Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Steven W]

3 hours ago, HibsFan said:

I think it’s really important, going back to the discussion of a couple pages ago that I can’t be bothered quoting, that when the hopeful progression down the tiers comes this spring and/or summer, we don’t settle for tier 2 or 3 as if they’re a great compromise that we should be grateful for.

If you were to wake up, forget this last year had happened and find out those restrictions, you’d be utterly horrified by them and how everyone’s happily gone along with it. Now, we all (give or take) agree that they were a necessary sacrifice to be made in a pandemic without a vaccine context, but now we have a vaccine that will - hopefully by the end of spring - have seen all of our vulnerable and elderly citizens protected, there should be absolutely no accepting of tier 1, 2 or 3 as any kind of new normal.

Phrases like “post-COVID life” are giving me the absolute fucking fear at the minute, I won’t lie. It’s made me, a lifelong socialist, resort to the hope that rampant capitalism’s going to go “f**k your health concerns we’re back with a bang”, reopen every airline, business and entertainment venue, and kick these zero Covid weirdos into the long grass, where they rightly belong.

The tiers are a means to an end, and that end is normal life (February 2020 style) returning to us ASAP. They are not the new normal and none of us should accept them as so beyond this summer at the very latest.

Agreed wholeheartedly.

Wasn't the tier system for use without a viable vaccine? Yet you don't get the feeling it'll be dropped anytime this year.

[Alert Mongoose]

3 hours ago, HibsFan said:

I think it’s really important, going back to the discussion of a couple pages ago that I can’t be bothered quoting, that when the hopeful progression down the tiers comes this spring and/or summer, we don’t settle for tier 2 or 3 as if they’re a great compromise that we should be grateful for.

If you were to wake up, forget this last year had happened and find out those restrictions, you’d be utterly horrified by them and how everyone’s happily gone along with it. Now, we all (give or take) agree that they were a necessary sacrifice to be made in a pandemic without a vaccine context, but now we have a vaccine that will - hopefully by the end of spring - have seen all of our vulnerable and elderly citizens protected, there should be absolutely no accepting of tier 1, 2 or 3 as any kind of new normal.

Phrases like “post-COVID life” are giving me the absolute fucking fear at the minute, I won’t lie. It’s made me, a lifelong socialist, resort to the hope that rampant capitalism’s going to go “f**k your health concerns we’re back with a bang”, reopen every airline, business and entertainment venue, and kick these zero Covid weirdos into the long grass, where they rightly belong.

The tiers are a means to an end, and that end is normal life (February 2020 style) returning to us ASAP. They are not the new normal and none of us should accept them as so beyond this summer at the very latest.

That’s all well and good but this could and should have been the opportunity to address climate change concerns which will necessitate a change to the way we live.  I’m not advocating using that as an excuse for those overly conservative on Covid-19 health concerns just that I can’t see a better chance to do something about it.

[Stellaboz]

1 hour ago, Alert Mongoose said:

That’s all well and good but this could and should have been the opportunity to address climate change concerns which will necessitate a change to the way we live.  I’m not advocating using that as an excuse for those overly conservative on Covid-19 health concerns just that I can’t see a better chance to do something about it.

Absolutely this. We've totally fucked it now, there was a glimmer of hope but it wasn't taken up. The absolute necessity of reducing our carbon dump into our atmosphere (that protects us from dying quite simply) has been completely ignored on the global scale. All anyone seems to care about is what Trump has tweeted next and if the pubs are open. If that's the attitude then we deserve to die off ASAP.

[dirty dingus]

I think they are giving a worse case senario with all this pish about it being full on restrictions and no travel. There is no way folk are going to stay locked in their houses when the weather gets good. Weans wil be having huge illegal raves up the hills or at the beach, public parks and beauty spots will be heaving. I think once they start getting the jagging numbers right up they will introduce a reciprocal document for traveling corridors after a clear pcr test. Too much money in tourism and travel to watch it go tits up.

 

edit -  SAGA getting the ball rolling  with vaccine friendly cruises

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jan/20/saga-cruise-passengers-coronavirus-vaccine-uk-tour-operator-travel

Edited January 21, 2021 by dirty dingus

[madwullie]

Are we being particularly conservative with this type of chat here, or are other countries also warning people that the vaccine doesn't necessarily mean restrictions are over as quickly as they'd like? I've not seen much (if any) reporting of this from elsewhere. 

I have seen health experts and epidemiologists express concern about it, but then that's their job - they're always going to be ultra cautious imo - the question is if those who make these decisions think the same way too. 

[Billy Jean King]

No offence intended to anyone, but Saltcoats is a shithole IMVVHO

And its sandwiched between Ardrossan and Stevenston !!!

[Steven W]

29 minutes ago, Stellaboz said:

Absolutely this. We've totally fucked it now, there was a glimmer of hope but it wasn't taken up. The absolute necessity of reducing our carbon dump into our atmosphere (that protects us from dying quite simply) has been completely ignored on the global scale. All anyone seems to care about is what Trump has tweeted next and if the pubs are open. If that's the attitude then we deserve to die off ASAP.

Frequent business travel (which I've always thought a bit of an oddity. People who do it moan like hell about it, but are never short in telling about their latest trip or 'checking in' on social media at an airport) is dead in the water. So they're should be a few less planes in the air.  

[budmiester1]

10 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

6 hours ago, Scotty Tunbridge said:

No offence intended to anyone, but Saltcoats is a shithole IMVVHO

And its sandwiched between Ardrossan and Stevenston !!!

