AFC1878 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Apparently the SPFL Board have now sought legal advice on whether the cash can be paid out without declaring the season over, declaring champions and relegating clubs in the process. Why couldn’t they have done that first? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 35 minutes ago, EdinburghBlue said: The ‘default' is surely null and void in the event of nothing else being agreed to? Why would it be? There is nothing in the rules about null and void. The default is that the season continues to exist and we wait to play the games whenever we can. 11 minutes ago, Angusfifer said: I can assure you that East Fife's statement reflected what was discussed and agreed by a majority of Directors at two Board Meetings last week. The idea that this was a purely benevolent gesture and had nothing to do with the fact that East Fife would miss out on promotion is incredibly far-fetched to me. Every club who had something to gain or lose voted out of self-interest, and East Fife are no different. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ecosse83 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Why the desperation to get things done just now anyway? Looking at things next season won't be able to start until later in the year, are the likes of my club Falkirk going to sign players in the summer for next season? No bloody chance it would mean we have to pay all their wages if the country is still being furloughed. Just hand some money out then wait. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scary Bear Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 18 minutes ago, Shadwell Dog said: Belgium have already started backtracking whilst all they had done was crowned their top league champions anyway. They hadn't decided anything re promotion and relegation. Crowning the Rovers champions will do for a start. Then we can talk about promotion and relegation. I’m sure Falkirk and East Fife will come round to the idea. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvz2000 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Paco said: The only issue with calling the league now and sorting out promotion/relegation later is it might be impossible to reach a consensus. Airdrie and Montrose, for example, voted for the current proposal because of the ‘carrot’ of the money, but perhaps on a solely promotion/relegation issue they’d settle for nothing less than a promotion. Similar story for all clubs in play-off spots. Remember the ambition even with current proposals is still reconstruction, but it provides a ‘default’ if nothing can be agreed on. I appreciate I’m looking at it from a position of being happy with the default, I wouldn’t be as relaxed if the default position was no promotion/relegation, but from an administrative perspective I can sympathise with the SPFL to a degree here. You’d be asking clubs to vote purely on self-interest with no ramifications and that’ll never get to a 75% agreement stage. The way it is clubs are voting on purely self interest , with the exception of ICT and East Fife both those clubs have gone way up in my estimation.... it’s an absolute farce and I feel that the SPFL are now hoping Dundee will change their vote which just unbelievable and not acceptable. Far too many teams have voted for this resolution?? And not thought about other clubs , SPFL have lied and are still not being honest , clubs should of have stuck together and booted this out the park but the way it is the SPFL will try and force this through.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cosmic Joe Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 15 minutes ago, craigkillie said: Why would it be? There is nothing in the rules about null and void. The default is that the season continues to exist and we wait to play the games whenever we can. The idea that this was a purely benevolent gesture and had nothing to do with the fact that East Fife would miss out on promotion is incredibly far-fetched to me. Every club who had something to gain or lose voted out of self-interest, and East Fife are no different. Take it from me, it was not a factor in the decision. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 24 minutes ago, DiamondJack85 said: By all accounts null and void is out the question, the Ayr chairman who was all for it even said after advice from the SPFL that this was now not an option. I'd imagine wiping this season from the history books could end up a legal minefield as potentially sponsors, TV and even us fans (not that many would I dont think, but it is left open to) could all request money back for a season that never was. As mentioned above...is this also the reason the SPFL are pushing for the default 1 up, 1 down resolution by default as if there are no promotion/relegation confirmed at the end of the season, it could be seen as still a null and void season despite crowning champions is each division? Not sure exactly how a season ending is defined legally but failure to get all clubs to agree on promotion/relegation after the season has officially ended could indeed see us replaying last season again. Can we all stop talking about null and void as if we're going to send some wee guy round to erase all evidence this season ever existed? What N&V means, in practice, is that the season is called to an end, payments are made either on final positions or league average, there is no promotion, no relegation, no play-offs and no championships handed out. Next season would start with the same teams in the same leagues. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvz2000 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 10 hours ago, craigkillie said: East Fife voted against it for exactly this reason (no matter how they dress it up otherwise). Well done East Fife , pity other teams weren’t so considerate, our league should have stuck together and not left us out on a limb , yes I think we probably would have been relegated but you can’t say that for definite, win our game in hand and we are 6 points behind with plenty of games left , we have done similar before 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scary Bear Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 1 minute ago, Gordon EF said: Can we all stop talking about null and void as if we're going to send some wee guy round to erase all evidence this season ever existed? What N&V means, in practice, is that the season is called to an end, payments are made either on final positions or league average, there is no promotion, no relegation, no play-offs and no championships handed out. Next season would start with the same teams in the same leagues. It’ll be like it never happened but it did happen and we’ll have a few quid in the bank to prove it. Sounds shite. Give us the trophy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, kvz2000 said: The way it is clubs are voting on purely self interest , with the exception of ICT and East Fife both those clubs have gone way up in my estimation.... .. Did they? How do you know what motivated their votes? I'd say it was more accurate that all clubs voted out of self interest. Some of those reasons might have beneficial impact elsewhere, but don't kid yourself any clubs are looking out for each other. