Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[harlowspider]

I had AZ. Knocked me flat the next day, aching all over, sore arm. OK now.

[Salvo Montalbano]

Fife using AZ. 
Both parents had it last week. Soldiers administering it, running like clockwork at east end park.

They might be using AstraZenica at EEP, but my parents got the Pfizer at the Lochgelly Centre. My pal with Crohn's got Pfizer as well. Didn't realise he was so high on the list.

[Left Back]

15 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

I still think a lot of the vaccine rhetoric was assumption although it's not hard to see why given the triumphal way it was (rightly from a purely scientific achievement point of view) announced.

All the "back to full normality" talk from the unqualified media and the likes of the ERG basically drowned out the more cautious words from the medical fraternity. It's human nature in a situation like this to basically hear what you want amongst all the noise.

Vaccines are still the only end game but it's clearly going to be nowhere near as quick as everyone hoped or dreamt. It might yet accelerate hugely come the Spring but again building your hope's up that this will happen is only going to lead to even more angst and frustration if that doesn't happen. The media swings wildly from hope to despair on the tiniest snippets of news either positive or negative. That really isn't helping.

OK Nicola.  That’s plenty.

[Jambomo]

17 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

I still think a lot of the vaccine rhetoric was assumption although it's not hard to see why given the triumphal way it was (rightly from a purely scientific achievement point of view) announced.

All the "back to full normality" talk from the unqualified media and the likes of the ERG basically drowned out the more cautious words from the medical fraternity. It's human nature in a situation like this to basically hear what you want amongst all the noise.

Vaccines are still the only end game but it's clearly going to be nowhere near as quick as everyone hoped or dreamt. It might yet accelerate hugely come the Spring but again building your hope's up that this will happen is only going to lead to even more angst and frustration if that doesn't happen. The media swings wildly from hope to despair on the tiniest snippets of news either positive or negative. That really isn't helping.

It goes back to what was said on here a few days ago about expectations. On that Twitter page link, one comment is “What’s the point (in lockdown)  if circa 16m people have been vaccinated?” 

England has a population of 60m, what the f**k are they expecting with only 16m people done?  

The vaccine is the way out but it baffles me that people don’t seem to understand that you actually have to give people the vaccine first, then you go back to normal, not the other way around. 

[vikingTON]

28 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

It goes back to what was said on here a few days ago about expectations. On that Twitter page link, one comment is “What’s the point (in lockdown)  if circa 16m people have been vaccinated?” 

England has a population of 60m, what the f**k are they expecting with only 16m people done?  

The vaccine is the way out but it baffles me that people don’t seem to understand that you actually have to give people the vaccine first, then you go back to normal, not the other way around. 

Why would you need to vaccinate 60 million people in England to go back to normal? The virus is harmless in the overwhelming majority of cases among the healthy population (including children who cannot currently receive vaccines). These cases therefore produce no burden on the health service, which is the only legitimate grounds for restrictions.

It is not the job of the entire population to sit on their hands all year because ~5% of a vulnerable group might get exposed to the virus and a tiny fraction of those might end up seriously ill. That is not a rational calculation of costs and benefits, which is why we don't do this for the flu for four months every year. 

So long as vaccines drive down ICU cases - which they undoubtedly will - then that is the grounds to open up. That is the only criteria that counts now.

Edited February 17, 2021 by vikingTON

[Todd_is_God]

30 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

It goes back to what was said on here a few days ago about expectations. On that Twitter page link, one comment is “What’s the point (in lockdown)  if circa 16m people have been vaccinated?” 

England has a population of 60m, what the f**k are they expecting with only 16m people done?  

The vaccine is the way out but it baffles me that people don’t seem to understand that you actually have to give people the vaccine first, then you go back to normal, not the other way around. 

The UK has vaccinated just under 25% of the population in really the best part of 8 weeks. In Scotland we spent around 2 weeks averaging over 1% of our population a day, and will be back at that level in around a month, with no more supply reductions forecast.

I think people are right to expect a little more than "maybe as good as last summer" by July tbh, especially considering that was achieved without vaccines, and with a much lower level of immunity by virtue of infections.

The SG are going to look incredibly daft if they (wisely) adopt a data rather than date led approach, but then baulk at easing restrictions when daily infections once again hit single figures.

The "longer lockdown to get greater normality for longer" line won't fly this time, not only because the population will be heavily vaccinated by then, but also because it simply didn't make any difference last year.

Edited February 17, 2021 by Todd_is_God

[Theroadlesstravelled]

30 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

It goes back to what was said on here a few days ago about expectations. On that Twitter page link, one comment is “What’s the point (in lockdown)  if circa 16m people have been vaccinated?” 

England has a population of 60m, what the f**k are they expecting with only 16m people done?  

The vaccine is the way out but it baffles me that people don’t seem to understand that you actually have to give people the vaccine first, then you go back to normal, not the other way around. 

Also one shot isn't vaccinated.

