Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Shandon Par]

1 minute ago, bennett said:

 

 

Read that as spunk sanitiser and was like wtf!

 

If only throbber’s parents had had access to some of that.

[beefybake]

57 minutes ago, cyderspaceman said:

Agree with your sentiment but the French and Spanish only did it at the weekend past.  BJ and his crew certainly dithered tho. I wonder how much input Cummings had. We'll never know of course as he's unaccountable.

I think that when figures of £350 Billion are being thrown around to bail out massive businesses that have made huge profits, yet apparently have little cash reserves

to  keep going when trouble strikes, there very definitely is going to be a reckoning for those who got us here. 

In the here and now,

I'm utterly astonished that the government, and the so called medical advisers have sat on their hands, have learned little from the

experiences of other countries, and their actions are completely and utterly reactive, rather than pro-active.

[Detournement]

Which countries do you think we should be learning from?

[dirty dingus]

1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

 

I can console myself knowing my mortgage is paid off though. 

How are you two doing on that score?

 

[jagfox]

18 minutes ago, Detournement said:

It's not just a health crisis though. The economic impact needs to be included as well. 

It's not just about minimising Corona fatalities. 

The thing is things aren't shut down there will be no economy or at best a drastically reduced one.

Just happened on CNBC News. A billionaire investment guy Bill Ackman came up with some points that run true. He seems to have a genuine concern for both the human effects and subsequent economic effects of the virus. 

Basically even with bailouts major corporations can't go much longer than a month or two with no or vastly reduced income..

Hotel and restaurants are already going to the wall. Bailouts for the airline industry will prove fruitless if a shutdown isn't implemented.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/18/watch-the-full-interview-with-bill-ackman-on-the-coranvirus-threat-to-economy-shut-it-down-now.html

Worth a watch, imo.

TL;DR

America needs a 30 day shutdown. Get everyone home. Pay workers for that period. 

Put resources towards testing for the virus and building ventilators.

Like China did lock down, subdue the virus then carefully rebuild. 

Who knows, but it's worth a shot.

 

 

 

[19QOS19]

Which countries do you think we should be learning from?

Are South Korea not dealing with it ok? I haven't looked into it enough but that seems to be what I hear being thrown about.

[D.A.F.C]

21 minutes ago, virginton said:

Oh and if people are really looking for experts instead of ‘armchair epidemiologists’ to criticise what the UK has been doing, then look no further than the editor of The Lancet’s intervention today:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/mar/18/coronavirus-uk-expert-advice-wrong

There has been a lot more where that came from over recent days. Other academics and health experts haven’t been doing that to throw their government colleagues under a bus but because the government’s response to the crisis has been baffling and alarming in equal measure to those who know what they’re talking about as well. 

 

 

 

Looking back in a few weeks the public will be asking why weren’t we locked down like China from the start?

Why not a strategy like this?

From February no more unessential travel. We think the corona virus will turn into an epidemic here and we don’t have the nhs facilities to deal with that.

From Feb all people returning from uk will be put into quarantine for two weeks and tested for the virus.

End of February borders closed. Travel industry workers paid sick leave until crisis is over.

March, anyone who experiences symptoms tested immediately, all mobile contacts, friends and colleagues tested also. Any positive cases and testing spreads out again. 
 

Ok so the travel industry and tourism takes a hit but you’ve just saved thousands of lives and billions of pounds?

Nope, let’s have everyone do whatever they want and then even when Italy goes tits up we will still do the opposite of what every other country does and talk pish about somehow reducing the strain by letting 600,000 people mingle at a racecourse.

Utter utter nonsense. They have lied about all sorts as well. There’s no plan for ventilators or even PPE equipment that’s beyond any real value atm.

I really hope italy is some anomaly because the nhs will be overrun in days unless we go full can’t leave the house type lockdown.

 

[Detournement]

You would still have enough people working and contacts when shopping or making essential that the virus wouldn't would still reside in the population and will spring back up when the month ends. 

[Dee Man]

3 hours ago, Barney Rubble said:

Was informed only an hour ago that the British Embassy has arranged an evacuation flight out of Podgorica to Gatwick tomorrow - which is a huge relief as I'd rather be back home for the reasons stated in my post above. So grateful to the universe for that one. 

Every good wish to all P&B posters that all our families get through this and come out at the other end sane and safe.

 

All?

[Scary Bear]

6 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Which countries do you think we should be learning from?

The ones who don’t have any cases?

Are there still some countries with no cases?

[D.A.F.C]

1 minute ago, 19QOS19 said:

7 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Which countries do you think we should be learning from?

Are South Korea not dealing with it ok? I haven't looked into it enough but that seems to be what I hear being thrown about.

Yes, they did extensive testing. They tested 250,000 early and used mobile phone technology to trace contacts and all the people within a certain radius of each other. They sent texts to them and they were told to isolate and were tested. It’s pretty much shut down there now.

1000 cases to 100.

We are a supposed developed nation but in a lot of ways we are third world. I do believe that there are some amazing scientists and the uk, world leading but I’m astounded we got it so wrong. We should have looked to South Korea and China to see what to do and adapted. 

