Indyref2 -alternative

[D.A.F.C]

I thought it was 40% yes?

I'm still to be convinced that independence would be any better than a no deal brexit.
Both are full of whatabootery and unknowns.
The vocal minority in Scotland think that independence is the view of most of scotland when that's not true.

[Tibbermoresaint]

3 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

I thought it was 40% yes?

I'm still to be convinced that independence would be any better than a no deal brexit.
Both are full of whatabootery and unknowns.
The vocal minority in Scotland think that independence is the view of most of scotland when that's not true.

There are roughly 200 independent countries. What exactly is unknown about independence?

[D.A.F.C]

1 hour ago, Tibbermoresaint said:

There are roughly 200 independent countries. What exactly is unknown about independence?

Can we join the EU

what currency will we use

what magical funds will appear if we go independent 

how long will it take

will the value of savings go down 

borders, economic and real

 

just for starters

[Tibbermoresaint]

3 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

Can we join the EU

what currency will we use

what magical funds will appear if we go independent 

how long will it take

will the value of savings go down 

borders, economic and real

 

just for starters

What have other countries done?

[DeeTillEhDeh]

My opinion is we are going to have to wait until the next Holyrood election, or the next Westminster one (If that comes first). If the mandate is there to hold another referendum then not even this bunch of scumbags could deny it.  Yes I know we already have that mandate, but to have it rubber stamped, after being front and centre of a manifesto, that the people of Scotland have voted in favour of IndyRef2, is something not even the most hard nosed of Tory fuckers could turn their back on. Failing that complete anarchy (Hiya GCHQ, Hiya pals)

 

 

There is route that doesn't involve waiting too long - so long as the Greens are on board.  

 

 

Vote for a Section 40 order.

 

The Buffoon rejects it.

 

Sturgeon resigns as First Minister.

 

If after 28 days no successor is elected then the Presiding Officer would ask for Parliament to be dissolved under s3(1)a.

 

SNP and Greens campaign on an IndyRef2 manifesto - I genuinely believe they could get a majority, especially if Farage's mob split the Unionist vote in the Constituencies.

 

 

 

 

 

[D.A.F.C]

39 minutes ago, Tibbermoresaint said:

What have other countries done?

What does Scotland have to offer. f**k all.

[Tibbermoresaint]

4 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

What does Scotland have to offer. f**k all.

I'm done with you.

[D.A.F.C]

Just now, Tibbermoresaint said:

I'm done with you.

We receive more per head than the rest of the UK but still have managed to have a larger deficit than the rest of the UK. Four times as much.

The oil revenue slumped and if we had have went independent then it would have been very dodgy indeed.

Take a look around the SNP by freezing council tax have actually done more harm than good. Free prescriptions and university fees. Who is going to pay for all this? What exactly will change in an independent Scotland? It is possible that we could become a backdoor into England for trade if they leave the EU and we stay. Conversely we will be independent of our largest trading partner.

The UK is skint and leaving it doesn’t change much. I’d rather wait a few years and see how brexit pans out. The noisy minority will come to realise that Scotland doesn’t want it.

[Ira Gaines]

12 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

LOOK AT MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

 

[D.A.F.C]

11 minutes ago, MixuFixit said:

These are just my inexpert thoughts but:

Yes, we've satisfied the requirements for decades, why would that change.

Pound initially, an independent currency after some time.

Heavy borrowing is inevitable post independence, that's fine though.

From a yes vote to a national bank and Scottish currency, 5-10 years.

I don't see why, the value of the things your bank invests in in order to give you your saving interest wouldn't be changed substantially.

Whatever the Irish experience shows will be our experience too in the short term. England's current identity crisis will be a chapter in a history book though. Reality means a hard border cannot be sustained on an island like ours and if anything Scottish independence might accelerate England snapping out of it.
 

This is all 100% confirmed aye?

[D.A.F.C]

Here comes the angry loud minority. Keep shouting others down. 

Truth hurts.

[Jambomo]

We receive more per head than the rest of the UK but still have managed to have a larger deficit than the rest of the UK. Four times as much.
The oil revenue slumped and if we had have went independent then it would have been very dodgy indeed.
Take a look around the SNP by freezing council tax have actually done more harm than good. Free prescriptions and university fees. Who is going to pay for all this? What exactly will change in an independent Scotland? It is possible that we could become a backdoor into England for trade if they leave the EU and we stay. Conversely we will be independent of our largest trading partner.
The UK is skint and leaving it doesn’t change much. I’d rather wait a few years and see how brexit pans out. The noisy minority will come to realise that Scotland doesn’t want it.

