Highland Pyramid

[AsimButtHitsASix]

Banks O'Dee must be a decent shout for going up if they were in Tier 6 next year. Are they not licensed?
Likewise, once they go up, Golspie could win the NCL and have no-one to face in a play off for promotion.

[welshbairn]

4 minutes ago, AsimButtHitsASix said:

Banks O'Dee must be a decent shout for going up if they were in Tier 6 next year. Are they not licensed?
Likewise, once they go up, Golspie could win the NCL and have no-one to face in a play off for promotion.

They're both licensed and Banks o Dee turned down a invitation to apply to join the HL last summer when it came down to 17 members. They're the Talbot of the North, like being Kings of a small pond.

[Robert James]

On 15/04/2020 at 18:42, AsimButtHitsASix said:

Banks O'Dee must be a decent shout for going up if they were in Tier 6 next year. Are they not licensed?
Likewise, once they go up, Golspie could win the NCL and have no-one to face in a play off for promotion.

Both these 2 clubs are licensed.

They were drawn to play each other in the Scottish Cup Preliminary Round 2  (2019/20).   The result was :     Banks O'Dee  2  Golspie Sutherland  0

Six different clubs have been NCL champions during the last 10 years. These clubs support the NCL joining the pyramid, thereby having the incentive/opportunity to progress. Four additional clubs have applied to join the NCL for 2020/21. Their applications will be considered at the league's impending AGM ; date to be confirmed.

[MacGafraidh]

Get them in

[mcruic]

Many of the problems of the current pyramid are caused by the following:

1) The structure of the SPFL (4 small divisions), with particularly a very small transition between SPFL and Tier 5  (League 2) of 10 teams, creating a bottleneck.
2) The structure of  Tier 5, trying to fit teams into a lopsided 2-league structure instead of the more natural 3-leagues, as trialled by the Juniors for many years.

A simple solution, which I've posted a detailed diagram of earlier, takes into account the following concerns:

1) SPFL clubs want to preserve a 42 team league.
2) SPFL clubs don't want regionalistaion of lower tiers.
3) Scotland has too many tiers for so few clubs (no other league in Europe has 4 national leagues, apart from England (with 10 x the population), which has 5).
4).
4) Tayside clubs don't appear to want to play in any "Highland" or "North" structure.
5) Smaller junior and amateur clubs essentially want to "stay where they are".

So, in my opinion, we're trying to build a pyramid on shaky foundations, and that's why it's taking so long to get off the ground.
Simple solution:

1) Get rid of one of the Tiers (Tiers 1-3 of 12-14-16 teams). This makes it easier for teams to progress through the leagues by cutting out an unnecessary level.
2) Make Tier 4 (now Tier 5) 3-pronged instead of 2-pronged (North/East/West).
3) Distribute all teams below Tier 4, maintaining current leagues if possible.

This allows a relatively evenly distributed number of teams among the North/East/West sections of the pyramid, and it allows all teams the option of not being promoted if they can't manage/don't want to.  It also means a compact structure of 9 Tiers for all Scottish football, right down to amateur and welfare.  If West Lothian teams don't want to progress, they can stay in a West Lothian League as a notional part of the pyramid, refusing promotion every year if they want to.

Precisely because I've positively addressed most of the problems that have been raised when I've discussed the subject previously (I've discussed it with SPFL club fans, junior fans, and senior non-league fans), my idea is clearly doomed to failure.  A better solution would have been for me just to pull out some names from a tombola and throw them on the floor and see which leagues they end up in.


 

 

 

Edited April 24, 2020 by mcruic

[welshbairn]

Not new this, but Banks o Dee chairman paying lip service to the pyramid (probably to keep their Scottish Cup place), whilst making it clear they'll use any excuse to avoid promotion.

https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/fp/sport/football/highland-league/dee-chief-welcomes-tier-six-chance-to-step-up-to-highland-league/

[Cyclizine]

1 hour ago, welshbairn said:

Not new this, but Banks o Dee chairman paying lip service to the pyramid (probably to keep their Scottish Cup place), whilst making it clear they'll use any excuse to avoid promotion.

https://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/fp/sport/football/highland-league/dee-chief-welcomes-tier-six-chance-to-step-up-to-highland-league/

He's also ignoring the fact that all Banks o' Dee have had to do since they got their licence is apply to join the Highland League. They're a licensed club, in the HFL's territory and the league is running three short of their announced maximum of twenty. Refusing them access would jeopardise the HFL's position as a pyramid league.

The Dee are happy to continue being the big fish in the small pond: hoovering up the titles and trophies, but not willing to test themselves at a higher level where they might be found wanting.

[welshbairn]

9 minutes ago, Cyclizine said:

He's also ignoring the fact that all Banks o' Dee have had to do since they got their licence is apply to join the Highland League. They're a licensed club, in the HFL's territory and the league is running three short of their announced maximum of twenty. Refusing them access would jeopardise the HFL's position as a pyramid league.