Ah the “Three toons” currently the site of the British Army’s post nuclear war training facility I used to work in that area and it’s full of mutants.

[Stellaboz]

10 minutes ago, Steven W said:

Frequent business travel (which I've always thought a bit of an oddity. People who do it moan like hell about it, but are never short in telling about their latest trip or 'checking in' on social media at an airport) is dead in the water. So they're should be a few less planes in the air.  

Won't make a dent in the great scheme of things. Major change is needed across a wide variety of issues. 

[Steven W]

2 minutes ago, Stellaboz said:

Won't make a dent in the great scheme of things. Major change is needed across a wide variety of issues. 

No it won't. But a step in the right direction

[101]

44 minutes ago, Stellaboz said:

Absolutely this. We've totally fucked it now, there was a glimmer of hope but it wasn't taken up. The absolute necessity of reducing our carbon dump into our atmosphere (that protects us from dying quite simply) has been completely ignored on the global scale. All anyone seems to care about is what Trump has tweeted next and if the pubs are open. If that's the attitude then we deserve to die off ASAP.

I agree the clamour to return to how things were is odd. The world has changed and using 2019 as a yard stick will disappoint a lot of people. Why would anyone want to go back to working in an office or set hours even people who have been furloughed might think they can get by working 4 days a week giving them much more time to enjoy life.

Let's not go back to how things were we need to go forward clean up wet markets, ramp up lab produced meat, tackle inequalities, fund the NHS and generally make sure that when the next pandemic hits we are better prepared whilst reducing the chances of it happening.

[renton]

3 minutes ago, Steven W said:

No it won't. But a step in the right direction

They reckoned at the height of the spring 2020 lockdown that emissions were down about 25% over the previous year.  That was with, in the West, all but air freight grounded, and practically zero commuter traffic or office use. Just gives you an idea of how deep changes have to go to decarbonise society enough to get climate change under control while allowing some variation of normal life.

Edited January 21, 2021 by renton

[Dons_1988]

1 minute ago, 101 said:

I agree the clamour to return to how things were is odd. The world has changed and using 2019 as a yard stick will disappoint a lot of people. Why would anyone want to go back to working in an office or set hours even people who have been furloughed might think they can get by working 4 days a week giving them much more time to enjoy life.

Let's not go back to how things were we need to go forward clean up wet markets, ramp up lab produced meat, tackle inequalities, fund the NHS and generally make sure that when the next pandemic hits we are better prepared whilst reducing the chances of it happening.

For the vast majority of people 'returning to normal' means not having the state dictate when you can leave your home or who you can see, not exactly replicating the day to day of life from 18 months ago.

[SlipperyP]

Serious question.

Has anyone in the media in the UK asked the question to Government(s). Why are so many people dead in the UK compared to rest of the world?  What the f**k is happening?

[101]

Just now, Dons_1988 said:

For the vast majority of people 'returning to normal' means not having the state dictate when you can leave your home or who you can see, not exactly replicating the day to day of life from 18 months ago.

Why not say that then? I have seen a lot of people on here and in the press say they want life to "go back to how it was" which is utterly baffling.

[Donathan]

Devi Sridhar on GMB this morning to discuss Trump/Biden and not the pandemic. She’s clearly just becoming a media talking head now.

[Dons_1988]

1 minute ago, 101 said:

Why not say that then? I have seen a lot of people on here and in the press say they want life to "go back to how it was" which is utterly baffling.

I mean, we could get into a philosophical debate about what 'normal' is but pre-pandemic my working patterns had changed quite a bit from what they were when I left uni in 2010, in fact they changed several times over that period. 

The world has changed from Covid, much like it's changed several times in the past from other external events. The phrase going back to normal doesn't remove the power to shape a different future for ourselves. 

 

[TheScarf]

12 hours ago, Ron Aldo said:

Don't know about anyone else but international travel is pretty far down my list of priorities for the summer.

I've had summers with no holidays before and I'd happily do the same this year if it meant I could meet my pals in the pub for a pint or go for a haircut without wondering whether it'll be my last for 6 months.

That's exactly how I feel.  Going abroad for a holiday doesn't even enter my head.  It's being able to go to the football on a Saturday, few pints before, watch The Caley lose to Arbroath, then a few pints after.

[Michael W]

Yes, astonishing how people would like to get back to normal life when we're not allowed to leave our homes except for 'essential purposes' , get fined a few hundred quid if a police officer deems we've strayed too far from home, are required to wear a piece of fabric over our faces to go and buy things at the supermarket, are forbidden from leaving the country for a holiday and any form of indoor entertainment/hospitality is closed. It is also winter with many cold and miserable days and we are also forbidden from seeing friends/family in an indoor with limited exceptions. 

This isn't life - it's fucking shite. 

Edited January 21, 2021 by Michael W
Typos

[101]

2 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

I mean, we could get into a philosophical debate about what 'normal' is but pre-pandemic my working patterns had changed quite a bit from what they were when I left uni in 2010, in fact they changed several times over that period. 

The world has changed from Covid, much like it's changed several times in the past from other external events. The phrase going back to normal doesn't remove the power to shape a different future for ourselves. 

But I would assume you never saw such rapid change and across all sectors.

It's time to take just about everything we did before the pandemic hold it up and say was this really the best way to do things. It's time to ramp up change not slow it down.