Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Genuine Hibs Fan]

2 minutes ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

You are saying the article is shite because it isn't a science paper. Yet you won't read the science papers that back up the article. I'll link one for you - not published in the lancet

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8238571/

Abstract

We identified seasonal human coronaviruses, influenza viruses and rhinoviruses in the exhaled breath and coughs of children and adults with acute respiratory illness. Surgical face masks significantly reduced detection of influenza virus RNA in respiratory droplets and coronavirus RNA in aerosols, with a marginally significant reduction in coronavirus RNA in respiratory droplets. Our results indicate that surgical facemasks could prevent transmission of human coronaviruses and influenza viruses from symptomatic individuals.

"Could prevent" is not the same as proving they work is it though? 

[Eric's Cantina]

This is not a designated place for dancing , it is a place where people move from one area to another and talk to each other through the medium of dance , therefore we are not a "nightclub" and don't need to obey the passport

 

p

[Left Back]

6 minutes ago, Genuine Hibs Fan said:

"Could prevent" is not the same as proving they work is it though? 

What percentage of the population were cutting about in surgical facemasks that are still unproven to prevent transmission or infection?

My non-peer reviewed unpublished data suggests not many as the overwhelming majority of mask wearers had a piece of non-surgical cloth across their face.

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

1 minute ago, Left Back said:

What percentage of the population were cutting about in surgical facemasks that are still unproven to prevent transmission or infection?

My non-peer reviewed unpublished data suggests not many as the overwhelming majority of mask wearers had a piece of non-surgical cloth across their face.

 

I will also take "we used shite masks" as an asnwer to why mask policies have not worked in Britain and why they have worked in South Korea and China.

[Left Back]

2 minutes ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

 

I will also take "we used shite masks" as an asnwer to why mask policies have not worked in Britain and why they have worked in South Korea and China.

That isn’t what I said though is it?  You’re putting 2+2 together and making 5 again.

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

7 minutes ago, Left Back said:

That isn’t what I said though is it?  You’re putting 2+2 together and making 5 again.

Not really. Although i think it has been proven that cloth face coverings have an effectiveness of around 50% of that of surgical masks

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7435473/

In asia they typically wear surgical style masks, where as cloth masks are more common in britain due to ppe/supply issues where these types of masks were directed towards medical workers.

[Left Back]

6 minutes ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

Not really. Although i think it has been proven that cloth face coverings have an effectiveness of around 50% of that of surgical masks

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7435473/

In asia they typically wear surgical style masks, where as cloth masks are more common in britain due to ppe/supply issues where these types of masks were directed towards medical workers.

It hasn’t been proven at all and any suggestion otherwise is nonsense.

Have you bought shares in a mask company today?  Is that why you’re suddenly all over the thread pushing this point?

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

2 minutes ago, Left Back said:

It hasn’t been proven at all and any suggestion otherwise is nonsense.

Have you bought shares in a mask company today?  Is that why you’re suddenly all over the thread pushing this point?

Did you read the article?

[craigkillie]

53 minutes ago, Monkey Tennis said:

Thanks.

That actually confirms some of my suspicions/prejudices.

I think I'm frustrated by the fact that there doesn't seem to be much pressure to offer something better.  I obviously recognise that schools were required to get back to something like normal much earlier, because their social role, not least in terms of childcare, is very different from that of universities.  There are some parallels in their function, however, and universities ought to be easier environments to control. 

I saw something about English universities now being required to offer a fuller experience, yet ours still seem able to behave, as you say, as if we're at a much earlier stage of the entire pandemic.

Do you see the picture changing much anytime soon?  What do you think would be needed to bring that about?  Who should I complain to, apart from helpful types on a football forum?

I think the likelihood of it changing will basically centre around the Scottish Government's policies going forward. If they hold their nerve and don't bring back restrictions over the winter, I'd hope and expect something much closer to normality in Semester 2, since you'd hope there would be no need for distancing at that stage and therefore room capacities and usage could go back to normal.

I think there are four main routes of complaint here. There are the two student bodies - The National Union of Students and Glasgow's Student Representative Council - and then there's also direct contact with the relevant person within her school (the Class Head and/or Head of School) or possibly even directly to someone senior within the university, most likely the Dean of Learning and Teaching. I wouldn't say any of those will specifically make a difference right now but I always think even making people justify their decision can help them think twice next time.

[GTee]

2 hours ago, virginton said:

1) 'Masks' are not the same as keeping a grotty unwashed 'face covering' around for four months at a time, which has been actual practice in the UK.

2) China's success has got much more to do with welding infected folk into their apartment blocks than making them wear a mask. 

3) The face covering requirement has completely failed to stop three additional waves in Scotland, while the reckless Tory decision to bin that requirement resulted in no such recent wave.

4) None of this fucking matters anyway because we are falling over stacks of highly effective vaccines. 

Were you not championing masks in the early days? Canna mind.

