clubs, and I would argue that this would reduce the need for a larger top division.

As a successful business woman she will have used her successful business woman business woman experience to promote her successful business woman persona in order to enhance her successful business woman legacy.

Failing that, she clearly said, "if I don't get my way, I'm going to get Leslie Deans to speak to you, and none of you want that"

I reckon the Workington owners are rubbing their hands together at the thought of a bidding war between Hearts and Rangers

[Mr. X]

The views are far too entrenched in this thread no one seems likely to change their opinion. 

 In the yellow corner you have the supporters of the spineless teams who believe its fair to relegate a team that has 24 points to play for.  It just so happens it also makes life more easy for their team.  A few know that a weak Hearts team is normally a temporary blip, so  'let's get them down while they are weak', seems to be part of the thinking from some of the snake clubs.  'Reconstruction is just to suit Hearts' they squeal. 

In the Maroon corner  you have other supporters that can plainly see Hearts are getting very unfairly treated.  Everything should be done to ensure no team carries a disproportionately large burden because of Covid 29 shutdown.  Reconstruction is just to suit Hearts because Hearts are the only team that are getting shafted in the top league.  No other team in the Premiership is being voted out by their rivals, at a cost  of 3 million and possibly more. 

I can understand teams looking after number 1, and that is exactly why the vote should not have taken place.  

This post, like every other post in this thread will not change any opinons. Budge will present her temporary fix and the spineless ones will once again  prefer the f**k Hearts option to any kind of fair play. Hearts will then get a solidarity payment just enough to save this from going through the courts. 

We'll be back soon enough, and hopefully some of you smaller teams will still be around for us play. 

 

 

[Junior Pub League]

1 hour ago, Ric said:

Considering he option is to save Hearts and f**k everything else, I wouldn't be surprised to see a "no relegation/promotion" clause until football can "stabilise".

There is a precedent in Scottish Football for doing just that.

Division 2 was closed down for the duration of  WWI (from late 1918) and then didn't start up again until the 1921-22 season.

Aberdeen, Raith and Dundee were removed from the Scottish League during WWI for travel reasons with Clydebank (version 1) being added to the league to carry it on at an even number. The three removed clubs and Albion Rovers were then admitted back into the league for 2019-20 but it took another 2 years for the 2 division structure to come back.

Budge must be salivating at the prospect of being rid of what she sees as the diddies.

 

[topcat(The most tip top)]

Given that this has all got a bit specific and polarised a reworking of the question might be productive

 

Some people think that calling the league after 30 games is reasonable and some don’t

 

Presumably nobody would think that calling it after 1 game would be reasonable and everyone would agree that calling it after 38 would be.

 

So rather than there being only two positions there are actually 38

 

So two questions

 

What do people think the minimum number of games should be?

 

And wouldn’t it have been a good idea to have set that number beforehand?

 

I reckon 33 and “Yes, yes it would”

 

 

 

[Mark Connolly]

7 minutes ago, Mr. X said:

In the Maroon corner  you have other supporters that can plainly see Hearts are getting very unfairly treated.  Everything should be done to ensure no team carries a disproportionately large burden because of Covid 29 shutdown.  Reconstruction is just to suit Hearts because Hearts are the only team that are getting shafted in the top league.  No other team in the Premiership is being voted out by their rivals, at a cost  of 3 million and possibly more.

 

 

Well when this happens, we will have the precedent from Covid 19.

Get doon.

[Mr. X]

1 minute ago, Mark Connolly said:

Well when this happens, we will have the precedent from Covid 19.

Get doon.

Shocked that I never changed your opinion. 

[D Angelo Barksdale]

The cosmic ballet goes on.

[Ric]

17 minutes ago, Mr. X said:

The views are far too entrenched in this thread no one seems likely to change their opinion. 

Sounds a promising start, perhaps some sort of middle ground can be met, and this is jus....

17 minutes ago, Mr. X said:

 In the yellow corner you have the supporters of the spineless teams..

Ah, well never mind then.

As has been pointed out, if your club owner wasn't putting forward a plan specifically set up to save your team and your team alone, all the while showing no contrition then maybe consensus could have been reached.

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

9 hours ago, Cornishman said:

In the 'philosophy of the league style competition' it is accepted that there is no such thing as a league table until all matches in the league program; i.e. all have played each other once at home and once away in a traditional round-robin tourney; have been completed. Obviously, it's a bit different in the SPFL Premier due to their 'odd' schedule, but the point remains... there are no champions, no wooden-spoons and indeed, no other positions achieved until every planned match has been completed.

In effect, this means that any unfinished league season is naturally null and void. As much as I despise n&v, the philosophy is definite on this.

Another thing I want to mention is the argument that teams being elevated to higher divisions cause any teams already in those divisions some palpable harm. I guess that there's a truth in that these latter teams would no longer be playing matches versus the teams that they might've been playing otherwise, that'd likely have brought bigger supports with them.

However, also in that scenario, such teams swap that factor for the one in which they now likely become 'the big fish' within their newly created division, concommittant with a likely much improved playing record in a technically easier division. Which fact in itself likely draws a better average home support, due to those improved results.

The 'but we're effectively relegated to the bottom division' argument, while kinda true, is somewhat 'straw-man', as of course, their standing within their division is much improved & further proof against relegation to Tier 4. Further, they'd have greatly improved promotional chances (that itself will also build crowds) and with promotion they'd enter a Tier 2 division of rather easier average oppositional strength than before restructuring.

 

The second half of that is selective nonsense

[Guest SJP79]

Covid-19: Bundesliga’s four big clubs pledge $22 million aid for financially struggling rivals

Four of Germany’s biggest football clubs have pledged 20 million euros ($22 million) to help Bundesliga rivals facing financial difficulty in the coronavirus crisis, the German Football League (DFL) announced Thursday.

Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund, Bayer Leverkusen and RB Leipzig – all of whom qualified for this season’s Champions League – said they would make the funds available for crisis-hit clubs in the top two German divisions, which are run by the DFL.

“This decision underlines the fact that solidarity is not an empty word in the Bundesliga,” said DFL president Christian Seifert.

“The DFL is very grateful to the four Champions League participants.”

The four clubs will forego 12.5 million euros of their remaining share of next season’s TV rights revenues, and add a further 7.5 million euros from their own reserves.

The DFL itself will be responsible for deciding how the money is distributed among clubs in the top two divisions.

“In these difficult times, it is important that the stronger shoulders support the weaker shoulders. We want to show that football stands together,” said Bayern CEO Karl-Heinz Rummenigge in a statement.

“We always said that we wanted to show solidarity when clubs fall into difficulty due to this extraordinary situation and through no fault of their own,” said his Dortmund counterpart Hans-Joachim Watzke.

[Ric]

1 minute ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

The second half all of that is selective nonsense

Slight amendment to your reply.

1 minute ago, SJP79 said:

Four of Germany’s biggest football clubs have pledged 20 million euros ($22 million) to help Bundesliga rivals facing financial difficulty in the coronavirus crisis, the German Football League (DFL) announced Thursday.

Aye, I'm sure the OF, Aberdeen and Hearts(?) would be willing to dip into their collective war chests and spread the love.

[TonyFerrino]

We never even got to rambling stage last week, or whenever it was, before she was she was allegedly shut down.

So, I'm sure said clubs will definitely have changed their minds in a week though, especially once her detailed plans to save Hear...I mean reconstruct Scottish football for the greater good are laid bare.

They're like a bad jobby that won't flush.  Just get the f**k doon.  

[Mark Connolly]

29 minutes ago, Mr. X said:

Shocked that I never changed your opinion.