Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[yoda]

35 minutes ago, Todd_is_God said:

There are some wild timeframes being pulled out of arseholes all over and paraded as fact. "Peak in 12 weeks" being the latest. On Monday the graph from Downing Street showed an unchecked peak in April, and a flattened peak in early May. Now, 3 days later, its the end of June?

Globally, approximately 389,000 deaths a year are caused by seasonal flu (with the upper range around 500,000).

YTD there have been 10,000 deaths from Covid-19, and we are rapidly approaching 25% of the way through the year.

How close to 389,000 / 500,000 deaths do you think we will see before the year end, and how far above 500,000 would we have to reach to not consider everything that is going on an over-reaction?

There is little point in discussing mortality rates as the number of infected is unknown. The current rate of 4% is higher than reality.

https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2020/3/18/21184992/coronavirus-covid-19-flu-comparison-chart

[DA Baracus]

Really unsure how folk still aren't getting this.

It's not about you catching the virus and being ok after a week or so. It's about loads of folk getting it at the same time, and the exponential spread of it.

When we have loads of folk out of commission with the virus, even if they get better (and the vast majority will), the effects of that are wide ranging and lead on to more problems. It's a domino effect.

This is about not overwhelming the NHS. They don't have the resources to cope with huge numbers getting it at the same time. This will lead to an unmanageable strain on resources. Front line staff will be fucked. Patients will die because they are not enough staff and resources to go round when huge numbers are taken ill at the same time, and for a sustained period. There will be people dying from preventable causes simply because there are not enough doctors, equipment, drugs and other resources. They won't be prioritised. This has already happened in Italy.

This is about the economy. I'm not one for preserving the shit version where the folk at the top take the vast majority for themselves and f**k the rest. I'm on about the economy at all levels. Local economies will have to lose business, but the quicker we can stop the spread of the virus the less they suffer. Think of your favourite local shop, butcher, baker, pub etc.

This is about jobs. People are already losing them and more pay offs or outright termination of employment will happen. But again, the quicker we can reduce the spread of the virus the better chance some businesses have of staying open or the better chance they have of not losing as much of their business or not having to downscale etc. That means less people will lose their jobs and potentially could mean more companies being in a position to hire people sooner. This also means folk have more disposal income quicker.

This is about schools and education. Kids are in a tough position because of this and are having exams cancelled. It must be a really scary and uncertain time for them. The won't get the same level of education from online plans that they would in a class. Colleges and universities are the same. Then there's the issue of parents having to take time off to look after their kids. This will cost people their jobs, and they can't think of getting back in to employment until the situation is resolved. This will seriously f**k a lot of people up in a lot of ways, ranging from financial to mental, and that will hurt their kids too.

We need to be thinking longer term in how we act now. Think of the consequences of what you're doing. You might get the virus and be fine. But you're then spreading it (in the 5 or however many days you have it before you feel the symptoms). And you'll spread it to folk who spread it to folk etc etc. Is that worth it for a cup of coffee or a pint?

The government should be ordering a mass closure of things. If the fucking army need to be deployed in some areas (obviously select areas since they can't begin to cover even half of areas in the country) then so be it. Maybe they should be stationed at big supermarkets and told to shoot panic buyers and hoarders on sight.

 

Also stop with the bullshit rumours.

Stop posting bullshit rumours that you heard from someone who heard from someone you utter c***s.

You're not helping anyone you attention seeking p***ks. You're actively stirring up panic and fear. Have a fucking thought for other people for once you self centred tossers.

Here's one I can put to bed (before I myself go to bed): there will be new doctors coming in, i.e. Year 5 medical students will be graduating this year. I know this because of where I work and what I do as my job. No chance I'm expanding on that though.

[welshbairn]

8 minutes ago, oaksoft said:

Who do you think touched the food vulnerable people are still having to eat? The virus can still easily get to them through the postie, friends helping them by getting food shopping and a multitude of other ways.

Quote

4.9 Post, packages, take-away food
The virus does not survive well for long periods outside the body and so it is highly unlikely that COVID-19 can be spread through post or packages.

