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Coronavirus (COVID-19)


ICTChris

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6 minutes ago, Marshmallo said:

Agreed. The NHS is a public service. The last 18 months has seen a narrative shift which is more that the public should be living their lives with a view to serving the NHS.

The Tories are obviously quite happy for the NHS to slit it's own throat. Or more accurately have it's throat slit by managers who will ride off to BUPA plans with their pensions. 

Marketisation means offering the as little service as possible for as much renumeration as you can grab. 4 weeks for a GP appointment, mental health and physio therapy near enough inaccessible and now we have hospitals downing tools. 

 

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1 minute ago, Detournement said:

The Tories are obviously quite happy for the NHS to slit it's own throat. Or more accurately have it's throat slit by managers who will ride off to BUPA plans with their pensions. 

Marketisation means offering the as little service as possible for as much renumeration as you can grab. 4 weeks for a GP appointment, mental health and physio therapy near enough inaccessible and now we have hospitals downing tools. 

 

They aren't downing tools. Selfish people/scum catching a contagious respiritory virus are ruining it for everyone by not following the rules that aren't even that much of an inconvenience anyway........

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One thing which confuses me is the consistency of numbers. For example, I watch the daily numbers from the UK and Italy and they have been amazingly consistent for the last two weeks i.e 30000ish new case per day in UK and 6/7000ish in Italy per day. Can any of you brainy lads shed some light on why they are such? I would have expected many more fluctuations.

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19 minutes ago, Detournement said:

The Tories are obviously quite happy for the NHS to slit it's own throat. Or more accurately have it's throat slit by managers who will ride off to BUPA plans with their pensions. 

Marketisation means offering the as little service as possible for as much renumeration as you can grab. 4 weeks for a GP appointment, mental health and physio therapy near enough inaccessible and now we have hospitals downing tools. 

 

The public are already rounding on each other and using people's behaviour as the reason the NHS is "overwhelmed" (400 beds in use out of 20,000 due to covid scum idiots) so it's job done.

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56 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

Most of us are doubly vaccinated, we're all giving people space around us and 90% are still masking up for milk.

I'm not sure what else you would expect people to do.

What you say is true, but all you have to do is look at the posts on this forum to realise that there appear to be many folk around who seem to think that Covid is a thing of the past.

My son was at an evening in a well-known Glasgow night spot a couple of weekends ago and he told us about the widespread lack of sanity there. One of his group tested positive a couple of days later. It's pretty obvious that we haven't reached the highest ever level of infections because folk are being careful. 

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8 minutes ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

What you say is true, but all you have to do is look at the posts on this forum to realise that there appear to be many folk around who seem to think that Covid is a thing of the past.

My son was at an evening in a well-known Glasgow night spot a couple of weekends ago and he told us about the widespread lack of sanity there. One of his group tested positive a couple of days later. It's pretty obvious that we haven't reached the highest ever level of infections because folk are being careful. 

What does “a lack of sanity” look like exactly?

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4 minutes ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

What you say is true, but all you have to do is look at the posts on this forum to realise that there appear to be many folk around who seem to think that Covid is a thing of the past.

I think most people just recognise that being double vaccinated is about as good as you're going to get in the way of protection against this and want their normal life back, content with the risk that they can still catch it and it might still kill them. Covid needs to become a thing of the past in about 5 weeks time or we will have a lot of businesses going bust and a dole queue longer than any queue for a Covid bed. 

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The NHS is a public service that the public aren't prepared to pay for.  It's also a service that the demand for has massively increased since its inception due to the growing population simultaneously living longer and getting fatter.

Whilst the NHS in Scotland isnt overwhelmed in terms of the number of COVID patients at present (evidence of the sterling work of the vaccines), Im quite prepared to accept the anecdotes of NHS staff as to how shite working conditions currently are, have been for the last 18 months and generally are every time there is a difficult winter or respiratory virus.  If anyone thinks we have had a fully functioning health service during the pandemic, they need their head examined.

I want a health service that has the capacity built in to be able to be fully functioning despite a widespread illness, preferably without multiple prolonged lockdowns and restrictions which have been needed even to provide the level of care we have seen since March 2020.

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True but it's a mental reach to go from "wearing a mask = no covid and not wearing a mask = covid" means masks are useless.

I can't even see the beginning of a train of thought there 
Jings clearly you haven't spent much time on here !!!
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Have we got to the point where wearing a face mask is very bad for your health?

Has anyone died because they were wearing a face mask, I mean this is the internet which means someone with a big nose knows?

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Lots of interesting posts about the NHS - hospitals, GPS and dentistry and what I can see coming out of this is an explosion of private health care. Eventually, maybe not till after a good few years, people will decide that the service they are getting is crap and the market will kick in. Simple economic rules of supply and demand. A shortage, poor service will bring more private entrants into the market and bingo, off we go. It will be unfortunate, especially for the less well off but that’s what the market is saying.
The NHS should be there for the people not the other way round and, if it isn’t doing it’s job for whatever reason, it’s finished. The market will solve the problem.
It's out the reach for the vast majority and the govt know it. I've been on a waiting list for a relatively routine operation for 9 months now. Had all the diagnostics despite lockdowns but just caught up now in a huge backlog. If it worsens I've been told not to hesitate in dialing 999 and I will require emergency surgery in that situation. I enquired about going private and had quotes of between 11 and 15k so totally out of the question for me and I would assume the vast majority bar the tiny proportion with private medical plans. The reality for the vast majority is that we are at the mercy of the NHS.
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7 minutes ago, No_Problemo said:

What does “a lack of sanity” look like exactly?