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SouthLanarkshireWhite Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 In a situation where the season is not finished and finances are being washed away then the only principle that matters is that all clubs are around when this clears up and no club is relegated based on an incomplete season as that relegation could finish them in this environment (never mind the complete unfairness of it as a sporting criteria). For one season only 1. Top league of 14 reverting to 12 with 1 up and 3 down - playoffs for 2nd in Championship and 11th in Premier 2. Championship of 20 - reverting to 10 and 10 with 1 up to Premier & 2nd in play-off (and 3 down to Championship from Prem.). Teams in 3rd to 10th in Championship. 3. Teams in 11th to 19th in Division 1 and 20th relegated to Division 2 4. Two join from HL/LL and make up 10 for Division 2 - 1 up to Division 1 at end of season and one down. Downside is Championship is too big for one season and may be a bit dull for middle section. Dull for 1 season may be better than no club to watch. No one is financially killed by being relegated when they haven't completed the season. Championship has 38 games of home and away and allows comparison for fans of the 4 times a season of 36 games. I'm sure I will have missed something? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ribzanelli Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 47 minutes ago, Ecosse83 said: Null and void more likely to happen now after the shit show they held on Friday. Rangers seem to have a strong hand in all of this and the teams that would be relegated would go to town with the authorities now. Seeing as no league's have been won it will probably be easier for them to go down the null and void route to save their own skin. If it were null and void then isn’t it possible that Dundee Utd and Cove go to town with the authorities. It is difficult to make an argument that Hearts/Stranraer are more deserving of playing at a higher level than Dundee Utd/Cove next season. Null and void says you put more stock in what MIGHT happen over the final quarter than what DID happen over the first 3/4s. It is hard to believe that teams who were clearly shit for 28 games or so were suddenly going to go on a ten match winning streak. Sympathy for them over teams who clearly deserve to be playing at a higher level is misplaced IMHO. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roman_bairn Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Crowning the Rovers champions will do for a start. Then we can talk about promotion and relegation. I’m sure Falkirk and East Fife will come round to the idea.Think you should be promoted. But as Champions? nope... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raith1974 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Just now, roman_bairn said: Think you should be promoted. But as Champions? nope... Okay not as Champions but I'll accept winners of the league. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roman_bairn Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 Okay not as Champions but I'll accept winners of the league.Winners of a 28 game unbalanced mini league you mean?… 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvz2000 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 31 minutes ago, craigkillie said: Why would it be? There is nothing in the rules about null and void. The default is that the season continues to exist and we wait to play the games whenever we can. The idea that this was a purely benevolent gesture and had nothing to do with the fact that East Fife would miss out on promotion is incredibly far-fetched to me. Every club who had something to gain or lose voted out of self-interest, and East Fife are no different. I don’t believe this to be correct as every other club in a playoff spot voted for the resolution only based on getting the bribe of a cash pay out which is just criminal , at least EF were prepared to stand up against that offer , it’s the other clubs that should take a long hard look at themselves . 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 26 minutes ago, Scary Bear said: Crowning the Rovers champions will do for a start. Then we can talk about promotion and relegation. I’m sure Falkirk and East Fife will come round to the idea. That's not what belgium have done though . They've only announced their top league champions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 32 minutes ago, Ecosse83 said: Why the desperation to get things done just now anyway? Looking at things next season won't be able to start until later in the year, are the likes of my club Falkirk going to sign players in the summer for next season? No bloody chance it would mean we have to pay all their wages if the country is still being furloughed. Just hand some money out then wait. You mean do what virtually every other club in europe is doing. No we like to lead on these things so we can make ourselves look even more amateurish than we have already. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ecosse83 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, ribzanelli said: If it were null and void then isn’t it possible that Dundee Utd and Cove go to town with the authorities. It is difficult to make an argument that Hearts/Stranraer are more deserving of playing at a higher level than Dundee Utd/Cove next season. Null and void says you put more stock in what MIGHT happen over the final quarter than what DID happen over the first 3/4s. It is hard to believe that teams who were clearly shit for 28 games or so were suddenly going to go on a ten match winning streak. Sympathy for them over teams who clearly deserve to be playing at a higher level is misplaced IMHO. Do you think the teams who haven't yet won the league would have as much right to complain as the teams relegated who haven't had the chance to complete all the fixtures? Edited April 13, 2020 by Ecosse83 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvz2000 Posted April 13, 2020 Share Posted April 13, 2020 13 minutes ago, ribzanelli said: If it were null and void then isn’t it possible that Dundee Utd and Cove go to town with the authorities. It is difficult to make an argument that Hearts/Stranraer are more deserving of playing at a higher level than Dundee Utd/Cove next season. Null and void says you put more stock in what MIGHT happen over the final quarter than what DID happen over the first 3/4s. It is hard to believe that teams who were clearly shit for 28 games or so were suddenly going to go on a ten match winning streak. Sympathy for them over teams who clearly deserve to be playing at a higher level is misplaced IMHO. Not very accurate as we need a potential 3 not 10 match winning run which we have done before , we recently went 5 games without defeat , drawing with both Raith and Falkirk , promote top teams with no relegation 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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