It is highly unlikely that COVID-19 can be spread through food.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/novel-coronavirus-2019-ncov-guidance-to-assist-professionals-in-advising-the-general-public/guidance-to-assist-professionals-in-advising-the-general-public

[welshbairn]

1 minute ago, oaksoft said:

Click on this link you have provided and tell us what you see.

I'll wait here.

Go on. It'll take only a second.

Why, do you have more scare stories to spread?

[tamthebam]

1 hour ago, Ludo*1 said:

Anyone at the point where they need to wipe their arse with a towel or a newspaper yet? (Or just shower)

See, you still need print media, folks. Wiping your arse with a mobile phone doesn't work ..

[red23]

49 minutes ago, sparky88 said:

....and it increasingly isn't. A massive part of Wuhan's success in halting COViD 19 is coordinated use of online delivery of groceries 

10 tins of bat soup?

[welshbairn]

1 minute ago, oaksoft said:

You are posting out of date and withdrawn advice notices. You clearly didn't even bother reading it before posting the link.

Do you have any other smart arse comments to make?

Here's updated advice. It's identical. Stop spreading scare stories.

Quote

It's very unlikely it can be spread through things like packages or food.

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/

[Guest JTS98]

6 hours ago, GordonS said:

I've definitely seen a lot more comment about mosques than churches.

Since SARS a lot of South East Asian countries have been very firm on disease control - look at Singapore, for instance. And the health minister of Thailand was raging about western tourists not following the guidance.

Are we much better? I took the kids up to the swimming last night (hands washed before going, shower before coming home), the gym was busy and there were dance classes on. 

I imagine that while we're posting pics of mosques, they're posting pics of our supermarket shelves...

I think the instances I'm talking about are to do with scale.

This isn't just people being around each other. These are two events with tens of thousands of people each, sitting together side by side all day, sharing food together, sleeping next to each other in tents. And then they go back to their own countries in their hundreds. It's pretty much worst-case.

It led to a spike in Malaysia, but also cases in Bahrain, Cambodia, Macau and the Middle East. It is known that a large group from Myanmar were also there, and the maths says some of them probably got it, but of course the Myanmar government says they are protected by their diet and lifestyle. All good.

The astonishing thing was that the results of the first one were so bad and so widely known, and then they did the second one anyway. 'We are more afraid of God'. Even yesterday the polis (that's actually what they're called) in Malaysia arrested people for gathering in mosques.

I think the cultural set-up in the UK perhaps explains why mosques get more attention than churches, but it should be pointed out that mosques are taking a kicking in Malaysia's officially pro-Islam (this is an officially Islamic country) media. What happened here and in Indonesia was beyond stupid.

ETA: Reading this morning that the Indonesians finally seem to have seen sense and broken up the event and quarantined at least some of those present. Nearly 10,000 were there for days before the event was meant to start. Let's hope we get away with this one.

Edited March 20, 2020 by JTS98

[NotThePars]

Choosing to believe @DA Baracus has been living a Naked Rambler esque nomadic lifestyle the past 4 months and has now been forced back on to this hellsite because of Covid-19. Not reading corrections to this head canon, sorry.

[get_the_subbies_on]

C4 news tonight asking some folk all tightly queued up outside a fruit and veg shop in London “how’s the social distancing going?”

Woman responds that “there’s no change” and with words to the effect that she won’t be doing it because that would be “giving in to the virus!!!!”

Humanity is doomed.

[Guest JTS98]

2 hours ago, pozbaird said:

... and when I needed some cat food and milk, who knows who had picked up the basket I carried around the shop before I did. When I picked up a box of Felix, forgetting my fussy pussy doesn’t like Felix, and put it back on the shelf, who had touched it before me. When I keyed my PIN into the machine to pay, who had prodded those keys before me with their fat grubby coronavirus soaked fingers. When I filled up the car, how many clatty basturts’ had smeared their Covid 19 laced mitts all over it prior to me. When I withdrew some cash from the machine.....

We’re doomed. Doomed. There is no escape.

 

2 hours ago, cyderspaceman said:

I don't think it's possible to make the thing absolute. We can't stay indoors with no interaction for 4/5/6 weeks but I will certainly try. Maybe I'll get used to it.

