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Coronavirus (COVID-19)


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16 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

A rational person would compare that theoretical risk against the known and very real risks of a bad dose of Covid.

The risk of 'a bad case of Covid' is absolutely miniscule for people who are not old and/or built like the side of a house. 

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I take it there will be exemptions to the vaccine passport for the Climate Change Conference - surely Sturgeon will not be insisting all visitors, including those from abroad, have a vaccine passport? 
A lot of them will have one right now given plenty countries are currently using them.
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4 minutes ago, TheBruce said:

If it is needed to protect the NHS and reduce the stats, can't see the problem and this was always about protecting the NHS. We are the collateral damage.

The NHS cant cope because it already couldn't cope pre Covid due to mismanagement and under resourcing. It's now worse than before, with no plan to improve it, so something has to give. Fix the NHS and you fix the real problem.

NHS telling us that there are again visiting restrictions and we are still in summer. What you think the scenario will be like come winter? 

Covid is only magnifying a problem that already existed and in all probability more restrictions coming down the pipe come xmas. Politicians and so called exports all sounding the warnings to get our minds used to for what is to come. We might not like it and we'll be left to suck it up.

 

 

Given its limited application, as people have pointed out, how can the introduction of the vaccine passport be expected to have any significant impact on case numbers?

The motivation behind it appears to be a ham fisted effort at pushing the reluctant into being vaccinate as was conceded was the intention with the similar plans in England.

The primary problem for the NHS does not appear to be the absolute numbers of Covid patients they are having to treat but, as you say, total under-resourcing.  Staffing levels and the conditions they are having to work in, and have had to work in over the last 18 months, are a shit show in some places.  Covid has magnified the existing problems of a creaking, overburdened health service but, as responses on this thread have shown, the suggestion of investing to develop the service we need is not too popular if people are going to be hit in their pockets.

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9 minutes ago, TheBruce said:

If it is needed to protect the NHS and reduce the stats, can't see the problem and this was always about protecting the NHS. We are the collateral damage.

The NHS cant cope because it already couldn't cope pre Covid due to mismanagement and under resourcing. It's now worse than before, with no plan to improve it, so something has to give. Fix the NHS and you fix the real problem.

NHS telling us that there are again visiting restrictions and we are still in summer. What you think the scenario will be like come winter? 

Covid is only magnifying a problem that already existed and in all probability more restrictions coming down the pipe come xmas. Politicians and so called exports all sounding the warnings to get our minds used to for what is to come. We might not like it and we'll be left to suck it up.

There is no evidence that a vaccine passport will do anything whatsoever to 'protect the NHS'. 

The government has had the summer to make contingency plans for additional ICU space and get GPs up and running instead of hiding behind their phones. It could also start turfing folk out of A and Es for non-essential treatment - still having the 'Accident' in the term A and E being half the trouble.

It is not the responsibility of the general public to change behaviour because the country's health system is a complete nick and people are not going to buy into this idea for a crisis largely of the government's own (long and short term) making. 

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17 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

A rational person would compare that theoretical risk against the known and very real risks of a bad dose of Covid.

For under 30s, that latter risk is very small. And remember, the JVCI changed its vaccine recommendations based on age risk factors and the liklihood of an adverse event occurring after vaccination.  

Whilst this was in connection with the vaccine that should be given, the JVCI's own data showed that the risk of serious illness in under 30s to be very, very low. Of course that's going to lead to people taking the risk because it's tolerable. 

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9 minutes ago, Michael W said:

For under 30s, that latter risk is very small. And remember, the JVCI changed its vaccine recommendations based on age risk factors and the liklihood of an adverse event occurring after vaccination.  

Whilst this was in connection with the vaccine that should be given, the JVCI's own data showed that the risk of serious illness in under 30s to be very, very low. Of course that's going to lead to people taking the risk because it's tolerable. 

And the JVCI is basing their opinion on the average person in that age group who is overweight and unfit.

The calculation is different for people who exercise regularly.

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40 minutes ago, Left Back said:

Taking any medicine carries a risk to the individual, however small.  There may be larger unknown risks with these vaccines that will only come to light over time.  It does happen occasionally that medicines are approved and later withdrawn when these risks are deemed too great.  
 

Approval is not a 100% guarantee any medicine is safe.  That’s unfortunately the swaying factor for some people.

Wasn't there a stooshie when the vaccines started about young-ish women being worried about vaccination causing blood clots? Didn't someone get a bit narked when it was pointed out that the risks of blood clots for those taking the contraceptive pill were much higher than the risk from vaccination? I'm sure I can remember John Beattie raising it on the Radio news programme one afternoon. 

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2 minutes ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

Wasn't there a stooshie when the vaccines started about young-ish women being worried about vaccination causing blood clots? Didn't someone get a bit narked when it was pointed out that the risks of blood clots for those taking the contraceptive pill were much higher than the risk from vaccination? I'm sure I can remember John Beattie raising it on the Radio news programme one afternoon. 

This happened.  Media sensationalism is another factor that helped put people off the vaccine.  This then gets fuelled by anti-vax nutters on various platforms leading us to where we are today.

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France was about the most anti vax country in Europe. That seems to be changing since they brought in vax certificates.

Quote

 Since the president announced the pass sanitaire at least 7 million French people have been given their first vaccine dose. Currently, 63.5% of the over-12 population has been fully vaccinated and reservations on the central booking system suggest France will have vaccinated 50 million people over the age of 12 with at least one jab by the end of this month.

Polls also suggest 60-70% of French support the health pass

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/08/macron-tells-critics-vaccine-passport-will-protect-all-our-freedoms

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1 hour ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

What do you think it might do to you?

Blood clots and heart inflammation have been recorded but in very few cases. It becomes a numbers game as you go down the age groups. The chances of covid causing serious harm weighed against the chances of the vaccine causing serious harm.

 

I'm double jabbed because I'm 53 and have a blocked artery. I get the flu vaccine every year as well. For me it's a no brainer. For my 11 year old daughter, I'd be more reticent if the JVCI say that she can have one when she reaches her next birthday. 

Not saying I wouldn't get her the vaccine but it's not as cut and dried a decision.

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Getting my second dose of Moderna this afternoon and, with the way things have fallen at work so far, it looks like tomorrow afternoon is going to be my busiest point of the week.

If the side effects smash me then I'm afraid the good people of Dumbarton and the Vale might have to do without a few pages of their local paper :(

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6 minutes ago, Empty It said:
1 hour ago, hk blues said:
OK...let's wait 50 years to see what transpires.  In the meantime...

In the meantime let people make their own mind up on the vaccine instead of trying to ban them from events?

Sure, no problem with folk making personal choices,  Of course, they come with consequences. 

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