Once the economic reality of Brexit starts to bite, there is a good case for arguing that the current levels of trade with England will not remain at today’s levels. The things you list will go because the UK want them to go, they want to sell them and Scotland will not be exempt from that.

The point of an Independent Scotland now is no longer about avoiding financial chaos, because financial chaos is coming anyway. Now the point is finding what will be our best hope of recovery. A stable EU with a number of members for support and trade or a failing single economy where we are tied only with history.

Leaving the UK will change everything.

[D.A.F.C]

Just now, MixuFixit said:

As I said my inexpert opinions. If you have strong views to the contrary I'm fine hearing them.

Look at the mess of brexit. It’s not going to be easy. I’m not saying you’re wrong and what you say seems logical but none of it is confirmed. The idea of nations controlling events is over. Salmond and the SNP backed banking as the future of Scotland and a world leader but it was built on sand.

I think most people have had enough political turmoil and the SNP shouldn’t forget that the only reason they are in power was due to the total ineptitude of Labour and as such it was a protest vote. That never meant it any stage that Scotland actually wanted independence.

sorry if that offends some of the more militant yes voters. I try to be proud of Scotland and I see some positive things but mostly it’s bad at the moment. 

[The_Kincardine]

1 minute ago, Jambomo said:

The point of an Independent Scotland now is no longer about avoiding financial chaos, because financial chaos is coming anyway. Now the point is finding what will be our best hope of recovery. A stable EU with a number of members for support and trade or a failing single economy where we are tied only with history.

Leaving the UK will change everything.

 

I have a lot of sympathy for this view but for one thing - The SNP/Independent Scotland cannot deliver EU membership. 

[D.A.F.C]

4 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

 

Once the economic reality of Brexit starts to bite, there is a good case for arguing that the current levels of trade with England will not remain at today’s levels. The things you list will go because the UK want them to go, they want to sell them and Scotland will not be exempt from that.

The point of an Independent Scotland now is no longer about avoiding financial chaos, because financial chaos is coming anyway. Now the point is finding what will be our best hope of recovery. A stable EU with a number of members for support and trade or a failing single economy where we are tied only with history.

Leaving the UK will change everything.

 

So independence will cause financial chaos? Better off with one financial meltdown than two then? Brexit will happen and it will be a no deal. Going independent after that will cause further chaos. If we had a deal to leave at the same time then ok that would be worth a gamble.

[ICTJohnboy]

7 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

Look at the mess of brexit. It’s not going to be easy. I’m not saying you’re wrong and what you say seems logical but none of it is confirmed. The idea of nations controlling events is over. Salmond and the SNP backed banking as the future of Scotland and a world leader but it was built on sand.

I think most people have had enough political turmoil and the SNP shouldn’t forget that the only reason they are in power was due to the total ineptitude of Labour and as such it was a protest vote. That never meant it any stage that Scotland actually wanted independence.

sorry if that offends some of the more militant yes voters. I try to be proud of Scotland and I see some positive things but mostly it’s bad at the moment. 

 

What a complete and utter load of unmitigated shite.

[Ira Gaines]

D.A.F.C. going in a wee bit heavy on his shitebag act here.

[D.A.F.C]

Not shitebaggery just being sensible. Even if you think you can win a battle you don’t just go steaming in with no plan.

If Brexit is a total disaster then I’m sure that independence could be an option but I can’t see it being on the table and also the other thing is that the majority of Scotland just doesn’t want it on the table at the moment.

The SNP will take a major hit in the next election anyway.

[Jambomo]

So independence will cause financial chaos? Better off with one financial meltdown than two then? Brexit will happen and it will be a no deal. Going independent after that will cause further chaos. If we had a deal to leave at the same time then ok that would be worth a gamble.

No, Brexit will cause financial chaos. You aren’t getting two lots of chaos, chaos is simply that - chaos.

Independence and working with the EU would IMO, actually lessen the chaos because there will be the option of some economic stability and assistance. We will get nothing of the sort from Westminster whether we remain with them or not, look how they behave towards Scotland just now, total derision.

[Dunfermline Don]

Not shitebaggery just being sensible. Even if you think you can win a battle you don’t just go steaming in with no plan.

 

 

So do you think the Leave campaign had any plan other the current omnishambles we find ourselves in?