Great Myths of Scottish Football

[HibeeJibee]

I'm sure there was a thread on this, but maybe it died in Div's great cull some years ago.

Might be interesting and stuff always pops up on radio/TV. Here's a few I've seen or heard recently to get going:


Dundee United won the league in 1983 using just 14 players
Apparently this was claimed by Jim McLean in press interviews. In actual fact 20 players were used of which 15 made at least 5 starts: the rest made 1/2 starts, and in a single case 1 sub appearance.

Aberdeen were saved from relegation in 2000 when Falkirk were denied promotion for not having 10,000 seats
Aberdeen would have contested a round-robin playoff alongside Dunfermline and Falkirk with the top 2 playing SPL the next season. Motherwell were saved from relegation when Falkirk won again in 2003.

That Gemmill Goal put Scotland into the knockout stages of WC1978 until Johnny Rep got one back for the Netherlands
I think this misconception is more common among younger fans. Scotland had to win by 3 clear goals so even at 3-1 another strike was required. We were only within 1 goal for 3 mins until Rep struck.

Panucci's controversial goal cost Scotland qualification for Euro 2008
We could only finish above Italy by beating them... but it was 1-1 when he scored to win it... had we drawn we could only have qualified if Ukraine had beaten France midweek (and they drew anyway). 

Rangers v Morton in the 1948 Scottish Cup Final had the biggest total attendance of any football match in history
I've heard this said... and between both ties about 262,000 did watch the game. However it's a confusion with the replay being a British - and presumably European - record for a midweek game: other football matches have been watched by more fans in total, most obviously the 1963 Intercontinental Cup Final at the San Siro + Maracana which drew over 303,000 and indeed Celtic v Racing Club in 1967 (268,000).

Bellshill has produced more professional footballers/Scotland internationals than anywhere
Only in so far as it was home to the maternity hospital where they got born.

Pittodrie was Scotland's first all-seater stadium
Kilbowie in Clydebank was the first all-seater stadium in Britain... Pittodrie does seem to really have installed the first dugout, tbf.

Edited November 11, 2019 by HibeeJibee

[effeffsee_the2nd]

7 minutes ago, HibeeJibee said:

I'm sure there was a thread on this, but maybe it died in Div's great cull some years ago.

Might be interesting and stuff always pops up on radio/TV. Here's a few I've seen or heard recently to get going:



Panucci's controversial goal cost Scotland qualification for Euro 2008
We could only finish above Italy by beating them... but it was 1-1 when he scored to win it... had we drawn we could only have qualified if Ukraine had beaten France midweek (and they drew anyway). 
 

Further to that I never agreed with consensus of " we were robbed" we were very disappointed after a great campaign would have been more ohnest.  Italy got a perfectly good goal chopped of for offside which would have made it 2-0, then barry fergusons equaliser was actually offside.  all in all looking it was a classic Scottish gallant losers performance

[Kuro]

Why is a Berwick can called hibeejibee

[Melanius Mullarkey]

Celtgers performing well in the Europa League is great for Scottish football

Is it f**k.

[PB1994]

Rangers didn’t die.

[cmontheloknow]

1 hour ago, HibeeJibee said:

I'm sure there was a thread on this, but maybe it died in Div's great cull some years ago.

Might be interesting and stuff always pops up on radio/TV. Here's a few I've seen or heard recently to get going:


Dundee United won the league in 1983 using just 14 players
Apparently this was claimed by Jim McLean in press interviews. In actual fact 20 players were used of which 15 made at least 5 starts: the rest made 1/2 starts, and in a single case 1 sub appearance.

Aberdeen were saved from relegation in 2000 when Falkirk were denied promotion for not having 10,000 seats
Aberdeen would have contested a round-robin playoff alongside Dunfermline and Falkirk with the top 2 playing SPL the next season. Motherwell were saved from relegation when Falkirk won again in 2003.

That Gemmill Goal put Scotland into the knockout stages of WC1978 until Johnny Rep got one back for the Netherlands
I think this misconception is more common among younger fans. Scotland had to win by 3 clear goals so even at 3-1 another strike was required. We were only within 1 goal for 3 mins until Rep struck.

Panucci's controversial goal cost Scotland qualification for Euro 2008
We could only finish above Italy by beating them... but it was 1-1 when he scored to win it... had we drawn we could only have qualified if Ukraine had beaten France midweek (and they drew anyway). 