[Detournement]

7 hours ago, Jim McLean's Ghost said:

You are saying the article is shite because it isn't a science paper. Yet you won't read the science papers that back up the article. I'll link one for you - not published in the lancet

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8238571/

Abstract

We identified seasonal human coronaviruses, influenza viruses and rhinoviruses in the exhaled breath and coughs of children and adults with acute respiratory illness. Surgical face masks significantly reduced detection of influenza virus RNA in respiratory droplets and coronavirus RNA in aerosols, with a marginally significant reduction in coronavirus RNA in respiratory droplets. Our results indicate that surgical facemasks could prevent transmission of human coronaviruses and influenza viruses from symptomatic individuals.

No one is wearing surgical facemasks in public and even if there was mass uptake and proper use of surgical facemasks it would only be a marginal benefit according to the study. 

Face mask wearing as practiced in the UK for the past 14 months is utterly pointless 

[Monkey Tennis]

7 hours ago, craigkillie said:

 

I think there are four main routes of complaint here. There are the two student bodies - The National Union of Students and Glasgow's Student Representative Council - and then there's also direct contact with the relevant person within her school (the Class Head and/or Head of School) or possibly even directly to someone senior within the university, most likely the Dean of Learning and Teaching. I wouldn't say any of those will specifically make a difference right now but I always think even making people justify their decision can help them think twice next time.

Thanks again.  Yes, that's pretty much my thinking.  I wouldn't imagine that my grumbling would alter anything.  I am keen to read a justification for how things are operating though. 

[superbigal]

Thanks again.  Yes, that's pretty much my thinking.  I wouldn't imagine that my grumbling would alter anything.  I am keen to read a justification for how things are operating though. 

Going back to March 2020. My company works in a university owned building. The university literally jumped overboard like on the titanic.
Did not see a cleaner for weeks as work in the real world continued.
They came out of hiding after about 2 months to enter our building and put some signs up, tape down and install hand sanitisers with no sanitiser.
I think they have behaved in general in more fear than GPs, and that is saying something.
The staff loved it because they were mainly furloughed but upped to full 100% pay.
Before the recent rule changes around contacts being able to work after a test. The university would send anyone home for 10 days who was anywhere near a covid case. Again lovely 100% pay so the staff loved it.
The unis should not plead poverty ever again.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

6 hours ago, oaksoft said:

@Jim McLean's Ghost is having a fucking nightmare tonight.

He's not even reading the shite he's posting but demanding other do.

When one person points a flaw in the article he posted, he simply posts another one which also doesn't prove his point.

I especially liked the idea that if an article is published in the Lancet then it constitutes "good science". That was hilarious.

I'm sure those who remember the MMR debacle will similarly laugh at this suggestion.

Yep, because the whole MMR shitshow was fucking hilarious.

Maybe read your posts with another's eyes before hitting "submit"..

[SlipperyP]

Today is the day. watches lookin the time as come

Posters to watch out on this thread...because.. they are lunatics

@Todd_is_God

@Left Back

@oaksoft

@Detournement

@Elixir

Personally  feel sorry you can PM me for more details

 

[mizfit]

Email went out from my work last Monday declaring English based colleagues would be returning to the office for a minimal of 3 days.

Shit has hit the fan.

[vikingTON]

9 hours ago, Monkey Tennis said:

Yes, some of that can happen, but there's no question at all that such relationships are much better able to become established and then flourish if people are in close, regular contact in the first place.

That you don't recognise this should perhaps not constitute a surprise.

That you don't recognise that the fourth wave of a respiratory virus pandemic might temporarily curtail such close, regular contact for your precious wee flower is beyond me in terms of entitlement. 

[ICTChris]

I don’t really have any evidential basis for saying this but it seems to me that the return to normality is staggered depending on industry.

I remember during the March-April lockdown going past the builder merchants in Wester Hailes and it was literally queued out the door with tradesmen and builders.  These guys have probably worked as normal pretty much 100% of the time.

[vikingTON]

8 hours ago, GTee said:

Were you not championing masks in the early days? Canna mind.

Masks were a reasonable, largely cost-free intervention to use in the absence of effective treatments. We now have stacks of effective treatments though, so we can bin mandatory face covering policies for having no further value. 

If individuals want to continue mask wearing as a form of protection, then they should be free to do so. A set of properly fitting N95/FFP3 masks and safety goggles should do the job for them. What they do not get to do is oblige everyone else to make the same choice indefinitely in a free society. 

[craigkillie]

1 hour ago, superbigal said:

Going back to March 2020. My company works in a university owned building. The university literally jumped overboard like on the titanic.
Did not see a cleaner for weeks as work in the real world continued.
They came out of hiding after about 2 months to enter our building and put some signs up, tape down and install hand sanitisers with no sanitiser.
I think they have behaved in general in more fear than GPs, and that is saying something.
The staff loved it because they were mainly furloughed but upped to full 100% pay.
Before the recent rule changes around contacts being able to work after a test. The university would send anyone home for 10 days who was anywhere near a covid case. Again lovely 100% pay so the staff loved it.
The unis should not plead poverty ever again.
 

 

I'm not sure exactly what type of university building you work in, but very few university staff have been furloughed over the pandemic - it has mainly only been people whose personal circumstances didn't allow them to work from home and people whose jobs were non-essential but couldn't be done from home. From March-May 2020, everyone who could was asked to work from home, that was literally the government advice, so I'm not sure what your imaginary "real world" consisted of here.