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Coronavirus and the Scottish Championship


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3 minutes ago, Mr X said:

Its not just prize money that would be an unknown if clubs "mothballed" for a year. How many fans would come back? Or sponsors and advertisers?

True fans don’t desert their clubs.

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2 hours ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

That might increase costs. Would they be buying equipment to be shared or does everyone get kitted out? If shared your the talking about staggered kick off times. Would they be chipping in for a few pro cameramen and commentators?

I've tried making this idea of streaming add up to a viable project but it falls to pieces every time I apply any thought to it.

Theres your problem right there.

Scottish Football dosent need your kind!

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8 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

True fans don’t desert their clubs.

No, they dont. But what proportion of a normal attendance is made up of "true fans"?

Clubs spend a lot of time and effort attracting new and casual fans to  games. How many of them will find other things to spend their time and money on?

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6 minutes ago, johnnydun said:

Apart from if it's a game they are relegated at by thier arch rivals.

Sorry, couldn't help it.

Don’t be sorry.  If things go badly for you’re club you Can always get a ST for Tannadice.

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5 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Don’t be sorry.  If things go badly for you’re club you Can always get a ST for Tannadice.

I would rather cut off my arms than have them in jobby sleeves.

Edited by johnnydun
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3 minutes ago, Alert Mongoose said:

Hot air balloons are the answer here. VIPs taken up above the pitch to watch the match. Included in the trip will be champagne, pie and shortbread.  Balloons will match team colours. POA.

Is that not one of Falkirk's initiatives?  They've tried the hot tub.

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4 minutes ago, Mr X said:

No, they dont. But what proportion of a normal attendance is made up of "true fans"?

Clubs spend a lot of time and effort attracting new and casual fans to  games. How many of them will find other things to spend their time and money on?

I’m sceptical about many things relating to this virus, in particular I don’t think the U.K. will continue their devotion to a properly funded national health service.

However I do think that folk will return to football.

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10 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

I’m sceptical about many things relating to this virus, in particular I don’t think the U.K. will continue their devotion to a properly funded national health service.

However I do think that folk will return to football.

Some will, of course. But it would be absolute madness to think that clubs can disappear for a year and then simply return as if nothing happened, with the same level of fans and other income.

Of course, it might well turn out that this is the best course of action but its not without risk or uncertainty

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1 hour ago, johnnydun said:

I don't think you're being a smart arse or getting at me, I think this has all been a respectful, healthy debate and your counter argument has been appreciated. 

I do know the levels of staffing needed to run a club, it is most of those people that I am thinking about when looking into the possibility of paying for streams. The alternative is those people are out of work for possibly a year.

Like I have said I maybe am overestimating, however I when we are talking about job losses I think all options need to be considered. I think this needs surveyed at least.

Thanks. Again though I don't think Dundee, or Hearts, are typical in terms of staffing. Queen of the South for instance employ 4 people outwith football players and coaches. I doubt the likes of Arbroath and Alloa are much different. In fact I don't think the likes of Raith, Morton, Ayr or even Inverness and Dunfermline will have that many off pitch employees either (I'm not including volunteers / casual staff who work matchdays only).  Regardless of whether you employ five or 500 though, it's not going to help them to lose more money just to keep active. That's only going accelerate the employer into a financial abyss. You don't run games for the sake of giving people something to do. You run games if you can make a marginal profit. If you can bring more in by playing them than it costs to play. If you have a squad of 16 + players anyway and have to pay them then it may well be that there's an economic argument for looking at ways to play games with them and bring some cash in. The issue is that the smaller clubs don't have that. Most of them will have half a squad or less.

1 hour ago, rb123! said:

Watched the Scotland Tonight programme last night about Scottish Football and i thought Ian Maxwell spoke very well on it, unusual to see from someone at the top of Scottish Football.

Ian Maxwell seems convinced that this paid live streaming to fans could work and there's currently an SPFL media team looking into making it work. Looks as if SPFL media teams could stream each game instead of the individual clubs doing it. 

Also said if these regional hubs happen it would be with fans there and not closed doors. 

Ian Maxwell was, I think, a terrific appointment. He has experience as a player, in commercial aspects at Thistle and ultimately of being a Chief Exec. He's a good guy and will do well in the role hopefully. I don't think there's any doubt though at the moment when he speaks about the "SPFL" he means "Premiership". I didn't see this interview so I may be wrong but I'd imagine the focus is inevitably on them first.

1 hour ago, Mr X said:

The media group is made up of reps from big clubs and clubs who already stream matches, in the main. My concern is that they come up with some plan that works for bigger clubs but not for smaller ones.

I cant see how the SPFL could provide the resources to cover and stream every game. 

This. Although the SPFL were already moving towards providing broadcasting resources to clubs this coming season with a view towards providing more consistent and reliable highlights across the League.

