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Coronavirus (COVID-19)


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5 hours ago, PauloPerth said:

This is actually frightening that an MP has so little understanding of such a serious situation.

 

Surely the only way to end this threat is for every country in the world, under the leadership of the WHO, going into lockdown from the same day for one month or however long deemed necessary. Only essential services such as food manufacture and distribution, healthcare etc continue with staff closely monitored. Can introduce rationing if required.

One month on, all existing cases have either died or healed, the virus has no new hosts and dies out.

If countries do it separately then when they re-open borders they are opening themselves up to fresh cases from visitors re-introducing the virus.

 

You can't put the entire world under lockdown for months. There are so many 'essential' services still required for society to function even in a locked down state. And remember, we have governments like ours that put the economy first, then there are all the individuals who put themselves first.

 

4 hours ago, Detournement said:

I'm absolutely ended that a family in Forfar think they had Corona Virus in December. 

Incredible!

I heard some woman on the radio last week who'd phoned in to one of those 'ask the health experts advice' specials and she was adamant telling the guy that she and her family had the coronavirus back in September, he kept on telling her you've had the flu, but she kept arguing with him 😆

 

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For each a roll (of toilet paper)

For every man a religion

Find everybody and... Err... isolate yersel from them


Was attempting a FEAR parody but it’s just not as straightforward as it is with CREAM.

Edited by The OP
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That's us now in quarantine, and you can only leave your house to pick up food/medicine and go to and from work (if you haven't already been told to work from home indefinitely). Should be until the 24th according to the Czech government.

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Announcing at a press conference here in ‘murca that they want to try to put those with Covid in the same facilities....
Leper colony anyone?


When they say “facilities” I presume they mean Mexico.
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1 hour ago, s_dog said:

You can't put the entire world under lockdown for months. There are so many 'essential' services still required for society to function even in a locked down state. And remember, we have governments like ours that put the economy first, then there are all the individuals who put themselves first.

 

So you'd go along with the strategy of letting half the population get infected to build up an immunity?  

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1 hour ago, PauloPerth said:

So you'd go along with the strategy of letting half the population get infected to build up an immunity?  

I probably would let the half population get infected but as slowly as possible if thats an option so as not to crack an already fragile NHS. I think we are all almost certain to be infected at some point and the more updates filtering through the more im starting to think it might be best to try and meet this head on and get it over and done with. Unfortunately there are going to be mass casualties either way it seems and drawing it out or trying to hide from this could be pointless and possibly the even more damaging option in the long term.

What you dont want is everyone to go into isolation too soon and think the virus is beat then a second wave to kick off just as people come out off isolation. Cue everyone saying "f**k it im not isolating again as it never worked the first time" then the result would be that the NHS then cant cope as its hit with a massive wave of cases resulting in more deaths overall.

One of the biggest problems is a lot more people could probably be saved if there were enough hospital staff and medical equipment to go around.

All in all this is a huge clusterfuck and every government is making it up as they go along.

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Guest JTS98
25 minutes ago, cambozpar said:

I probably would let the half population get infected but as slowly as possible if thats an option so as not to crack an already fragile NHS. I think we are all almost certain to be infected at some point and the more updates filtering through the more im starting to think it might be best to try and meet this head on and get it over and done with. Unfortunately there are going to be mass casualties either way it seems and drawing it out or trying to hide from this could be pointless and possibly the even more damaging option in the long term.

What you dont want is everyone to go into isolation too soon and think the virus is beat then a second wave to kick off just as people come out off isolation. Cue everyone saying "f**k it im not isolating again as it never worked the first time" then the result would be that the NHS then cant cope as its hit with a massive wave of cases resulting in more deaths overall.

One of the biggest problems is a lot more people could probably be saved if there were enough hospital staff and medical equipment to go around.

All in all this is a huge clusterfuck and every government is making it up as they go along.

I see what you're saying, but the problem with that is that if everybody behaves like that then the rate of infection will spike and health services will be overwhelmed and more people will die.

People are going to continue to be infected every day, this is true, but it's best to try and put that off as long as possible for each of us on an individual level.

Firstly, avoiding adding to the initial rush is obviously good as it eases the burden on hospitals, doctors, nurses.

Secondly, if you need intensive care, then you don't want to be in the initial mad rush and associated confusion. That's not a good time to be in a hospital, as anyone who's ever had to go to one on a Saturday night surely knows.

