Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Left Back]

1 minute ago, ICTChris said:

You know whenever a politician says "this shows why a debate is needed" what they mean is "I'm going to let you complain about it and then do it anyway".  Consultation is a good word used in this approach as well.

What this actually means is “we know we have the numbers to win the vote but we’ll kid on we’re consulting the peoples representatives about it”

[scottsdad]

So the QR code is available from Friday but the debate is next week...Back to front

[craigkillie]

What happens with children? Are they now banned from sporting events?

[Suspect Device]

Was DRoss choking his chicken?

[Dons_1988]

Ms Sturgeon says the government does not believe that certificates should ever be a requirement for key services or in settings where people have no choice over attendance
 

well that’s comforting. 

[Suspect Device]

Just now, scottsdad said:

So the QR code is available from Friday but the debate is next week...Back to front

Not when the outcome of the 'debate' is already decided.

[GiGi]

If you'll be allowed to go on public transport and go to the shops without a vaccine passport, what is the point of vaccine passports? Where do you think people will be before going to football, pubs and gigs - shops and public transport. 

Complete waste of time to cover a small percentage of the population. 

[RiG]

1 minute ago, craigkillie said:

What happens with children? Are they now banned from sporting events?

They "envisage" that children and folk with certain medical conditions will be exempt.

 

[NorthernLights]

7 minutes ago, RiG said:

 

I still don't understand why they don't build the functionality into the "main" app for Scotland including a built in QR reader for checking into restaurants pubs etc. Would make things a lot easier.

I remember the English track and trace tried this and was blocked by Apple and Google as it broke the T&C for using their framework.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-56713017

[scottsdad]

Analysis

Jamie McIvor

BBC Scotland News Correspondent

The number of 18 to 29-year-olds who have had their first jab has scarcely moved for several weeks. More than a quarter of them remain unvaccinated.

It is now reasonable to assume that in nearly all cases this will be because the person has decided against vaccination – not because they have slipped through the net or could not be vaccinated for medical reasons. Drop in centres are open for the unvaccinated across Scotland.

So should persuading more of them to get a jab be about a carrot or a stick?

The carrot could involve communications and marketing targeted towards them. This might deal with the specific concerns some young people may have, address myths and disinformation and stress how vaccinating as many people as possible gives greater protection to the most vulnerable in society.

The stick, of course, is the need for vaccination certification – in other words “vaccine passports” – to attend certain events and venues.

Health professionals and politicians certainly hoped positive messaging and encouragement alone would persuade more people to get vaccinated. Now that certification is firmly on the radar will more young people decide to get jabbed?

 

Hard to disagree with this. It's about forcing vaccinations. 

[superbigal]

4 minutes ago, Paco said:

25% of that age group are unvaccinated, not 49%.

aye sorry mixed up the 1st and 2nd jag shortfalls.

Still about 200,000 youngsters may be chasing a first jag shortly.

[Michael W]

19 minutes ago, scottsdad said:

Could not agree more - but it won't be sold as such. It'll be sold as an alternative to restrictions.

I really don't see how they'll help substantially prevent cases. You'll keep out people that are unvaccinated or not fully-vaccinated (already a minority of the population) AND who have also tested positive on a PCR/LFT, which is a narrower section of the population still. We know that a negative test doesn't mean a person doesn't have it from people submitting negative tests and returning to the UK, only to test positive on the arrival test. Fully-vaxxed people that have caught covid will also be undetected. We remove a small chunk of possibly infectious people and that to me doesn't suggest there is any real gain here and we are as well carrying on without them. 

I'm also worried about scope creep here. You can already see the briefing dribblers readying their questions - "Why do we not need them on trains?"  "I went to a nightclub but sat in a packed pub for hours first. Does the virus differentiate between different premises licences, and if not why don't we need them for pubs too?" 

Moreover, once they are in, we'll see people clutching onto them as a comfort blanket and will really struggle to get rid of them. 

 

Edited September 1, 2021 by Michael W

[Detournement]

2 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

Ms Sturgeon says the government does not believe that certificates should ever be a requirement for key services or in settings where people have no choice over attendance
 

well that’s comforting. 

Not ruling out mandatory for employment then.

[welshbairn]

3 minutes ago, scottsdad said:

So the QR code is available from Friday but the debate is next week...Back to front

Handy for holidays, in places like Germany and Ireland they check your QR code just about every venue. Won't apply in Scotland without parliamentary approval.

Edited September 1, 2021 by welshbairn

[Billy Jean King]

Handy for holidays, in places like Germany and Ireland they check your QR code just about every venue. Won't apply in Scotland without parliamentary approval.

Yes will make going to the countries that require them in almost all settings (France springs to mind) much easier.

[Detournement]

The idea that nightclubs are going to be the big factor in getting 18-29 year olds to be vaccinated makes no sense. The night time economy in Scotland is dead compared to 15-20 years ago it's very much a minority activity now. 

[scottsdad]

Who is this protecting? The 18-29 year old nightclubbers by and large are not at great risk from the virus. They never have been. The old argument about them not catching it and then passing it to kill their grannies has also gone. 

This is just about using power to force people to vaccinate.

[Honest_Man#1]

13 minutes ago, RiG said:

 

I still don't understand why they don't build the functionality into the "main" app for Scotland including a built in QR reader for checking into restaurants pubs etc. Would make things a lot easier.

I’d be furious with this as then it wouldn’t be possible to avoid track and trace check-ins and I assume I wouldn’t be able to turn off the ridiculous bluetooth distance tracker but keep the app solely for certificate purposes?

Separate app required as I do not want the current one on my phone.

[superbigal]

The Danes have developed the QR code thing for us just in time to then pump us in the match tonight.

[The Master]

30 minutes ago, Paco said:

It’s also verging on pointless. Delta has killed the effectiveness of the vaccine passport, back when we thought vaccines were 95% effective against even infection they might’ve had a use (scientifically, not morally). At this stage it’s posturing for the sake of it.

If it is indeed the case that the majority of people in hospital are unvaccinated, then I assume the logic is that by preventing unvaccinated people from entering settings that are ostensibly "high risk", there's less chance of them getting the virus and thus needing hospital treatment. But then that ignores the fact that it's mostly young people that are unvaccinated and also at the least risk of being hospitalised.

For the record, I don't agree with any of this. I'm just trying to understand the logic when vaccination doesn't necessarily prevent infection and transmission. 

Edited September 1, 2021 by The Master