Coronavirus and the Scottish Championship

[Tannadeechee]

Just now, Ad Lib said:

It's possible.

It doesn't seem to me to be very likely.

In normal times I'd always assume accident over malice.

But these aren't normal times.

And the documented and reported existence of SPFL figures having directly contacted Nelms between the hours of 3-6pm make me smell shite.

There are reasons it could happen. As a United fan I'm not used to defending Dundee, but it is very possible and happens all the time to large organisations. We have emails held by our Mail Marshall all the time, especially those with attachments. These do not always require manual releasing, but sometimes they do.

[VictorOnopko]

Just now, craigkillie said:

He has no way of knowing whether Dundee sent their email or not, only that Dundee claimed to.

Yes.  That's why I added the possibility that Dundee were lying to some of the other clubs they were in contact with (ICT, PTFC).

[Granny Danger]

1 minute ago, Ad Lib said:

Granny: if we're to go down we're to go down. It makes no difference to me if that's last week or July.

But those deciding that should happen have to own it. Not pass the buck, do back-room deals or make vague promises to induce people to vote for something then not follow-through. They should be honest: they want to relegate us, Stranraer and Hearts on the basis of an incomplete season. Own that.

You seem happy enough for your Club to own that. So should the SPFL as a whole.

There seems to be an awful lot of posters who are not concerned with the outcome but who are posting continuously on this thread (great thread btw the OP should be proud).

I’m enjoying the indifference of all these folks, including yourself.

Hope you’re keeping safe.

[Mark Connolly]

One major concern for me is that a huge number of people seem to be accepting that everything Scot Gardiner said is accurate.

This is the man who once forgot to order seats for a stand.

[superbigal]

Very late to this thread.
So all football teams have their season ticket income.
They all have their minimum end of season possible league position payments.
They all have the ability to borrow money from govt loan schemes.
They all have the ability to use the govt furlough scheme. The portal should allow their applications to be accepted by the 27th of April.
They will have all other sponsorship in place that was meant to last them to the end of the season.

Appears on the face of it football should be in a far better place than the majority of businesses that the enforced shutdown is enforced on.

Which clubs are so badly managed that imminent shutdown is inevitable?

At this serious time in the "real world"
Any squealing chairman should be sent to the frontline.

[Ad Lib]

2 minutes ago, Tannadeechee said:

There are reasons it could happen. As a United fan I'm not used to defending Dundee, but it is very possible and happens all the time to large organisations. We have emails held by our Mail Marshall all the time, especially those with attachments. These do not always require manual releasing, but sometimes they do.

But then you would have a logged notification of when the "do you want to manually release" was received. And presumably the service provider would have a record of when it was in fact manually released.

[Tannadeechee]

4 minutes ago, The DA said:

The attachment (PDF?) might have been too big and their email provider might have delayed sending it until things were quieter over the evening.

But that sounds more like something that would have happened 10 years ago.

 

Not necessarily, our organisation has a 20mb limit on all emails. Although quite how the hell they'd manage to make that small slip 20mb I'll never know

[jagfox]

3 minutes ago, jagsfan57 said:

 

But it is ok to determine who gets promoted or relegated without changing rules ?
Definitely got their priorities right. What a shambles of an organisation

 

[Ad Lib]

3 minutes ago, VictorOnopko said:

Yes.  That's why I added the possibility that Dundee were lying to some of the other clubs they were in contact with (ICT, PTFC).

Well indeed. This could be that Dundee were lying.

But that doesn't explain what they stood to gain out of lying to Thistle or ICT.

As distinct from "just not voting with them".

[Ludo*1]

45 minutes ago, johnnydun said:

Does he not use his signature in the club programmes? Under his weekly statements? Is it the same?

Exact same - just checked.

[weetoonlad]

My question would be regarding the theory that Dundee's original email was buffered due to a media attachment, why did every other team's emails, presumably also containing media attachments of their signed votes, get through fine?

100% I smell shite

[Skyline Drifter]

16 minutes ago, The Master said:

Can anyone find anything in the rules or articles regarding monetary loans? Searching for “loan” or “lend” reveals nothing. 

It's in the Memorandum of Association (which isn't published on their website but is available at Companies House). The power to lend or advance money to any person or company is included in the list of things the company can do.

[Ludo*1]

1 minute ago, Tannadeechee said:

Not necessarily, our organisation has a 20mb limit on all emails. Although quite how the hell they'd manage to make that small slip 20mb I'll never know

Maybe the supposed 100 page original proposal was also attached.

[Skyline Drifter]

6 minutes ago, jagsfan57 said:

 

But it is ok to determine who gets promoted or relegated without changing rules ?
Definitely got their priorities right. What a shambles of an organisation

Er that IS a change of rules. That's why there was a vote on it.

[Skyline Drifter]

11 minutes ago, jagsfan57 said:

Good contribution!

I've posted about half a dozen times in the last dozen pages of this thread alone why that can't happen. I'm not going to keep posting it every time someone else comes on and repeats the wrong info again. It's all in the thread if you want to read it.

[Skyline Drifter]

11 minutes ago, Flash said:

I’ve not checked but it could be that if there is nothing in the Articles or Rules to prevent loans being made then they are ok if approved by the Board.

It's in the Memo, not the Articles or Rules.

[Tannadeechee]

2 minutes ago, Ad Lib said:

But then you would have a logged notification of when the "do you want to manually release" was received. And presumably the service provider would have a record of when it was in fact manually released.

Would be nothing to do with the service provider. It may be blocked by organisations mail marshall for example. The SPFL guys dealing with the vote would not be informed as they would have nothing to do with this. Certain members of SPFL ICT department may have, only the person dealing with the email systems, but they will have been at home due to public holiday, or on the way home finishing at 5.

As someone who works in IT this is VERY probable.

[Tannadeechee]

5 minutes ago, weetoonlad said:

100% I smell shite

Depends on how they've sent it, how they've attached the vote. Doesn't need to have been bounced, the SPFL's mail marshall system may have held it, simple as that.

[Ad Lib]

2 minutes ago, Tannadeechee said:

Would be nothing to do with the service provider. It may be blocked by organisations mail marshall for example. The SPFL guys dealing with the vote would not be informed as they would have nothing to do with this. Certain members of SPFL ICT department may have, only the person dealing with the email systems, but they will have been at home due to public holiday, or on the way home finishing at 5.

As someone who works in IT this is VERY probable.

The organisation's mail marshall would then have the records of that. So publish those records.

[The Master]

7 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

It's in the Memorandum of Association (which isn't published on their website but is available at Companies House). The power to lend or advance money to any person or company is included in the list of things the company can do.

In that case, and as much as it pains me to agree with anything coming out of Ibrox, could the SPFL not loan money on the basis of current position?

If the season then ends, nothing needs paid back; if it somehow continues, clubs who fall down the rankings repay the difference; clubs who go up get more. 

The downside might be drawing up watertight contracts to cover that.