Guest Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 3 minutes ago, Malky3 said: First off I disagree that the Conservative Party are extreme in any way shape or form. Secondly I think there are lessons being learned from history - just perhaps not ones that fit with your politics. Take Corbyn for example. Most of us have seen the Socialism and Communism in action across a number of countries in the world. We know it doesn't work. Freedoms are removed, democracy is damaged, and the one most common outcome is that everyone races to the bottom in those societies except those who are corrupt enough to win favour with the regimes. We have had politicians who were pacifists and apologists for those committing atrocities and we know that seldom ends well too. We also know what happens when the democratic will of the people is ignored. What you are doing is attempting to push Johnson and the Conservative Party into the same mould as Nazi Germany, but if you knew your history you'd know that the ideologies of both are miles apart. That's nonsense though, many of the "communist" and "socialist" countries that you note have "failed" are not due to communism per se but due to the effect of US sanctions which ENSURE that the country comes under immense Economic pressure as they are perceived to be a threat to the Capitalist system and those who milk it for everything. Apart from this there's equally, if not more, as many capitalist countries who've failed, been beset by corruption and who's regimes have committed atrocities just the same. Incidentally I'd say Norway is a shining example of a REAL socialist country and confirms exactly how wealth can be spread around a nation to benefit ALL it's citizens and not just the select few............ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Mahelp Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 12 minutes ago, speckled tangerine said: "We also know what happens when the democratic will of the people is ignored." That's become the ultimate meaningless, right-wing trope. A straw-man phrase, designed to kill any kind of debate. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Mahelp Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 48 minutes ago, Malky3 said: Dear oh dear, this is hyperbolic shite. I do not hate immigrants. I have absolutely no wish to abolish gay rights and I have zero interest whatsoever in bringing back the death penalty. That kind of nonsense does you no credit at all! I will also be voting Conservative on Thursday. None of the leadership candidates are morally fit to hold high office so it does come down to party politics for me and the one party whos policies I feel most aligned to are the Conservatives. You're deliberately misunderstanding. The Tory party have created an ideology that makes them attractive to people who ARE racist, homophobic, xenophobic etc. I didn't say that you were. But there's no doubt that a certain number of people who will vote Tory on Thursday.....many for the first time....are all these things. The Tories know this, and have developed a constant set of soundbites that are designed to pander to the lowest common denominator. That's what right-wing populism is all about. I would have thought that someone as intelligent as yourself would understand and acknowledge that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 48 minutes ago, BigFatTabbyDave said: It does make you wonder how many folk scoffed that their vote for the Nationalist Socialist party didn't mean that they had any ill feeling towards the Jews. /Godwin Godwin's since said by all means batter in with the comparisons and given the Tory manifesto has pledged to persecute the Traveller community it's a valid comparison. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Angelo Barksdale Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 *takes a massive huff from a bag of glue A 2nd independence referendum is fascism, the othering of foreign nationals and persecution of minorities is just common sense centrist policy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Tarmo Kink Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 I originally said indyref2 would have to wait a generation but I can see a case for it earlier (perhaps around 2021). Just before I make the point, I want to make it clear that Scotland leaving the EU is ENTIRELY DEMOCRATIC and anybody who thinks otherwise is either a rabid nat with an agenda or doesn’t understand democracy. Scotland has to accept Brexit currently, and cancelling Brexit, or having another referendum (ignoring the first one) is also totally undemocratic. The argument I can see for an earlier indyref2 is that despite Brexit being democratically voted for, Scotland as a whole has a difference of opinion with the rest of the UK. Scotland clearly has a difference of opinion with the rest of the UK on a lot of issues, but this is a big, serious issue. The argument to stay in the EU is not something that can happen whilst Scotland are in the United Kingdom, so if the Scottish population feel strongly enough about it, I can accept indyref2 as a fair proposal. The only thing I would say is that any indy backers shouldn’t push for it before it’s clear that a majority of Scotland (going by polls) want it. If Scotland votes No a second time, there may never be another vote. I suspect Sturgeon may have to drop her overly-assertive militant attitude to appeal to certain parts of Scotland too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 1 hour ago, NotThePars said: Godwin's since said by all means batter in with the comparisons and given the Tory manifesto has pledged to persecute the Traveller community it's a valid comparison. Word salad. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boghead ranter Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlandmagyar 2nd Tier Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 2 hours ago, Malky3 said: Dear oh dear, this is hyperbolic shite. I do not hate immigrants. I have absolutely no wish to abolish gay rights and I have zero interest whatsoever in bringing back the death penalty. That kind of nonsense does you no credit at all! I will also be voting Conservative on Thursday. None of the leadership candidates are morally fit to hold high office so it does come down to party politics for me and the one party whos policies I feel most aligned to are the Conservatives. More aligned to the Conservatives? So. No moral compass, racist, homophobic and undemocratic and determined to make the rich richer and the poor into abject poverty. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnthebaptistist Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 3 minutes ago, Highlandmagyar 2nd Tier said: More aligned to the Conservatives? So. No moral compass, racist, homophobic and undemocratic and determined to make the rich richer and the poor into abject poverty. Sounds like a plan to me, c'mon borris let's do this !! -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 I wouldn't bother throwing poverty at Malksoft - unless you're starving in an arid part of Africa, you don't qualify. He's been quite clear on this point. Even then, there's bound to be a few online training courses they could be doing to lift themselves out of it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdinburghPar1975 Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 I can't believe that despite the headlines and 'noise' around the Tories that their lead continues to grow over Labour. Why anyone would vote for them is beyond me...I just don't get it 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpetmonster Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 Sounds like a plan to me, c'mon borris let's do this !!Jorris, I believe. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donathan Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 Hearing the Tories confident in Lanark 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 11 minutes ago, EdinburghPar1975 said: I can't believe that despite the headlines and 'noise' around the Tories that their lead continues to grow over Labour. Why anyone would vote for them is beyond me...I just don't get it They're alright, Jack. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnthebaptistist Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 18 minutes ago, EdinburghPar1975 said: I can't believe that despite the headlines and 'noise' around the Tories that their lead continues to grow over Labour. Why anyone would vote for them is beyond me...I just don't get it Do you have a job ? If yes, then that's enough to vote Tory, go on, you will feel better for it in the long run. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 There's plenty of them don't have jobs; just a fat pot of cash they did nothing to earn, and a genetic predisposition to sociopathy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donathan Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 How bad would the night have to be for the SNP for there to be calls from within for Sturgeon to resign? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 4 hours ago, dirty dingus said: shit like this lol 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted December 9, 2019 Share Posted December 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Donathan said: How bad would the night have to be for the SNP for there to be calls from within for Sturgeon to resign? 59 MPs and an immediate declaration of independence from Westminster, along with a celebratory mention of reinforcing trans rights. Sorry, did you mean significant calls? They'd need to lose seats, I'd have thought. Breaking even would be bad, but nobody seems to have a better idea at the moment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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