[Detournement]

The missed opportunity was probably a travel ban in February but that probably wasn't realistic. 

The virus will eventually be in every country.

[marty_j]

I’ve got a solution to panic buying

People just need to stop being c***s

Thing is surely very soon the fucktards that are stocking up are surely going to go “right I’ve got 865 Andrex now and 624 cans of chopped tomatoes I think I’m done”

Utter wankers

[D.A.F.C]

1 minute ago, Detournement said:

The missed opportunity was probably a travel ban in February but that probably wasn't realistic. 

The virus will eventually be in every country.

We will eventually end up isolating and testing but it will take months instead of weeks and the cases will be x10, x100 more than doing nothing.

The uk approach is like saying well there’s kids running across this motorway. We might as well let them all go at once because that will be easier to fix. Hang on no, lots are getting run over. Ok no more running. Yes, this is easier.

[Detournement]

1 minute ago, D.A.F.C said:

Yes, they did extensive testing. They tested 250,000 early and used mobile phone technology to trace contacts and all the people within a certain radius of each other. They sent texts to them and they were told to isolate and were tested. It’s pretty much shut down there now.

1000 cases to 100.

We are a supposed developed nation but in a lot of ways we are third world. I do believe that there are some amazing scientists and the uk, world leading but I’m astounded we got it so wrong. We should have looked to South Korea and China to see what to do and adapted. 

It's not just about reducing cases immediately. It's about minimising deaths without your economy collapsing over the long term. 

It's possible that a vaccine or remedy will be discovered but it's more likely that it will become endemic. 

[PauloPerth]

1 hour ago, BingMcCrosby said:

It's nothing to do with learning a lesson, it's to do with keeping people safe.

If there was a global virus to originate for here I would argue it's the first time it's happened. And we can stop it happening again. How many viruses which have spread overseas have originated in China?

Also I'm happy to hear your opinion

HIV/AIDS originated in Africa, Swine flu originated in USA/ Mexico I believe, one of the Cholera pandemics from India.  I'm not sure, but possibly China being such a vast country is why a couple of these viruses have emerged from there?

The above is just from a brief search, I don't have any additional knowlededge on this.

Its a part of nature that viruses mutate, and periodically ones emerge that are especially harmful to humans.

How we deal with it?  I'm just guessing, but I suppose all we can do is trust the medical and science experts' advice and do as guided/ instructed or the whole gig's fucked and it would rumble on for a long time.  Which it could well do anyway.  What we know now is nothing compared to what we'll know about this virus in even just a month's time, it will change so rapidly.  

You like to think in a generation's time If something like this emerges again, we would be far more open to believing the potential seriousness of the situation.  But I doubt it.  The problem is people won't disrupt their skiing holidays, trips away etc until it's right on their doorstep again.  

You cant really win with this type of situation. If you bring measures in very early and stave it off then everyone complains it was all a fuss about nothing and an overreaction.  Look at swine flu or SARS.. most of us probably just thought of it as affecting people elsewhere and didn't impact on our lives in the slightest.  I know I was in that category, and barely paid attention to it.  If you don't take measures and it hits the population like now, then you get "why didn't they act sooner?"  Lose lose.

[Detournement]

5 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

We will eventually end up isolating and testing but it will take months instead of weeks and the cases will be x10, x100 more than doing nothing.

The uk approach is like saying well there’s kids running across this motorway. We might as well let them all go at once because that will be easier to fix. Hang on no, lots are getting run over. Ok no more running. Yes, this is easier.

Given how many people are apparently symptonless I don't think we will. 

The Dutch are apparently considering the herd immunity approach as well.

[D.A.F.C]

2 minutes ago, Detournement said:

It's not just about reducing cases immediately. It's about minimising deaths without your economy collapsing over the long term. 

It's possible that a vaccine or remedy will be discovered but it's more likely that it will become endemic. 

Economy and health are linked you can’t have a good economy with poor health as we can see already.

Yes, we’ve made lots of money but now we can’t make any more. It’s short sighted and moronic.

[Chewing Taffies]

17 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

23 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Which countries do you think we should be learning from?

Are South Korea not dealing with it ok? I haven't looked into it enough but that seems to be what I hear being thrown about.

Demographic distinctions between countries have to be considered though. From a report I read on CNN:

In Italy, 90% of the more than 1,000 deaths occur in those 70 or older.
By contrast, the outbreak in South Korea has occurred among much younger people. There, only 20% of cases have been diagnosed in those 60 years old and up. The largest affected group is those in their 20s, who account for almost 30% of all cases.

South Korea has an outbreak among youngish, non-smoking women, whereas Italy's disease is occurring among the old and the very old, many of whom are smokers.

[jagfox]

Part of the problem is that it's hard to take the virus seriously up until the last few weeks. 

Happening far away.

Swine flu/ sars didn't really reach these shores to any meaningful degree.

This is what could be behind a lot of governments slow reactions including here.

The US is now talking about a $1Trillion financial stimulus. 

Not sure they're going about it the right way.

Phase 1 seems to be vaccine research

Phase 2 unemployment payments

Phase 3 Business bailouts for all business.