Fair question. I wasn't there, not quite my 'scene'. (Grumpy old git!) A summary would be bending the rules on masks to breaking point and physical contact being no problem.  I don't want to identify the premises, but there was a quieter, less busy part where the sanity seemed to prevail,  (where my son and his g/f were) and a busier part where folk were basically off their tits and acting as if it was a combined 21st, a hen night and a stag do all in one.  My son's pal was in the latter area, so he probably won't be the only one. A rise in cases was inevitable, but I'm left with the distinct feeling that "we" - as in the population in general - could have done more to help keep the figures down. 

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4 minutes ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

Fair question. I wasn't there, not quite my 'scene'. (Grumpy old git!) A summary would be bending the rules on masks to breaking point and physical contact being no problem.  I don't want to identify the premises, but there was a quieter, less busy part where the sanity seemed to prevail,  (where my son and his g/f were) and a busier part where folk were basically off their tits and acting as if it was a combined 21st, a hen night and a stag do all in one.  My son's pal was in the latter area, so he probably won't be the only one. A rise in cases was inevitable, but I'm left with the distinct feeling that "we" - as in the population in general - could have done more to help keep the figures down. 

Tbh, I think your son may have been in the wrong place if he thought nightclubs weren’t about trying to get your hole and having a good time dancing with folk.

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On 24/08/2021 at 18:39, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

What’s everyone’s hopes for the public hearings? Love to see one of the decision makers behind the punt old folks into care homes whilst infectious and kill loads of residents tactic face criminal charges. Hope that it gives people failed by the government the chance to speak without being shouted down as ‘tories’ or now ‘covid deniers’. 
 

That's what should happen

 

On 24/08/2021 at 18:39, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:


Ultimately expect that none of this will happen because it will be a sham. 

That's what will happen

On 24/08/2021 at 18:53, Left Back said:

  Would like to see this both sides of the border.

Unfortunately your second paragraph will be true both sides of the border.  No-one will be personally held accountable for anything.  The most that will happen is some wrists might be slapped for having inadequate stocks of PPE.

There should be enquiries in all 4 countries, NI followed the same practice.

And you're correct with your last sentence.

 

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12 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:
1 hour ago, Dawson Park Boy said:
Lots of interesting posts about the NHS - hospitals, GPS and dentistry and what I can see coming out of this is an explosion of private health care. Eventually, maybe not till after a good few years, people will decide that the service they are getting is crap and the market will kick in. Simple economic rules of supply and demand. A shortage, poor service will bring more private entrants into the market and bingo, off we go. It will be unfortunate, especially for the less well off but that’s what the market is saying.
The NHS should be there for the people not the other way round and, if it isn’t doing it’s job for whatever reason, it’s finished. The market will solve the problem.

It's out the reach for the vast majority and the govt know it. I've been on a waiting list for a relatively routine operation for 9 months now. Had all the diagnostics despite lockdowns but just caught up now in a huge backlog. If it worsens I've been told not to hesitate in dialing 999 and I will require emergency surgery in that situation. I enquired about going private and had quotes of between 11 and 15k so totally out of the question for me and I would assume the vast majority bar the tiny proportion with private medical plans. The reality for the vast majority is that we are at the mercy of the NHS.

That’s a classic situation and I fully sympathise with you.

You are demonstrating that the NHS is not looking after you other than when you reach the point of requiring emergency surgery.

Absolutely appalling!!

As an aside, is there not a point where the NHS must pay for you to be dealt with privately?

I don’t know the solution but there must be a system which combines the state and an insurance based regime to meet our needs regardless of income. Other European countries manage it.

 

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1 hour ago, Detournement said:

Too many people in the NHS seem to think their role in society is to restrict and ration health care. 

Dawson is sadly correct that unless they begin to behave like a universal service for all then the NHS is finished. 

The NHS wasnt designed to deal with the very complex medical issues that it now has to manage. I sincerely doubt that Bevan looked into the future and imagined the way mental health care expectations would go for one (im not saying i dont agree that mental health problems are some how not deserving of treatment, just that the spectrum and scope of things that are now treated is beyond comprehension of 60 years ago). I think society also creates some of the issues via the media etc, peoples consumption of ‘the ideal’ focus on material things etc has driven us to a place that even without looking at biological and more personal drivers of poor mental health we arrive at a destination which is scary. 

So much health practitioners time is taken up by people who really shouldnt be bothering them with utter nonsense. There needs to be a re-education of the public as to whats an appropriate use of NHS resources. For me its a bit like the climate crisis, we are fast approaching a point where it would be broken beyond fixing, but we are not there yet. I would never support the notion of charging for access to a doctor, because the pandemic has shown that the knuckle draggers and selfish arseholes who demand to see a GP in the most unneeding of circumstances will still continue to be a drain on services. So many times my wife has come home so distraught because shes had to tell someone they were dying of cancer and that person didnt want to bother the doctor and put off making an appointment when the prognosis could have been better. 
 

Your post is indicative of the sort of attitude that will bring the NHS down. 
 

All through this thread there are people giving ‘doctors are refusing to see patients’ etc, they fucking arent, people are triaged, they get the right kind of care and if they use the secondary services like pharmacists, opticians and other similar resources they’d get help quickly and keep primary care appointments for people who actually need them. 
 

If you all want an NHS that will give you everything you want whenever you want it then you’ll have to pay a fuckload more in tax, hope that we can recruit enough nursing staff abroad and stop abusing the doctors, nurses, clinicians and receptionists to the point that they think ‘f**k this ill go work in the private sector’. Well seeing so many of the people who voted for brexit and the tories on here and twitter whinge the most about the NHS being shit, its like tying someones arm behind their back and complaining that they cant tie their fucking shoes. 
Im happy to pay more in tax for the NHS, how many of the people shouting the loudest about how fucking shite it is are as well?

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