Thirdly, if you can put this off for months then you might catch it at a time where we understand the virus better and your personal outcome may be better due to better understanding of how to treat it.

I don't disagree with you, most of us are going to get this, but putting it off as long as possible seems like the best bet.

Edited by JTS98
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56 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

I see what you're saying, but the problem with that is that if everybody behaves like that then the rate of infection will spike and health services will be overwhelmed and more people will die.

People are going to continue to be infected every day, this is true, but it's best to try and put that off as long as possible for each of us on an individual level.

Firstly, avoiding adding to the initial rush is obviously good.

Secondly, if you need intensive care, then you don't want to be in the initial mad rush and associated confusion,

Thirdly, if you can put this off for months then you might catch it at a time where we understand the virus better and your personal outcome may be better.

I don't disagree with you, most of us are going to get this, but putting it off as long as possible seems like the best bet.

 

Yeah good point but it seems we are the only country that seems to be going with this tactic.

Maybe i dont have the vocabular skill capacity that explained fully what i meant in my previous post. I'll have another go.

 1.) What if we carry on as normal as possible but in a reduced state ie sporting events, mass gatherings etc. cancelled but still go about our daily lives. The plan being that we build up infections to the point where the NHS is at breaking point then hit the panic button and isolate.

56 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

I see what you're saying, but the problem with that is that if everybody behaves like that then the rate of infection will spike and health services will be overwhelmed and more people will die.

People are going to continue to be infected every day, this is true, but it's best to try and put that off as long as possible for each of us on an individual level.

Firstly, avoiding adding to the initial rush is obviously good.

Secondly, if you need intensive care, then you don't want to be in the initial mad rush and associated confusion,

Thirdly, if you can put this off for months then you might catch it at a time where we understand the virus better and your personal outcome may be better.

I don't disagree with you, most of us are going to get this, but putting it off as long as possible seems like the best bet.

2.)This to me is exactly the place you want to be if you are severely affected by it. By all accounts at this moment in time we have 5000 ventilators in the UK. If you want to be in with a fighting chance of getting the use of one its definitely in the first mad rush and hopefully there will be enough to go round and cover the people who need them as we hit the breaking point before isolation cut off. (See point 1)

56 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

I see what you're saying, but the problem with that is that if everybody behaves like that then the rate of infection will spike and health services will be overwhelmed and more people will die.

People are going to continue to be infected every day, this is true, but it's best to try and put that off as long as possible for each of us on an individual level.

Firstly, avoiding adding to the initial rush is obviously good.

Secondly, if you need intensive care, then you don't want to be in the initial mad rush and associated confusion,

Thirdly, if you can put this off for months then you might catch it at a time where we understand the virus better and your personal outcome may be better.

I don't disagree with you, most of us are going to get this, but putting it off as long as possible seems like the best bet.

3.)The major problem with this in my opinion firstly is being able to put it off for months, is that acheivable without civil disobedience or full scale anarchy or a total collapse of the global economy? And what if after lets say 2 or 3 months there has been no vaccine found and we are still at square 1 and all you have done is delayed the inevitable?

Edited by cambozpar
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Guest JTS98
2 minutes ago, cambozpar said:

 1.) What if we carry on as normal as possible but in a reduced state ie sporting events, mass gatherings etc. cancelled but still go about our daily lives. The plan being that we build up infections to the point where the NHS is at breaking point then hit the panic button and isolate.

Again, I can see a certain logic in that. It's certainly important to avoid being blind-sided by a second wave, having mistaken extreme containment for 'problem solved'. China will be interesting to keep an eye on in that regard over the next couple of months.

However, it's also a bit of a gamble. And, from an individual point of view, it might not be best to be part of this initial rush. We have nowhere near enough ventilators and we'll very quickly get to the stage where there aren't enough, so I don't think that justifies getting in early.

2.)This to me is exactly the place you want to be if you are severely affected by it. By all accounts at this moment in time we have 5000 ventilators in the UK. If you want to be in with a fighting chance of getting the use of one its definitely in the first mad rush and hopefully there will be enough to go round and cover the people who need them as we hit the breaking point before isolation cut off. (See point 1)

This is the period where panic and uncertainty are going to be at their peak. Imagine every Saturday night in a hospital A&E but much worse. That's absolutely not when you want to be in a hospital. You'll be treated by exhausted staff working in terrible, confusing conditions. As mentioned above, I think the number of ventilators per person is so low that this is unlikely to be such a big consideration.