You're both correct in that we cannot feasibly bring our interaction with other people down to zero, but the point is that we are all being asked to minimize that interaction as much as possible.

For example, Malaysia is on near-lockdown at the moment. We are only meant to go out and buy essentials and spend the rest of the time at home. That's exactly what I'm doing. The government are being reasonable and allowing us to go to supermarkets and buy food. So, I've got a week's worth of stuff cooked and frozen and I'm staying put until it gets close to running out.

Starving to death is no better than dying of the virus. But going out for a coffee is not an essential.

No delivered coffee, no delivered pizza, no going to get takeaway from my local tandoori chicken place. All of those things needlessly increase my interaction with other people and increase the chances of me catching or spreading the virus.

No meeting up with mates etc. We talk on Skype, but we stay away from each other.

It's very simple. We have to break the chains that spread the virus and the reality of that is that any non-essential interaction with the world goes.

Of course it can't be zero. You need to buy things to live. But anything you don't need to do should not be done. People continuing to interact in these ways will mean the spread of the virus doesn't slow in the way we all want it to. Stay at home as much as you can.

Life is different now. None of us are going to enjoy this, and it will be unpleasant. But this is what we have to do for now, and it doesn't work if a lot of people don't do it.

Edited March 20, 2020 by JTS98

[Guest JTS98]

1 hour ago, oaksoft said:

No amount of isolation is going to be 100% safe.

Who do you think touched the food vulnerable people are still having to eat? The virus can still easily get to them through the postie, friends helping them by getting food shopping and a multitude of other ways. 1)Life is one risk after another. We expect young people to screech like chimps. What is disappointing is to see so many older people like you losing their shit over this.

2) Calm down FFS and think for a second. If the government wanted to stop all interactions they would announce it tonight. They are trying to slow it down. If everyone locked down tonight our economy would be fucked and their would no jobs for people to return to.

 

3) We used to make the best of difficult situations, now you want us to hide under the duvet? f**k that bud, that's not living.

What the f**k happened to us?

1) Yes. But the more of those risks you take, the greater the chance that you catch and/or spread the virus. That's very simple. There are some risks we must take, no more should be taken.

2) It's a balancing act. People need to eat, so a total shutdown is very hard. Also, people need to comply, so going too hard for too long increases the chance of lack of compliance as well as mental health problems. It's not as simple as the point you make there. You're seeing this approach on other countries too, of trying to encourage the public to take the right steps without being absolutely forced to. It's trying to find the balance.

For example, shops being open keeps a lot of people working. If this really gets out of control and the health system is totally overwhelmed, then everything stops completely. The economic results will be utterly dire, there is no getting away from that. It's all a balancing act.

Here in Malaysia the government observed that compliance on day one of our restricted movement was too low and have basically warned that if the public don't play ball, the restrictions will be ramped up and the military will be used to enforce it. They're also going to start fining and or nicking more people who are doing social things they shouldn't be. Saying that in the first place would have caused panic, saying it when you can demonstrate what changes you want seems to have had an impact on behaviour on day two.

3) The experts are quite clear about this. Staying away from other people is the best thing to do to slow the spread and allow better treatment for those who will inevitably need it. What more do you want? There's no point being all Billy Big Baws and telling folk to get on with life and leading to more deaths than is necessary.

Edited March 20, 2020 by JTS98

[GordonS]

54 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

I think the instances I'm talking about are to do with scale.

This isn't just people being around each other. These are two events with tens of thousands of people each, sitting together side by side all day, sharing food together, sleeping next to each other in tents. And then they go back to their own countries in their hundreds. It's pretty much worst-case.

It led to a spike in Malaysia, but also cases in Bahrain, Cambodia, Macau and the Middle East. It is known that a large group from Myanmar were also there, and the maths says some of them probably got it, but of course the Myanmar government says they are protected by their diet and lifestyle. All good.

The astonishing thing was that the results of the first one were so bad and so widely known, and then they did the second one anyway. 'We are more afraid of God'. Even yesterday the polis (that's actually what they're called) in Malaysia arrested people for gathering in mosques.

I think the cultural set-up in the UK perhaps explains why mosques get more attention than churches, but it should be pointed out that mosques are taking a kicking in Malaysia's officially pro-Islam (this is an officially Islamic country) media. What happened here and in Indonesia was beyond stupid.

