Next Manager To Leave

[DeeTillEhDeh]

Can't agree with that. Yes, Nelms had chosen a succession of shit managers but we are just after spending 5 year in the top flight with managers being well backed. 
I respectfully think they've been our best owners since I've supported the club (Which considering our past isn't necessarily a big compliment). 
I don't think there can be any doubts about their investment considering they've consistently backed managers and spent money whilst at the club.
If the stadium thing falls through and they do decide to move on, I don't really think that's a 'told you so scenario'. Tim Keyes says he's fell in love with the club - but at the end of the day a foreign investor is only going to invest if he feels he can make money long term. This project is how they envisage it happening.
As it stands, Keyes would benefit from not allowing Nelms to make managerial decisions as he'd waste a hell of a lot less money, but to say they haven't backed the club with solid investment is ridiculous.

You didn't answer the question.

[Ludo*1]

Just now, DeeTillEhDeh said:

1 hour ago, Ludo*1 said:

Can't agree with that. Yes, Nelms had chosen a succession of shit managers but we are just after spending 5 year in the top flight with managers being well backed. 
I respectfully think they've been our best owners since I've supported the club (Which considering our past isn't necessarily a big compliment). 
I don't think there can be any doubts about their investment considering they've consistently backed managers and spent money whilst at the club.
If the stadium thing falls through and they do decide to move on, I don't really think that's a 'told you so scenario'. Tim Keyes says he's fell in love with the club - but at the end of the day a foreign investor is only going to invest if he feels he can make money long term. This project is how they envisage it happening.
As it stands, Keyes would benefit from not allowing Nelms to make managerial decisions as he'd waste a hell of a lot less money, but to say they haven't backed the club with solid investment is ridiculous.

You didn't answer the question.

Yes, Tim Keyes has us in a much, much healthier position than the fan owned, Scot Gardiner controlling thing we had going on.

[harry94]

2 hours ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

If it did happen I'd be first at the front of the queue to say "I told you so".

Always had serious doubts about their investment - ask yourself this - are we in a better position now than when they took over.

I'm struggling to say Yes.

I mean, they've pumped in an insane amount of money for Scottish Football owners consistently over 7 or so years - I'd imagine more actual cash has come from them than any Dundee owners in history. Their administration has been pish in some regards but I think Keyes has come in good faith and he's done this in an era where he's not been able to tie the club up in liabilities with FPS etc. They've done this to a club with zero assets and nothing to asset strip as well - they could have turned the taps off years ago and just cut their losses but they've even kept it up after our worst footballing and financial disaster in their time.

I think they've just arrived here, inherited (well sort of, they appointed him technically but it was Colvin on the ground making the decision) a manager in Paul Hartley who come with a mantra of trying to play football and sign part-timers and in that, it went very very well short-term and he delivered brilliant results with some of his finds. I think from then on, they were maybe a bit sold on this sort of 'project' football and then seemed to think that pouring more money into that would somehow lead to even better results. They've blundered around since then in chasing these ideals.

Incompetence isn't malice.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

I mean, they've pumped in an insane amount of money for Scottish Football owners consistently over 7 or so years - I'd imagine more actual cash has come from them than any Dundee owners in history. Their administration has been pish in some regards but I think Keyes has come in good faith and he's done this in an era where he's not been able to tie the club up in liabilities with FPS etc. They've done this to a club with zero assets and nothing to asset strip as well - they could have turned the taps off years ago and just cut their losses but they've even kept it up after our worst footballing and financial disaster in their time.
I think they've just arrived here, inherited (well sort of, they appointed him technically but it was Colvin on the ground making the decision) a manager in Paul Hartley who come with a mantra of trying to play football and sign part-timers and in that, it went very very well short-term and he delivered brilliant results with some of his finds. I think from then on, they were maybe a bit sold on this sort of 'project' football and then seemed to think that pouring more money into that would somehow lead to even better results. They've blundered around since then in chasing these ideals.
Incompetence isn't malice.

Not saying it's malice - just struggling to see how we've moved on since they came in.

[vikingTON]

7th, 1st, 5th, 4th, 7th.

If that lot is considered "mid-table" then the vast majority of clubs in Scotland finish mid-table.

 

You finished 1st in the seaside league and not at this level champ. Though congrats on reminding everyone about the time that you also finished 7th in the league below as well - despite having by far the largest budget in the division - as if that would strengthen your gubbins argument rather than underline your utter mediocrity.