The Dee are happy to continue being the big fish in the small pond: hoovering up the titles and trophies, but not willing to test themselves at a higher level where they might be found wanting.

I don't really get where he's coming from, by their performances against HL teams in cup games over the last few years they'd easily make the top 6. I can only think he's still in a huff from when they put a half arsed and late application in for the last entry round, and were ignored in favour of the very keen Turriff, Formartine and Strathspey.

Edited April 27, 2020 by welshbairn

[FairWeatherFan]

3 minutes ago, Cyclizine said:

He's also ignoring the fact that all Banks o' Dee have had to do since they got their licence is apply to join the Highland League. They're a licensed club, in the HFL's territory and the league is running three short of their announced maximum of twenty. Refusing them access would jeopardise the HFL's position as a pyramid league.

The Dee are happy to continue being the big fish in the small pond: hoovering up the titles and trophies, but not willing to test themselves at a higher level where they might be found wanting.

I know, he's still parroting the line about having to be asked to join.

[FairWeatherFan]

Just now, welshbairn said:

I don't really get where he's coming from, by their performances against HL teams in cup games over the last few years they'd easily make the top 6. I can only think he's still in a huff from when they put a half arsed and late application in for the last entry round, and were ignored in favour of the very keen Turriff, Foremartine and Strathspey.

They're in their own little fiefdom. Likely to be awarded the league this year for 5 in a row. Don't have to worry about stretching themselves. Maybe fancy a run at the Junior Cup now that they're one of the big fishes in an ever decreasing pond.

[welshbairn]

19 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

They're in their own little fiefdom. Likely to be awarded the league this year for 5 in a row. Don't have to worry about stretching themselves. Maybe fancy a run at the Junior Cup now that they're one of the big fishes in an ever decreasing pond.

He was whining about having to buy more diesel for the bus if they joined the HL last summer.

[FairWeatherFan]

26 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

He was whining about having to buy more diesel for the bus if they joined the HL last summer.

And looking at things they have no intention of applying of the Highland League this year either. Probably one of the few people thankful that COVID19 came along and they can hide behind that as an excuse.

[welshbairn]

1 minute ago, FairWeatherFan said:

And looking at things they have no intention of applying of the Highland League this year either. Probably one of the few people thankful that COVID19 came along and they can hide behind that as an excuse.

Daft thing is that there isn't any team in the country that get a year's warning that they'll get promoted so they can plan and budget accordingly. He's so arrogant after massively outspending every other team in the North Juniors that the mere question of winning the league isn't an issue.

[jamamafegan]

That's utterly pathetic stuff from the Banks O' Dee chairman. It's obvious he's trying to somehow blame the HL for them not being a member of the league. "In  2015, 16, 17 and 18 there might have been a chance for us to join" and "we didn't know about the opportunities." All complete bullshit isn't it, if they had any serious intentions of joining the league they would have applied to join just like any other club would do. Ridiculous excuses. Hope they enjoy getting left behind!

[jamamafegan]

On another note, if the NCL was to join at tier  6 and Thurso met Wick if one of the sides got promoted/relegated - is that a derby? Being the two big towns from the area I've always assumed there would be some sort of rivalry there.

[welshbairn]

17 minutes ago, jamamafegan said:

On another note, if the NCL was to join at tier  6 and Thurso met Wick if one of the sides got promoted/relegated - is that a derby? Being the two big towns from the area I've always assumed there would be some sort of rivalry there.

Don't think they've ever played in the same league and it doesn't look like happening anytime soon, doubt there's enough players up there for 2 HL level teams. Wick's games against Brora can get a bit spicy, I remember the Brora bus getting bricked a couple of years ago as they left town.

[Jimmy Shaker]

Laughable stuff from a clown of a chairman at a circus of a club.

[GNU_Linux]

Have Banks 'O Dee always been the biggest junior club up north? Going through their wiki they did well during the north-east junior league era with 11 titles plus 7 from the Aberdeenshire & District era.

[TheScarf]

4 minutes ago, GNU_Linux said:

Have Banks 'O Dee always been the biggest junior club up north? Going through their wiki they did well during the north-east junior league era with 11 titles plus 7 from the Aberdeenshire & District era.

Sunnybank were the boys about 10 years ago, basically doing that Banks O'Dee are doing now.  Think they had money issues and all their players left.

[Cyclizine]

52 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

Sunnybank were the boys about 10 years ago, basically doing that Banks O'Dee are doing now.  Think they had money issues and all their players left.

Agreed, I always remember Sunnybank as being the big boys back in the day. Banks o' Dee a close second. Culter had a good few seasons 15 years ago or so, but are a distant third.