Coronavirus and the Scottish Championship

[Monkey Tennis]

3 hours ago, TeeMan said:

That proposal is horrendous. Personally I think the league setup we have at the moment is about as good as it gets, there are meaningful games for most teams right to the end of the season. There is no point in breaking that just to save Hearts.

Absolutely this.

As other have pointed out, this really is quite simply about saving Hearts, and to a lesser extent, Thistle.  Substitute them with smaller clubs, and such proposals wouldn't exist.  

The terrible unfairness of deciding things on current league position, would somehow suddenly become acceptable presumably, for sides like ICT and Falkirk?

[oldhat]

I'm inclined to disagree, Mr Monkey.  Surely no-one can relish the 4-times a season games we currently have to sit through, plus the inevitable further repeats as cup fixtures, and a 14 team league with a split will to some extent improve this.  I don't really care if it's 14-14-14 or 14-14-16.  And although hearts and Partick have been cr@p all season and would deserve to go down,  given the totally extraordinary circumstances I don't mind if they get the benefit of staying up if we do get a more entertaining competition in the future.  And who knows, maybe one or both might be amusingly relegated next season anyway?

The problem underlying the reconstruction debate is that Scottish football currently hasn't the quantity or quality of players, clubs, supporters or managers needed for a thriving and vigorous league of 40 or so teams and the outcomes are evident in the dwindling league attendances and our p1ss-poor national side.  How we can overcome this, I haven't a clue.

[Socks]

The league setup we have at the moment is absolutely fine and there is no reason whatsoever to change it. Even if there were to be a change, it should be done properly rather than rushing something through as a fudge to deal with an unusual situation.

It's all about Hearts - Partick Thistle are a complete irrelevance in this. And after such a poor season, they should go down, the same as any other club. Ann Budge can bolt with all her greeting pish.

[Monkey Tennis]

30 minutes ago, oldhat said:

I'm inclined to disagree, Mr Monkey.  Surely no-one can relish the 4-times a season games we currently have to sit through, plus the inevitable further repeats as cup fixtures, and a 14 team league with a split will to some extent improve this.  I don't really care if it's 14-14-14 or 14-14-16.  And although hearts and Partick have been cr@p all season and would deserve to go down,  given the totally extraordinary circumstances I don't mind if they get the benefit of staying up if we do get a more entertaining competition in the future.  

It's not so terribly long ago that we had three divisions, two of them featuring fourteen sides.  I'm not sure that it carries guarantees of more exciting competition.

Apparently we need a fix, but I'm not sure what's broken, apart from Hearts.

[AUFC 1910]

Can we not call the bluff of this debacle and state that, with Hearts and Partick having been relegated, that they do not benefit from restructuring of the leagues?

 

Hearts go down, Dundee Utd up and so the 2 teams below (ICT and Dundee) go up to make this ‘magical’ 14 team top league.

 

Same applies to Partick - they go into the bottom of the pile.

 

That’s only fair [emoji41]

 

[Skyline Drifter]

37 minutes ago, oldhat said:

I'm inclined to disagree, Mr Monkey.  Surely no-one can relish the 4-times a season games we currently have to sit through, plus the inevitable further repeats as cup fixtures, and a 14 team league with a split will to some extent improve this.  I don't really care if it's 14-14-14 or 14-14-16.  And although hearts and Partick have been cr@p all season and would deserve to go down,  given the totally extraordinary circumstances I don't mind if they get the benefit of staying up if we do get a more entertaining competition in the future.  And who knows, maybe one or both might be amusingly relegated next season anyway?

The problem underlying the reconstruction debate is that Scottish football currently hasn't the quantity or quality of players, clubs, supporters or managers needed for a thriving and vigorous league of 40 or so teams and the outcomes are evident in the dwindling league attendances and our p1ss-poor national side.  How we can overcome this, I haven't a clue.

I'm not sure I'd use the word "relish" but the current set up generally provides interest for all clubs to the end of the season (unless marooned at the bottom a la Stranraer). It's pretty unusual for more than a couple of clubs in each division to have nothing to play for going into the last fortnight.