Rangers v Morton in the 1948 Scottish Cup Final had the biggest total attendance of any football match in history
I've heard this said... and between both ties about 262,000 did watch the game. However it's a confusion with the replay being a British - and presumably European - record for a midweek game: other football matches have been watched by more fans in total, most obviously the 1963 Intercontinental Cup Final at the San Siro + Maracana which drew over 303,000 and indeed Celtic v Racing Club in 1967 (268,000).

Bellshill has produced more professional footballers/Scotland internationals than anywhere
Only in so far as it was home to the maternity hospital where they got born.

Pittodrie was Scotland's first all-seater stadium
Kilbowie in Clydebank was the first all-seater stadium in Britain... Pittodrie does seem to really have installed the first dugout, tbf.

On the Bellshill one, you'd also think that the entirely of Ayrshire's footballers were from Irvine, for the very same reason.

[DA Baracus]

2 hours ago, HibeeJibee said:

Aberdeen were saved from relegation in 2000 when Falkirk were denied promotion for not having 10,000 seats
Aberdeen would have contested a round-robin playoff alongside Dunfermline and Falkirk with the top 2 playing SPL the next season. Motherwell were saved from relegation when Falkirk won again in 2003.
 

They sort of were saved from relegation though, as they could easily have finished bottom of that round robin.

[gannonball]

*Random shite St.Johnstone player* should be in Scotland squad.

[GordonD]

3 hours ago, HibeeJibee said:

Pittodrie was Scotland's first all-seater stadium
Kilbowie in Clydebank was the first all-seater stadium in Britain... Pittodrie does seem to really have installed the first dugout, tbf.

Only if you don't count Meadowbank Stadium, which had no standing facilities. Most people don't.

[DA Baracus]

The number of folk who still say that we were cheated against Italy and that their winner put us out is mental.

[Rob1885]

Rarely gets mentioned that Ferguson was offside for his goal also.

[HibeeJibee]

2 hours ago, cmontheloknow said:

On the Bellshill one, you'd also think that the entirely of Ayrshire's footballers were from Irvine, for the very same reason.

Interestingly when Douglas Lamming published his Scottish Internationalists' Who's Who in 1986 the places which had contributed more than a handful of Scotland internationals were:

179     Glasgow
   51     Edinburgh
   21     Dundee
   21     Paisley
   17     Falkirk
   16     Aberdeen
   16     Dumbarton
   15     Kilmarnock
   12     Airdrie
   12     Renton
   11     Bonhill
   10     Hamilton
   10     Irvine
   10     Johnstone
      9     Greenock
      9     Larkhall
      8     Barrhead
      8     Motherwell
      7     Alexandria
      7     Arbroath
      7     Ayr
      7     Denny
      6     Beith
      6     Stirling
 

56 minutes ago, DA Baracus said:

They sort of were saved from relegation though, as they could easily have finished bottom of that round robin.

True, but most people just think it was 3-up-1-down i.e. same relegation as in surrounding seasons.
 

13 minutes ago, GordonD said:

Only if you don't count Meadowbank Stadium, which had no standing facilities. Most people don't.

Fair.

Edited November 11, 2019 by HibeeJibee

[DA Baracus]

4 minutes ago, Rob1885 said:

3 hours ago, HibeeJibee said:

I'm sure there was a thread on this, but maybe it died in Div's great cull some years ago.

Might be interesting and stuff always pops up on radio/TV. Here's a few I've seen or heard recently to get going:


Dundee United won the league in 1983 using just 14 players
Apparently this was claimed by Jim McLean in press interviews. In actual fact 20 players were used of which 15 made at least 5 starts: the rest made 1/2 starts, and in a single case 1 sub appearance.

Aberdeen were saved from relegation in 2000 when Falkirk were denied promotion for not having 10,000 seats
Aberdeen would have contested a round-robin playoff alongside Dunfermline and Falkirk with the top 2 playing SPL the next season. Motherwell were saved from relegation when Falkirk won again in 2003.

That Gemmill Goal put Scotland into the knockout stages of WC1978 until Johnny Rep got one back for the Netherlands
I think this misconception is more common among younger fans. Scotland had to win by 3 clear goals so even at 3-1 another strike was required. We were only within 1 goal for 3 mins until Rep struck.