 

[vikingTON]

On a side note, I see that the MD column in Private Eye now argues that:

Quote

Tests should be easily available for anyone with a newly runny or blocked nose, sore throat, headaches, muscle pains, fatigue and headache, in addition to a cough, high temperature and changes in taste and smell. 

So much for the 'lol you don't get a runny nose with Covid' hot take' going around on the thread a while ago. Not substantially different from the symptoms actually posted within Gartnavel when I was there at the beginning of January either. 

The original main symptoms list was always back of a fag packet stuff so expanding this to catch more genuinely infected people is fine, and much better than just chucking random tests at people and generating false positives. Good luck getting the weans back in school full time while testing all those real symptoms though!

Edited February 17, 2021 by vikingTON

[Todd_is_God]

2 minutes ago, Theroadlesstravelled said:

Also one shot isn't vaccinated.

One shot provides over 70% protection.

If that isn't enough to be considered vaccinated, then no one has ever been vaccinated against flu.

[ICTChris]

 

[vikingTON]

Just now, Todd_is_God said:

One shot provides over 70% protection.

If that isn't enough to be considered vaccinated, then no one has ever been vaccinated against flu.

The goalpost-shifting exercise from zero-Covid knicker-wetters about vaccines has been even more remarkable than the scientific effort of producing them. Sitting around right now, waiting to punch the air in delight at news of a single biddy popping their clogs between vaccine doses to 'prove' that we must keep inventing our own sunshine instead. 

Imagine the government and public health hysteria if this had turned into an HIV-level flop for vaccine production. Oh wait, it would probably be exactly the same as it is now!

[Todd_is_God]

2 minutes ago, ICTChris said:

 

How do they calculate this? I've bought relatively little alcohol from shops, but have bought a lot from online retailers such as beersofeurope, beer hawk and beer wulf.

With the explosion of home beer dispensers over the last year, looking at physical supermarket and off-licence sales won't tell the full story.

[Am Featha Taigh Nan Clach]

13 minutes ago, ICTChris said:

 

I did my bit to keep alcohol sales high.

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

Snippy parents thinking that the school gates somehow provide them with the same magical immunity that their kids also get from being on school property.

#truncheons2faces

[Paco]

The SG are going to look incredibly daft if they (wisely) adopt a data rather than date led approach, but then baulk at easing restrictions when daily infections once again hit single figures.

I think you’re being very presumptuous to think cases will go to single figures to be honest. I’m almost 100% sure they won’t, for a range of reasons - testing levels being a major one, but also because last year we locked down from March until late June, where we emerged into the summer months having had virtually all workplaces, building sites, tradesmen and especially schools all at home for that entire time. That isn’t the case this time, and then you throw in the new variant and population fatigue which won’t help either.

I don’t think we’re going to go significantly lower than current levels until the vaccines start having a wider impact. But, some time in the next few months we’re going to need to pivot from obsessing over case numbers to not caring too much, provided far fewer people are showing up at hospital.

[Steven W]

2 minutes ago, Paco said:

 

I think you’re being very presumptuous to think cases will go to single figures to be honest. I’m almost 100% sure they won’t, for a range of reasons - testing levels being a major one, but also because last year we locked down from March until late June, where we emerged into the summer months having had virtually all workplaces, building sites, tradesmen and especially schools all at home for that entire time. That isn’t the case this time, and then you throw in the new variant and population fatigue which won’t help either.

I don’t think we’re going to go significantly lower than current levels until the vaccines start having a wider impact. But, some time in the next few months we’re going to need to pivot from obsessing over case numbers to not caring too much, provided far fewer people are showing up at hospital.

 

Spot on.

Yesterday's infection numbers are testament to this lockdown being half arsed. But you're quite correct - and @Todd_is_God said it a couple of weeks ago now, new case numbers will become irrelevant at some stage. Or at least they certainly should

[Have some faith in Magic]

A panel of 19 members of the public have decided that elimination of covid is the target as part of a covid holyrood panel. 

Advice by Jason and Devi to the panel and they concluded that elimination was the way forward after spending four Saturdays in January with them. 

All 19 were unanimous in their opinion, so that sounds like a balanced panel. 

 

 

[Marshmallo]

Makes sense to me to have 19 unelected people with zero expertise advising the government on their response to a deadly pandemic which has crippled the economy and everyone's quality of life.

[superbigal]

The last time the Schools went back. There was a surge in tests due to Mumsies worried about the sniffles. Remember that week people getting sent to Inverness for tests due to demand.
As it turned out in Fife there were Zero positive cases.
So providing there are test resources this time around the sniffles could be added. Whether worthwhile or not I am less sure based on that previous week.

[Dons_1988]

20 minutes ago, Have some faith in Magic said:

A panel of 19 members of the public have decided that elimination of covid is the target as part of a covid holyrood panel. 

Advice by Jason and Devi to the panel and they concluded that elimination was the way forward after spending four Saturdays in January with them. 

All 19 were unanimous in their opinion, so that sounds like a balanced panel. 

 

 

Also reported as 'the public's view' on what the strategy should be.