The reasons why smaller divisions were adopted in the first place haven't changed. Even at 14, particularly in the top level, it's extremely likely that half the league will have pretty much nothing to play for at the business end of the season. A bigger top level will leave bottom sides weaker and further adrift whilst it's unlikely anyone will seriously challenge the OF for the top two often. There might be a close race for 3rd if it's a Euro place potentially but you likely get 6 or 7 clubs in the middle playing for nothing for half the season.

There isn't really a solution which conquers divisions being small enough for everyone to be playing for something most of the season but large enough to eliminate seeing the same opponents 4 times a season without dropping the number of games played hugely (which isn't going to happen any normal season though might next season depending on when we can start).

As I've said before, there wasn't any great campaign for restructure before Hearts finished 12th. I'm sympathetic to the clubs who have been relegated, it was within a fraction of a point of being us, but it's not really a reason to force through a reconstruction nobody was especially looking for and few can agree of the best way to go anyway.

[Granny Danger]

7 hours ago, AUFC 1910 said:

Can we not call the bluff of this debacle and state that, with Hearts and Partick having been relegated, that they do not benefit from restructuring of the leagues?

 

Hearts go down, Dundee Utd up and so the 2 teams below (ICT and Dundee) go up to make this ‘magical’ 14 team top league.

 

Same applies to Partick - they go into the bottom of the pile.

 

That’s only fair

 

I’d go along with that.

[HeWhoWalksBehindTheRows]

38 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

I’d go along with that.

Defo. Dundee derby, Highland derby, and we get to laugh at Hearts.

[TheScarf]

Isn’t the whole point of the reconstruction chat not to save Hearts from relegation?

You won’t see Hearts and Dundee both in the Premiership next season unless it’s a 16 team league.

[bad chad]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/06/gretna-loan-details-deepen-controversy-over-plan-to-end-scottish-football-season-spfl

 

[Derry Alli]

Oh dear. 

[D'Jaffo]

Looks increasingly likely that the current setup will remain unchanged.

[Ludo*1]

The 14-20-10 option is perhaps the worst I've ever heard.

[Guest Flash]

50 minutes ago, bad chad said:

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/may/06/gretna-loan-details-deepen-controversy-over-plan-to-end-scottish-football-season-spfl

 

It was described as an advance in the BBC news at the time and was made after Gretna had gone into administration.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/g/gretna/7307222.stm

[weeredbook]

1 hour ago, Flash said:

It was described as an advance in the BBC news at the time and was made after Gretna had gone into administration.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/g/gretna/7307222.stm

What a great adventure /living the dream  /  fantastic times /  fairy tale   /  other shite . 

Total fuckin joke of a "club " .

[Dougie Mills]

1 hour ago, weeredbook said:

What a great adventure /living the dream  /  fantastic times /  fairy tale   /  other shite . 

Total fuckin joke of a "club " .

The club was fine until Brooks Mileson made them his plaything

[Ludo*1]

Probably been covered but what's the script with out of contract players and the furlough scheme? I take it we're not in a position to offer a new contract. Will they be covered on a month to month basis until they are off furlough?

[super_carson]

Probably been covered but what's the script with out of contract players and the furlough scheme? I take it we're not in a position to offer a new contract. Will they be covered on a month to month basis until they are off furlough?

In terms of HMRC an employer can extend a contract or re-hire someone for the purpose of furlough, as far as I am aware.

Not sure how this works for footballers though, as registrations and governing body rules may make it more complicated.

[Guest Flash]

4 minutes ago, super_carson said:

In terms of HMRC an employer can extend a contract or re-hire someone for the purpose of furlough, as far as I am aware.

Not sure how this works for footballers though, as registrations and governing body rules may make it more complicated.

Think that’s right. The difficulty with footballers is that, under the current rules, their contract has to run until the next window. So, they couldn’t be given month to month contracts.

If clubs knew that football was off until January and that the furlough scheme would cover them, they could re-sign everybody until then. Otherwise, they would be taking the risk of football resuming when they have unwanted players and/or having signed players until January that they can’t afford to pay.

[MallanandFlanagan]

In terms of HMRC an employer can extend a contract or re-hire someone for the purpose of furlough, as far as I am aware.

Not sure how this works for footballers though, as registrations and governing body rules may make it more complicated.

I heard Alan Preston talking about this on Off the ball and he said that some clubs of his clients are extending contracts until the end of June (end of the furlough scheme).