1 hour ago, SpoonTon said:

Does this not beg the question of what the longer term consequences of clubs at our level saying that they are not going to compete for a season? What would the process of withdrawal actually look like - would there have to be an agreement or vote with Premiership clubs that they would not have any relegation? Would that damage the TV deal? Would the Championship-League 2 clubs be surrendering their share of prize money to the Premiership clubs for a season, and how would the amounts be negotiated back thereafter? I have no idea how any of this would actually work - would we be voting away our slice of TV funding in the hope that Premiership clubs would give it back or is there something which would stop them from doing that?

Would a club like Morton be giving away their current % level of prize money in exchange for the hope that they would get that level back when they returned to playing? What would the return to football look like if we had to pay for insurances, water rates, pitch maintenance, ongoing payments (for the online ticket system, for example), and any other costs for a year with no football and then we come back from a position of no staff with no assurances of the level of prize money at the other end? Would it be like the 2001/02 season when we returned with nothing after administration and had trials in the park in order to get a part-time team back on the park?

What would the penalties end up being if we didn't resume?

I wasn't particularly suggesting it would be a whole season. I'm assuming, perhaps wrongly, that we will be able to resume something close to normality by the back end of the calendar year and potentially play a shorter season, or roll the end  date on a bit to get it finished.  It would depend when we can actually start.

I agree, there are a lot of difficult issues to consider if lower League football is ruled out for longer. There may eventually come a time when the country has to accept a certain level of herd immunity and get on with things maybe. I don't know? A lot of the actions so far were always about preventing the NHS from being over-whelmed. A lot of the relaxation seems to me to be almost designed to increase the infection rate slowly again so they can continue towards immunising the population slowly. As a parent of high risk children that concerns me enormously but I can't keep them in the house forever.

1 hour ago, Mr X said:

Its not just prize money that would be an unknown if clubs "mothballed" for a year. How many fans would come back? Or sponsors and advertisers?

 

28 minutes ago, Mr X said:

Some will, of course. But it would be absolute madness to think that clubs can disappear for a year and then simply return as if nothing happened, with the same level of fans and other income.

Of course, it might well turn out that this is the best course of action but its not without risk or uncertainty

Absolutely. It's a massive risk. I'm hoping and assuming we're not talking about a year though.

Edited by Skyline Drifter
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18 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Thanks. Again though I don't think Dundee, or Hearts, are typical in terms of staffing. Queen of the South for instance employ 4 people outwith football players and coaches. I doubt the likes of Arbroath and Alloa are much different. In fact I don't think the likes of Raith, Morton, Ayr or even Inverness and Dunfermline will have that many off pitch employees either (I'm not including volunteers / casual staff who work matchdays only).  Regardless of whether you employ five or 500 though, it's not going to help them to lose more money just to keep active. That's only going accelerate the employer into a financial abyss. You don't run games for the sake of giving people something to do. You run games if you can make a marginal profit. If you can bring more in by playing them than it costs to play. If you have a squad of 16 + players anyway and have to pay them then it may well be that there's an economic argument for looking at ways to play games with them and bring some cash in. The issue is that the smaller clubs don't have that. Most of them will have half a squad or less.

Ian Maxwell was, I think, a terrific appointment. He has experience as a player, in commercial aspects at Thistle and ultimately of being a Chief Exec. He's a good guy and will do well in the role hopefully. I don't think there's any doubt though at the moment when he speaks about the "SPFL" he means "Premiership". I didn't see this interview so I may be wrong but I'd imagine the focus is inevitably on them first.

This. Although the SPFL were already moving towards providing broadcasting resources to clubs this coming season with a view towards providing more consistent and reliable highlights across the League.

I wasn't particularly suggesting it would be a whole season. I'm assuming, perhaps wrongly, that we will be able to resume something close to normality by the back end of the calendar year and potentially play a shorter season, or roll the end  date on a bit to get it finished.  It would depend when we can actually start.

I agree, there are a lot of difficult issues to consider if lower League football is ruled out for longer. There may eventually come a time when the country has to accept a certain level of herd immunity and get on with things maybe. I don't know? A lot of the actions so far were always about preventing the NHS from being over-whelmed. A lot of the relaxation seems to me to be almost designed to increase the infection rate slowly again so they can continue towards immunising the population slowly. As a parent of high risk children that concerns me enormously but I can't keep them in the house forever.

 

Absolutely. It's a massive risk. I'm hoping and assuming we're not talking about a year though.

I thought Maxwell didn’t come across too well. Probably because he knows what’s coming soon and it’s gonna be a very difficult problem to solve. Too be fair nobody defending this position would look good at the minute.  He did acknowledge there are many different things they are looking at but didn’t want to be drawn on much. Like you I think it’s going to be very difficult to get much running outside the premiership. Arguably there are a few teams in the top league who still might struggle and four or five in the lower leagues who could cope ok 

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2 hours ago, Granny Danger said:

I’m sceptical about many things relating to this virus, in particular I don’t think the U.K. will continue their devotion to a properly funded national health service.

When did we have one of those, then?

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Dunfermline releasing 17 out of contract players today. Not even keeping them on for another month with furlough like Dundee have done. 

On the brink?

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