Florentine_Pogen Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 It's always possible her career would benefit more from skewering Johnson with the facts.True, but what intrigues me is from where is she getting her 'facts'. So much of this shit show is already in the public domain and Cummings is the elephant in the room for her, I'd suggest.ETA- just remembered, Cummings might be asked to 'give evidence' to Gray......... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theyellowbox Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Detournement said: A literal Red Tory. Starmer is depoliticising England exactly the way Sturgeon has defanged. You either have the cruel pro business anti worker party or the woke pro business anti worker party. We used to laugh at Americans over this. The reality is though that if there was a demand for parties in the way you imply the people want, they'd exist. It's not like generations gone where the workers has no rights and no votes. If the majority of the population wanted labour or any other party to be as they were in the past, then that is where they'd be. Society is in such a place that because if the success of Labour of old, they are to a degree obsolete. That is good in a way is it not? Whether we all like it or not, the vast majority of the population are socially and politically in a pretty narrow band, with the extremes to the right and left being minorities to varying degrees. Edited January 19, 2022 by Theyellowbox 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theyellowbox Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 21 minutes ago, Florentine_Pogen said: True, but what intrigues me is from where is she getting her 'facts'. So much of this shit show is already in the public domain and Cummings is the elephant in the room for her, I'd suggest. ETA- just remembered, Cummings might be asked to 'give evidence' to Gray......... You would have to assume that if she is the type of character described by those in the know, she wouldn't look too kindly on multiple versions of the 'truth' from multiple people. What will be interesting is if she makes any reference as to when information was provided to her. For example, I'd she found out the details of the 20th May parties at the same time we all did, does she make reference to the govt not being forthcoming about additional parties? If I was her, my fear would be that she publishes report and within hours, media drop more evidence that no one has made her aware of. To that end, she may want to cover herself by identifying where and who was obstructive and not forthcoming with info. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florentine_Pogen Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 "Tory MP Jonathan Gullis claims on@skynews that MPs are withdrawing letters from Sir Graham Brady But admitted on air to me he doesn’t know who those individuals are or how many there are and says he hasn’t spoken to any such individuals directly"..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soapy FFC Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 34 minutes ago, Florentine_Pogen said: "Tory MP Jonathan Gullis claims on@skynews that MPs are withdrawing letters from Sir Graham Brady But admitted on air to me he doesn’t know who those individuals are or how many there are and says he hasn’t spoken to any such individuals directly"..... In other words, make something up then say it as a statement of fact. Straight out of the Boris Johnson playbook. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theyellowbox Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 13 minutes ago, Soapy FFC said: In other words, make something up then say it as a statement of fact. Straight out of the Boris Johnson playbook. The aim of that of course is that it makes other MPs who maybe do believe him think twice on whether to put a letter in or not. Labour are doing similar by eluding to other potential defectors. Safe to say Westminster is currently akin cold War Berlin where misinformation, potential defections and half truths have everyone confused while trying to seem in control and knowledgeable. I suspect the number of submitted letters is short of required, but very very close and a few more making their move will change everything. Gut feel is that the majority of Tory mp's want him gone privately, but need the sue gray report to seal his demise. To call for him to go before the report risks enough of them bring unsure if report will tell them something to get him out if jail or not, so will err on side of caution. For the 3rd time this century, potentially a small band of tories get to choose the next PM. Democracy eh... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 (edited) If they are struggling to get 54 letters in during this media storm it seems unlikely he would lose the vote. There is a lot of talk about Red Wall MPs but how many of them want Sunak who is a deficit hawk? Other than the likes of Jeremy Hunt or that evil Kearns most of them will be thinking better the devil you know and probably that if they need to they can empty Boris later this year and pin the problems with the economy on him as well. Edited January 19, 2022 by Detournement 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theyellowbox Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Detournement said: If they are struggling to get 54 letters in during this media storm it seems unlikely he would lose the vote. There is a lot of talk about Red Wall MPs but how many of them want Sunak who is a deficit hawk? Other than the likes of Jeremy Hunt or that evil Kearns most of them will be thinking better the devil you know and probably that if they need to they can empty Boris later this year and pin the problems with the economy on him as well. Very good point. They may well want to blame all ills on him later this year. The only problem with that is to get him to survive that long they either need to back him publicly or remain silent at least. That is political capital against all of them at next election. Eg tory mp x supported Boris while your relatives lied etc etc. Tough decisions for them all to make. Edited January 19, 2022 by Theyellowbox 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 People aren't going to care about these parties next month nevermind the next election. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 19 minutes ago, Detournement said: People aren't going to care about these parties next month nevermind the next election. Not enough people are going to care about these parties next month, never mind the next election to make any difference, especially if the tabloids forget about them (the parties). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 4 hours ago, Granny Danger said: Doesn’t say much for Labour when a Tory can feel so comfortable in their ranks. It says they have appeal beyond a small sect. When they are at their best you should see defections from tories and lib dems. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 Just now, scottsdad said: It says they have appeal beyond a small sect. When they are at their best you should see defections from tories and lib dems. Not sure you understand how politics works. Yes, they should have appeal “beyond a small sect”. No they should not have appeal to anyone who was willing to fight the 2019 GE on the Tory manifesto. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrewDon Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 4 hours ago, DrewDon said: They've even done the staged contract signing. Starmer obviously inspired by his appearance on Football Cliches last week. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 2 minutes ago, Granny Danger said: Not sure you understand how politics works. Yes, they should have appeal “beyond a small sect”. No they should not have appeal to anyone who was willing to fight the 2019 GE on the Tory manifesto. But they do want to appeal to anyone who was willing to vote for the Tory manifesto in 2019. They need to. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Granny Danger said: Not sure you understand how politics works. Yes, they should have appeal “beyond a small sect”. No they should not have appeal to anyone who was willing to fight the 2019 GE on the Tory manifesto. Maybe the guy has re-evaluated what he considers to be important, thought deeply about his own personal morality and decided that he wants to be a better person. Or maybe he's a scabby rat deserting a sinking ship who'll believe anything for an MP's salary. Probably the first one, i'm sure. Edited January 19, 2022 by coprolite 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 3 minutes ago, coprolite said: Maybe the guy has re-evaluated what he considers to be important, thought deeply about his own personal morality and decided that he wants to be a better person. Or maybe he's a scabby rat deserting a sinking ship who'll believe anything for an MP's salary. Probably the first one, i'm sure. 400 odd majority in the seat has nothing to do with it either 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
btb Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 1 hour ago, Detournement said: If they are struggling to get 54 letters in during this media storm it seems unlikely he would lose the vote. Theresa May was a dead (wo)man walking for about two years after the 2017 GE and there was a lot of hokey-cokey with letters to the 1922 committee (including a red-face moment for JRM* when he thought they had the numbers to force a ballot but didn't) before she finally faced a vote which she won - it didn't save her for long though as she resigned after a coupla bad elections results about 6 months later. * The same JRM who reckons DRoss should be loyal to his party leader. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 59 minutes ago, scottsdad said: But they do want to appeal to anyone who was willing to vote for the Tory manifesto in 2019. They need to. I think there’s a huge difference between changing your position as a voter and as a sitting MP. Views on specific issues can change over time and with it party affiliation, but for the basic core values of this guy to change in 13 months takes some believing. I don’t blame Labour for accepting him, it’s a huge embarrassment to the Tories at a time their leader is under severe pressure. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sophia Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 I back my mate Borisy to turn it around. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted January 19, 2022 Share Posted January 19, 2022 -35 approval rating in the gammon red wall seats, dragging the local Tories down with him. That's the only real incentive for them to get him punted. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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