 

Thanks for playing anyway.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[harry94]

12 hours ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

14 hours ago, harry94 said:

I mean, they've pumped in an insane amount of money for Scottish Football owners consistently over 7 or so years - I'd imagine more actual cash has come from them than any Dundee owners in history. Their administration has been pish in some regards but I think Keyes has come in good faith and he's done this in an era where he's not been able to tie the club up in liabilities with FPS etc. They've done this to a club with zero assets and nothing to asset strip as well - they could have turned the taps off years ago and just cut their losses but they've even kept it up after our worst footballing and financial disaster in their time.
I think they've just arrived here, inherited (well sort of, they appointed him technically but it was Colvin on the ground making the decision) a manager in Paul Hartley who come with a mantra of trying to play football and sign part-timers and in that, it went very very well short-term and he delivered brilliant results with some of his finds. I think from then on, they were maybe a bit sold on this sort of 'project' football and then seemed to think that pouring more money into that would somehow lead to even better results. They've blundered around since then in chasing these ideals.
Incompetence isn't malice.

Not saying it's malice - just struggling to see how we've moved on since they came in.

The situation they inherited though, we had a massive squad and run a deficit for the year of something like £800k-1 million. That was on top of the couple of seasons before of our promotion post admin running the club very cheaply to get up then our season there also running a deficit overall.

It's very easy to envision 'moving on' but the situation we were in, we couldn't have afforded to sign an emergency 'keeper (and as I recall, that's the first piece of business FPS did as we had no one on the bench and literally didn't have the funds to rectify it and afford Dan Twardzik). Clubs who have exited financial difficulty and were in the sort of state we were in are pretty ripe for rogue investors and the likes of Melville etc when we need cash injections etc as no one would lend to us - it's no coincidence that teams who do go into insolvency often do so more than once, it starts a vicious cycle. I've no doubt that if we continued on without FPS involvement, we might possibly have still been successful on the park and saw through that season and even gotten up but we'd possibly have spent the next decade with the same board room confusion and infighting that we've seen before - I'm convinced that we're likely in a better place and even if it has been tough, we have had a 5 year period in the top flight and been able to concentrate on the football.

In my lifetime, this is really the only period where we've acted like a proper football club off the park and there's not been any huge worries about the finances or assets being traded away overnight (not that we have any left....).

As I recall, the alternative at the time was a Marr led consortium of some sort. I know relations with FPS have sometimes been strained but I do kind of get their apathy to some degree when they arrive here and get called names and obstructed by people offering a few pennies who have fucked up the club massively and, possibly, beyond repair for the next few decades. In all honesty, we needed them to save them from ourselves and put that era to bed.

[ecto]

Wright leaves St Johnstone after thinking f**k it after realising clubs going nowhere, Robertson leaves ICT after seeing Lewis Toshney in training and thinking f**k it Saintees will do me, McPake sacked by Dundee, they swiftly appoint Wright and ICT appoint either Sheerin or Robson, there sorted, Robertson is the answer

Edited January 20, 2020 by ecto

[RossBFaeDundee]

1st vs 2nd in the "who should be punted" Bowl this Friday on BBC Scotland. Should be some top tier must-watch garbage.

[Ludo*1]

Are we any closer to one of the 10 leaving?

[Distant Doonhamer]

Are we any closer to one of the 10 leaving?

Yes we are.

[RossBFaeDundee]

To think the 2nd least voted for manager in the poll is probably in the hottest water right now is kinda funny.

[Derry Alli]

8 minutes ago, RossBFaeDundee said:

To think the 2nd least voted for manager in the poll is probably in the hottest water right now is kinda funny.

Robbie Neilson? 

Nah, they won yesterday. @Twinkle won't be calling for his head again this season I don't imagine.

 

[Ludo*1]

Plenty time for this to come back to bite me, but it's looking grim for AJ right now.

[Stoo61]

Absolute stick on. 

[Benji]

As it didn't happen on Saturday, I expect a defeat at Firhill on Tuesday night would be the last straw.

[weetoonlad]

Plenty time for this to come back to bite me, but it's looking grim for AJ right now.

How is he still in a job Jimmy MacIntyre always gets a job about now must be the only manager who works 3 months a year