ETA: Reading this morning that the Indonesians finally seem to have seen sense and broken up the event and quarantined at least some of those present. Nearly 10,000 were there for days before the event was meant to start. Let's hope we get away with this one.

Ta for the context. 

[Tight minge]

You're both correct in that we cannot feasibly bring our interaction with other people down to zero, but the point is that we are all being asked to minimize that interaction as much as possible.
For example, Malaysia is on near-lockdown at the moment. We are only meant to go out and buy essentials and spend the rest of the time at home. That's exactly what I'm doing. The government are being reasonable and allowing us to go to supermarkets and buy food. So, I've got a week's worth of stuff cooked and frozen and I'm staying put until it gets close to running out.
Starving to death is no better than dying of the virus. But going out for a coffee is not an essential.
No delivered coffee, no delivered pizza, no going to get takeaway from my local tandoori chicken place. All of those things needlessly increase my interaction with other people and increase the chances of me catching or spreading the virus.
No meeting up with mates etc. We talk on Skype, but we stay away from each other.
It's very simple. We have to break the chains that spread the virus and the reality of that is that any non-essential interaction with the world goes.
Of course it can't be zero. You need to buy things to live. But anything you don't need to do should not be done. People continuing to interact in these ways will mean the spread of the virus doesn't slow in the way we all want it to. Stay at home as much as you can.
Life is different now. None of us are going to enjoy this, and it will be unpleasant. But this is what we have to do for now, and it doesn't work if a lot of people don't do it.

The event in Jakarta was indeed cancelled in advance. There was a smaller one that went ahead in Sulawesi though.

The religious element, regardless of flavour is a big issue. A big part of South Koreas problem was created by a religious ‘cult’, two big outbreaks in Singapore centre around churches and one other around the gathering you mention in Malaysia.

Speaking to my elderly mother back home said that in response of the outbreak, the local church was holding a meeting in the church hall for all to attend. Fuckwits the lot of them.

And, yes. First day of feeling a but better today. Yay!

Did I miss anything?

Reading through the past several pages, think I want to be ill again.

Heading downtown for much needed shopping and retail therapy.

[Swarley]

Posted by Facilities Dept on the intranet at work. Further proof of the disintegration of society.

 

As a mate said "Disgusting. No excuses. That possessive apostrophe on 'loos' is worse than Coronavirus. Pandemics are no excuse for sloppy punctuation."

 

 

[Guest JTS98]

35 minutes ago, Swarley said:

Posted by Facilities Dept on the intranet at work. Further proof of the disintegration of society.

 

As a mate said "Disgusting. No excuses. That possessive apostrophe on 'loos' is worse than Coronavirus. Pandemics are no excuse for sloppy punctuation."

 

 

The errant apostrophe is the least of the worries in that fucking shambles.

'Less people'? Less people? A quick review of countable and uncountable nouns required there.

Civilisation is dead, imo.

Edited March 20, 2020 by JTS98

[Melanius Mullarkey]

I assume oaksoft’s “business” is on the line?

[alta-pete]

As has been briefly alluded to a few pages back, Boris is in an absolute no win game. 
 

We do as we are told, maintain distance, the elderly etc self isolate and by some miracle this all washes through with the fewest possible deaths? Then Boris has had a massive overreaction, tanked the economy for no reason and wtaf was he thinking????? Or...
 

We carry on as normal, NHS crumbles under the strain, massive death toll - he should have done much more!! Wtf was he thinking????

[alta-pete]

I think Italy has made a massive mess of it but some of the SE Asian countries are doing a far better job of keeping a lid on it, but at what cost? A no win game whichever path is chosen..,

[Granny Danger]

Not trying to underestimate the seriousness or severity of this, but an interesting wee bit about the Italian fatalities.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-18/99-of-those-who-died-from-virus-had-other-illness-italy-says

More than 99% of Italy’s coronavirus fatalities were people who suffered from previous medical conditions.

The average age of those who’ve died from the virus in Italy is 79.5.

All of Italy’s victims under 40 have been males with serious existing medical conditions.