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League Reconstruction 20/21 season


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On 27/06/2020 at 23:21, The_Kincardine said:

If the SPFL hadn't fiddled the Dundee vote I'd agree with you.

 

On 28/06/2020 at 09:25, itzdrk said:

Talk me through it. 

 

On 28/06/2020 at 09:43, Tannadeechee said:

I'd love to hear how this was fiddled? Please don't mention "suspicious it was never received, as that doesn't happen, check spam folder" etc type comment. But if you can show, truthfully, that something went on that was dodgy, that was in contravention of Companies Act 2006 sections 296-298.

Thanks

This has been done to death and it's now down to the Court of Session.

The notion that if you participate in a two-option ballot (yes/no, agree/disagree, accept/reject) and if you tick one box and cast your vote it is binding yet tick the other box and cast you vote it is not binding is one to be decided by better folk than me.

I'd never want to presume on the considered views our law lords so won't prepare a "LOL at the Change a No Vote Brigade" thread just yet.

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11 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

 

 

This has been done to death and it's now down to the Court of Session.

The notion that if you participate in a two-option ballot (yes/no, agree/disagree, accept/reject) and if you tick one box and cast your vote it is binding yet tick the other box and cast you vote it is not binding is one to be decided by better folk than me.

I'd never want to presume on the considered views our law lords so won't prepare a "LOL at the Change a No Vote Brigade" thread just yet.

Done to Death and yet you still have it wrong😂

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1 hour ago, The_Kincardine said:

 

 

This has been done to death and it's now down to the Court of Session.

The notion that if you participate in a two-option ballot (yes/no, agree/disagree, accept/reject) and if you tick one box and cast your vote it is binding yet tick the other box and cast you vote it is not binding is one to be decided by better folk than me.

I'd never want to presume on the considered views our law lords so won't prepare a "LOL at the Change a No Vote Brigade" thread just yet.

It should be the case that it's a case of nothing to see here as the vote structure would usually simply be 'Yes' or abstaining and it would remain open (up to 28 days) until it either gains enough support at which point it passes )if within the 28 day period) or fails (at the end of the 28 day period).  To make it relevant you could intend to abstain but later change your mind to voting 'Yes'. 

But because they added a 'No' option to speed up voting, does that actually change it from how it works normally and therefore 'No' votes count as a rejection rather than abstaining. 

Equally, does the email from Dundee asking to disregard their vote which had not yet been received * then negate that if it does. 

Spoiler

*as much as I presume none of us believe the SPFL regarding not receiving the no vote you imagine that the findings of their independent investigation which apparently showed nothing of their doing would be taken as confirmation on that. 

I find this part of the petition very interesting, the rest of it not so much. 

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Regarding the admission costs,it's either we need the money to pay wages OR we'll look after the fans. Considering next season could see fans pockets tightened, I'd suggest the following prices from SPL downwards £25/20/18/15 as maximum. Any rumours of clubs going fulltime to part-time next season ?

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7 hours ago, itzdrk said:

It should be the case that it's a case of nothing to see here as the vote structure would usually simply be 'Yes' or abstaining and it would remain open (up to 28 days) until it either gains enough support at which point it passes )if within the 28 day period) or fails (at the end of the 28 day period).  To make it relevant you could intend to abstain but later change your mind to voting 'Yes'. 

But because they added a 'No' option to speed up voting, does that actually change it from how it works normally and therefore 'No' votes count as a rejection rather than abstaining. 

Equally, does the email from Dundee asking to disregard their vote which had not yet been received * then negate that if it does. 

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*as much as I presume none of us believe the SPFL regarding not receiving the no vote you imagine that the findings of their independent investigation which apparently showed nothing of their doing would be taken as confirmation on that. 

I find this part of the petition very interesting, the rest of it not so much. 

Tried to find the Deloitte report of their independent enquiry but all I found was this. I'd imagine the Judge will say to Hearts "What are you bringing me this shite for, what does it fucking matter?" in more legalese terms.

Quote

Dear All,

You will all be aware of reports in the press, calling for an independent investigation and for the suspension of SPFL’s chief executive Neil Doncaster and SPFL’s legal counsel Rod McKenzie in relation to the resolution that enabled the payment of nearly £2 million to Championship, League One and League Two clubs.

The focus of the questions raised in the press concerned the events of the evening of Friday 10 April, when Dundee FC attempted to return a voting slip to the SPFL in connection with the resolution.

In order to ensure complete probity and independence during this process, on Thursday 16 April, Deloitte LLP, a leading global provider of audit and assurance services, was appointed by the SPFL’s independent non-executive directors to carry out a comprehensive and independent investigation into the factual chronology relating to Dundee FC’s return.

Deloitte has completed its forensic investigation and the findings confirm the following sequence of key events on 10 April 2020.

Sequence of key events on 10 April 2020.

1. An SPFL board beeting commenced at 17:00 on Friday 10 April 2020. At the start of the meeting 38 returns had been identified as received, and 1 further return was received during the meeting at 17:10, bringing the total number of returns to 39. Ladbrokes Premier: 10 returns in favour, 1 against Ladbrokes Championship: 7 returns in favour, 2 against Ladbrokes Leagues One and Two: 16 returns in favour, 3 against.


It was noted during the meeting that one vote remained outstanding from the Premiership, one from the Championship, and one from Leagues One and Two.

2. The board meeting concluded at around 17:15.

3. At 17:15, Neil Doncaster called Dundee FC managing director, John Nelms, and left a message asking whether Dundee FC intended to submit a return.

4. At 17:39, Neil Doncaster had a conversation with John Nelms and confirmed that as far as he knew, no vote had been returned from Dundee FC. John Nelms thought Dundee FC’s vote may have been returned, but would make enquiries.