The major problem with this in my opinion firstly is being able to put it off for months, is that acheivable without civil disobedience or full scale anarchy or a total collapse of the global economy. And what if after lets say 2 or 3 months there has been no vaccine found and we are still at square 1 and all you have done is delayed the inevitable.

I agree with you here. We can't suspend life indefinitely and there is going to be a limit on the public's patience. But, sadly, we are where we are and decisions have to be taken about the best way to handle it. The economic consequences will be dire, lots of people will die, there will probably be resultant mental health problems, there will probably be suicides, marital problems, homelessness and all the other things associated with difficult economic times. I'm pretty sure I'll lose my job, for example. Not much that can be done about it.

However, I still disagree that the best move is to get in early. I'd rather be patient 2,000,000 than patient 100,000 for the reasons I outlined above. Similar to the discussion about what to do with the football season on another thread, people just need to accept that this is going to be bad and find a way to best deal with that.

 

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9 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

1.) What if we carry on as normal as possible but in a reduced state ie sporting events, mass gatherings etc. cancelled but still go about our daily lives. The plan being that we build up infections to the point where the NHS is at breaking point then hit the panic button and isolate.

Again, I can see a certain logic in that. It's certainly important to avoid being blind-sided by a second wave, having mistaken extreme containment for 'problem solved'. China will be interesting to keep an eye on in that regard over the next couple of months.

However, it's also a bit of a gamble. And, from an individual point of view, it might not be best to be part of this initial rush. We have nowhere near enough ventilators and we'll very quickly get to the stage where there aren't enough, so I don't think that justifies getting in early.

Your right It is a gamble, a huge gamble and it might not be best to be part of this initial rush but on the other hand maybe it is. Im not knocking your point I completely agree with the gamble part merely challenging it.

2.)This to me is exactly the place you want to be if you are severely affected by it. By all accounts at this moment in time we have 5000 ventilators in the UK. If you want to be in with a fighting chance of getting the use of one its definitely in the first mad rush and hopefully there will be enough to go round and cover the people who need them as we hit the breaking point before isolation cut off. (See point 1)

This is the period where panic and uncertainty are going to be at their peak. Imagine every Saturday night in a hospital A&E but much worse. That's absolutely not when you want to be in a hospital. You'll be treated by exhausted staff working in terrible, confusing conditions. As mentioned above, I think the number of ventilators per person is so low that this is unlikely to be such a big consideration.

Again another fair point about confusion but maybe not exhaustion. If we have 5000 ventilators why not wait until we get near the threshold of 5000 confirmed cases or even better 5000 severe cases that need ventilators before hitting the isolate button. From reports not all confirmed cases are as serious as others and probably even more case are being treatedby self isolation without even speaking to a doctor as per current government guidelines ,so why not make the most of the early cases to build up some kind of immunity in the population. got to be better than nothing right?

The major problem with this in my opinion firstly is being able to put it off for months, is that acheivable without civil disobedience or full scale anarchy or a total collapse of the global economy. And what if after lets say 2 or 3 months there has been no vaccine found and we are still at square 1 and all you have done is delayed the inevitable.

I agree with you here. We can't suspend life indefinitely and there is going to be a limit on the public's patience. But, sadly, we are where we are and decisions have to be taken about the best way to handle it. The economic consequences will be dire, lots of people will die, there will probably be resultant mental health problems, there will probably be suicides, marital problems, homelessness and all the other things associated with difficult economic times. I'm pretty sure I'll lose my job, for example. Not much that can be done about it.

However, I still disagree that the best move is to get in early. I'd rather be patient 2,000,000 than patient 100,000 for the reasons I outlined above. Similar to the discussion about what to do with the football season on another thread, people just need to accept that this is going to be bad and find a way to best deal with that

I see your point here totally and yes being patient 2,000,000 would be better than being patient 100,000 but only if it was going to be easier because there was a pain free vaccine.I also agree 100% about the football season. Completely irrelevant in what is going to be the biggest event in probably 95% of anyone alive todays lives. Good wee bonus if they just suspend the current season and start again if your a Hearts fan this season too i would imagine  :)

 

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People on social media absolutely desperate for coronavirus to hit the UK and US hard so they can use it as political ammo against Boris and Trump.


Trump and Boris are making a pretty compelling case themselves, at showing the world the scale of their incompetence.

A pair of fucking morons.
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