Panucci's controversial goal cost Scotland qualification for Euro 2008
We could only finish above Italy by beating them... but it was 1-1 when he scored to win it... had we drawn we could only have qualified if Ukraine had beaten France midweek (and they drew anyway). 

Rangers v Morton in the 1948 Scottish Cup Final had the biggest total attendance of any football match in history
I've heard this said... and between both ties about 262,000 did watch the game. However it's a confusion with the replay being a British - and presumably European - record for a midweek game: other football matches have been watched by more fans in total, most obviously the 1963 Intercontinental Cup Final at the San Siro + Maracana which drew over 303,000 and indeed Celtic v Racing Club in 1967 (268,000).

Bellshill has produced more professional footballers/Scotland internationals than anywhere
Only in so far as it was home to the maternity hospital where they got born.

Pittodrie was Scotland's first all-seater stadium
Kilbowie in Clydebank was the first all-seater stadium in Britain... Pittodrie does seem to really have installed the first dugout, tbf.

Aberdeen were saved from relegation by the league expanding to 12 teams from 10.

The OP is correct. There was to be a mini tournament featuring Aberdeen, us and Falkirk, with the top 2 to be in the SPL and the bottom team to be in the First Division, but because Brockville didn't have 10k seats they scrapped it and just let Aberdeen stay up and promoted us.

The expansion was to see the First Divsion winners (St Mirren) and the winner of the mini tournament make up the two additional SPL teams.

Edited November 11, 2019 by DA Baracus

[Benjamin_Nevis]

Rangers weren't semi-finalists in the Champions League 1992-93. 

They simply finished 2nd in a group in which only the winners would go through to meet the other group winners in the final. No semi-final was played. 

 

[DA Baracus]

Incidentally I always thought that going down would have actually been pretty good for Aberdeen. 

I reckon they would have easily outspent the rest of the league and won it pretty comfortably. It would have been a real kick up the arse for them and would have really cleared out the complacency that set in and a league winning campaign would have got a lot of fans back on side, and the momentum of going up would have helped push them on. It would have been similar to when Hibs went down a couple of seasons before.

[NorthernLights]

32 minutes ago, DA Baracus said:

Incidentally I always thought that going down would have actually been pretty good for Aberdeen. 

I reckon they would have easily outspent the rest of the league and won it pretty comfortably. It would have been a real kick up the arse for them and would have really cleared out the complacency that set in and a league winning campaign would have got a lot of fans back on side, and the momentum of going up would have helped push them on. It would have been similar to when Hibs went down a couple of seasons before.

Nah, you're OK. 

[HibeeJibee]

2 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said:

Rangers weren't semi-finalists in the Champions League 1992-93. 

They simply finished 2nd in a group in which only the winners would go through to meet the other group winners in the final. No semi-final was played. 

Cracking... great and oft-seen myth.


Some more:

East Fife in 1938 (and now Hibs in 2016) were the only club to win the Scottish Cup while playing outwith the top division
Queen's Park won it in 1893 while not in any league.

Clyde were denied a Fairs Cup place in 1967 as they failed to argue they were from Rutherglen not Glasgow - they never did play in Europe
Broadly correct. However in 1960 they'd played Lens in the Anglo-Franco-Scottish Friendship Cup.

Ally McCoist won the European Golden Boot in 1992 and 1993
Officially he didn't. It was suspended from 1990 to 1996. Someone in Georgia scored more, too.

OF derby never went to penalties until 2016 Scottish Cup SF
Drybrough Cup Final 1974.

[effeffsee_the2nd]

and another fackin thing! it was only a free kick albeit one in a dangerous area . it was still up to us to defend it properly. you'd think it was a penalty they were givin the way some folk go on

[The Master]

Queen of the South aren’t the only team mentioned in the bible. 

Putting aside different translations being inconsistent in their use of capitals (and thus variously permitting “arsenal” - uncapitalised - as a counter-example), there is at least one capitalised reference to “Bury” in all mainstream versions.  

Admittedly this might not be relevant for much longer...

[HibeeJibee]

10 minutes ago, The Master said:

Queen of the South aren’t the only team mentioned in the bible. 

Putting aside different translations being inconsistent in their use of capitals (and thus variously permitting “arsenal” - uncapitalised - as a counter-example), there is at least one capitalised reference to “Bury” in all mainstream versions.  

Admittedly this might not be relevant for much longer...

[Applause]

Also - Corinthians?

Reading?