5. At 17:50, Eric Drysdale (Dundee FC club secretary) spoke to Iain Blair (SPFL’s company secretary and director of operations) asking whether Dundee FC’s return had been received. Iain Blair confirmed that it had not.

6. At 18:00, a text was received by Iain Blair, from Eric Drysdale, intimating that the Dundee FC vote should not be considered as cast.

7. At around 20:30, Ian Blair accessed the SPFL’s email quarantine system (which is a feature of the email system operated by a separate third party) at the suggestion of Rod Mackenzie and identified an unread email from Eric Drysdale that had been sent at 16:48 on 10 April 2020. Iain Blair released the quarantined email and it appeared in his SPFL email inbox at 20:55.

Prior to identifying the quarantined email at around 20:30, no one from the SPFL had seen the email from Eric Drysdale.

Deloitte’s examination of phone records, mobile communications (including texts) and email data has identified no evidence of improper behaviour by SPFL personnel concerning the submission of the Dundee FC vote.

I hope that Scottish football will now focus on the significant issues that face our game, otherwise many clubs may not survive this period.


We will have to be forward-thinking, and work collegiately to quickly present ideas and proposals to Scottish Government and others which will enable Scottish football to recover and progress.

Make no mistake, this is a critical time for all clubs, and we must concentrate on what is important to the future of our game.

Yours faithfully,

Karyn McCluskey

SPFL independent non-executive director"

 

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Sounds like there could be online public access to the proceedings tomorrow, the Jambo below on Kickback has asked for the link.

image.png.729cd0faf8c4f216777da7c6882efadd.png

 

P.S. Sent my own email, looks a bit complicated, think you have to download something called Cisco Webex, will update if and when I get a reply.

Edited by welshbairn
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1 hour ago, welshbairn said:

Sounds like there could be online public access to the proceedings tomorrow, the Jambo below on Kickback has asked for the link.

image.png.729cd0faf8c4f216777da7c6882efadd.png

 

P.S. Sent my own email, looks a bit complicated, think you have to download something called Cisco Webex, will update if and when I get a reply.

Do they say how to request access if you're a non-journalist?

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6 minutes ago, The DA said:

Do they say how to request access if you're a non-journalist?

Just got a reply, I'm on the list, not sure how it works yet though.

Send an email to this address. judicialcomms@scotcourts.gov.uk

Mention the case: P499/20 Pet: Hearts of Midlothian FC &c for section 994 & 996 of the Companies Act

Edited by welshbairn
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3 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Just got a reply, I'm on the list, not sure how it works yet though.

Send an email to this address. judicialcomms@scotcourts.gov.uk

Mention the case: P499/20 Pet: Hearts of Midlothian FC &c for section 994 & 996 of the Companies Act

This is the process, best to use Chrome for the session when you sign in, rather than Internet Explorer

https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/docs/default-source/SCS-Communications/user-guide---webex-events-attendees.pdf?sfvrsn=4

 

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15 hours ago, wastecoatwilly said:

We lose over 40 players a season to England and you don't think that has an affect on our game? Plus players don't leave for a mythical  progression they leave for a better bank balance.

I'm sure I'll regret asking this- but if we have 40 players a season moving to the 'best league in the world' and its feeders then why are we not capping some quality players and winning internationals? 40 a season would mean c 100+ playing down there at any one time plus the best of what is left up here, so where are they all at the Euros and WC?

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13 hours ago, Bazil85 said:

Our standard is hopeless and that's down to financial capability. As long as the money available to clubs stays low, players will leave to be better financially rewarded and that in turn will widen the quality gap. 

You answered your own question, a player like Kenny McLean should've never left Scotland for anything less than 7 figures this is a dereliction of duty.
It happens time and time again we bend over and accept it,the fact Scottish clubs don't protect themselves gives the English clubs an easy breeding ground.
The English leagues are a graveyard for Scottish players plus the detriment to our game never heals season after season.
We improve the English leagues to the detriment of our own and you think this is a good thing?
Everything is connected when it effects our young talent, your moral compass has no direction.

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1 minute ago, rainbowrising said:

This is the process, best to use Chrome for the session when you sign in, rather than Internet Explorer

https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/docs/default-source/SCS-Communications/user-guide---webex-events-attendees.pdf?sfvrsn=4

 

Yeah, I've downloaded the software, not sure if I needed to, presumably I just wait for an email tomorrow?

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10 minutes ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

I'm sure I'll regret asking this- but if we have 40 players a season moving to the 'best league in the world' and its feeders then why are we not capping some quality players and winning internationals? 40 a season would mean c 100+ playing down there at any one time plus the best of what is left up here, so where are they all at the Euros and WC?

Have a look for yourself.
 

 

Players abroad - Scotland - Players - Soccerway

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12 minutes ago, wastecoatwilly said:

You answered your own question, a player like Kenny McLean should've never left Scotland for anything less than 7 figures this is a dereliction of duty.
It happens time and time again we bend over and accept it,the fact Scottish clubs don't protect themselves gives the English clubs an easy breeding ground.
The English leagues are a graveyard for Scottish players plus the detriment to our game never heals season after season.
We improve the English leagues to the detriment of our own and you think this is a good thing?
Everything is connected when it effects our young talent, your moral compass has no direction.

1.  Dereliction of duty - by whom, and what duty?

2.  "English leagues are a graveyard for Scottish players" but "We improve the English leagues" - how does that work?

3.  Scots players have been moving to English clubs for better money and prospects since at least the 1890s. What is different today?

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49 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Just got a reply, I'm on the list, not sure how it works yet though.

Send an email to this address. judicialcomms@scotcourts.gov.uk

Mention the case: P499/20 Pet: Hearts of Midlothian FC &c for section 994 & 996 of the Companies Act

I'm half tempted but I think I'll give it a by. 

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