Do You Support Scottish Sides in Europe?

[Greenlantern]

It's not competitive sport. It's sport driven by commercialism rather than by competition.
Did you know that revenue from merchandise is split equally among NFL clubs? If you buy a Cowboys jersey in LA, the money is split evenly among all 32 clubs. The only money NFL clubs raise and keep for themselves is matchday revenue and corporate sponsorship. Everything else - TV, merchandise and licensing - is split equally regardless of performance, number of viewers in Texas, number of shirts sold.
Imagine the profit from every sellick tap was split 12 ways, or 42 ways equally across Scotland. Imagine UEFA's 2.73 billion Euros from the TV rights for club competitions was split equally among participants.
The way things are isn't the way they have to be. More people watch sport when it's competitive than when it's predictable, and Scottish football has been locked in a death-grip for half a lifetime. Your assumption that "this is how sport is, if you don't like it piss off" is really naive.

And yet cheering on Sarajevo in Glasgow isn’t at all naive.

[GordonS]

3 hours ago, craigkillie said:

And imagine Arbroath could just up sticks and move to East Kilbride or Bathgate because there was a bigger market there.

Airdrie, Clyde, Livingston...

[GordonS]

54 minutes ago, Greenlantern said:

 

And yet cheering on Sarajevo in Glasgow isn’t at all naive.

 

You're correct. It isn't. It's not in the best interests fo Celtic, but it's definitely in the best interests of anyone who wants Scottish football to be more than a two horse race.

Come to think of it, I could maybe live with a two horse race if both horses weren't arseholes that keep biting each other.

[GordonS]

2 hours ago, Spring Onion said:

What if your not one of the chosen 32 teams? Small town team wanting to climb into this nirvana of fairness and opportunity? 

You could set up your own league...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XFL_(2020) 

[Blootoon87]

Not anymore. That Killie result has pissed me right off. We should just stop playing European football, it's too embarrassing.

[GordonS]

3 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

A 32 team closed shop spread across a continent

American football doesn't really have the player base for much else. They do however have a ridiculously thriving college football scene with average attendances comparable to the biggest teams in the world, and the XFL starting next year.

Plus 32 teams isn't a very small closed shop, it's more than are effectively in the Champions League gang and that's across a continent of 500 million citizens.

[Greenlantern]

You're correct. It isn't. It's not in the best interests fo Celtic, but it's definitely in the best interests of anyone who wants Scottish football to be more than a two horse race.
Come to think of it, I could maybe live with a two horse race if both horses weren't arseholes that keep biting each other.

There’s a lot wrong with professional football, I’ve no hesitation in admitting.

I’d also like to see Scottish football flourish. However in this current environment we find ourselves in, pressing the self-destruct button won’t really benefit anyone.

[FairWeatherFan]

42 minutes ago, GordonS said:

American football doesn't really have the player base for much else. They do however have a ridiculously thriving college football scene with average attendances comparable to the biggest teams in the world, and the XFL starting next year.

Plus 32 teams isn't a very small closed shop, it's more than are effectively in the Champions League gang and that's across a continent of 500 million citizens.

College Football at FBS level and the NFL go hand in hand. It's one of the reasons why there's never been a sustained professional league below the NFL. The two systems swallow up all the media and don't leave much breathing space for anyone else. All the while avoiding competing against each other.

And what I was going for in my original post is more that the CL elite are the ones that more likely to take inspiration from the NFL's methods than for Scottish Football to do the same.

[Monkey Tennis]

On 18/07/2019 at 12:07, Greenlantern said:

MT you should avoid competitive sports, especially professional football. For the sake of your sanity.

That's probably the most unintentionally ironic post I've ever seen on here.

I'm very clearly the one who wants Scottish football to be competitive, while you back a set up that simply cannot allow that to be the case.

It's honestly unbelievable that you introduced the idea of competitiveness in a bid to support your argument.  Such folly.  Incredible.

Edited July 19, 2019 by Monkey Tennis

[Jacksgranda]

16 hours ago, GordonS said:

You're correct. It isn't. It's not in the best interests fo Celtic, but it's definitely in the best interests of anyone who wants Scottish football to be more than a two horse race.

Come to think of it, I could maybe live with a two horse race if both horses weren't arseholes that keep biting each other.

Arseholes with teeth? "shudder"

[Dons_1988]

32 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

Arseholes with teeth? "shudder"

You wanting to tell us something?

[Monkey Tennis]

22 hours ago, craigkillie said:

And imagine Arbroath could just up sticks and move to East Kilbride or Bathgate because there was a bigger market there.

And here we have the 'all or nothing' drivel that so many P&B contributors specialise in.

Because not everything from the NFL  set-up is directly transferable in a positive way to our game for obvious reasons, we can learn nothing about the idea of working to ensure a more level playing field.  Instead we must ignore the central point in the post which was that football needn't be this distorted.  Indeed we must embrace and support something that serves to make genuine competition for prizes impossible.  

It's the same logic that sees me portrayed as a communist for suggesting it's maybe not the best idea if our richest club gets given £20m.  I think it's fair to say that the Overton window has done some shifting in recent years.

[craigkillie]

43 minutes ago, Monkey Tennis said:

And here we have the 'all or nothing' drivel that so many P&B contributors specialise in.

Because not everything from the NFL  set-up is directly transferable in a positive way to our game for obvious reasons, we can learn nothing about the idea of working to ensure a more level playing field.  Instead we must ignore the central point in the post which was that football needn't be this distorted.  Indeed we must embrace and support something that serves to make genuine competition for prizes impossible.  

It's the same logic that sees me portrayed as a communist for suggesting it's maybe not the best idea if our richest club gets given £20m.  I think it's fair to say that the Overton window has done some shifting in recent years.

The previous poster didn't mention a single negative about the American system (of which there are plenty), so I was seeking to provide balance. Unsurprisingly you had no issue with his lengthy paean to US sport, but did have an issue with the brief post pointing out one of the negatives.

[Greenlantern]

That's probably the most unintentionally ironic post I've ever seen on here.
I'm very clearly the one who wants Scottish football to be competitive, while you back a set up that simply cannot allow that to be the case.
It's honestly unbelievable that you introduced the idea of competitiveness in a bid to support your argument.  Such folly.  Incredible.

When you say “back a set up” the alternative being; screaming at your telly for opposing nation clubs to win a game of football?

[Monkey Tennis]

12 hours ago, Greenlantern said:

 

When you say “back a set up” the alternative being; screaming at your telly for opposing nation clubs to win a game of football?

 

I was referring more to our posts on here.  I'm not pretending however, that they're of any consequence.

I know what side I'm on though and it's the one concerned with our game being more competitive.

[Monkey Tennis]

13 hours ago, craigkillie said:

The previous poster didn't mention a single negative about the American system (of which there are plenty), so I was seeking to provide balance. Unsurprisingly you had no issue with his lengthy paean to US sport, but did have an issue with the brief post pointing out one of the negatives.

You missed/ignored the central point of his post which was contained in its final paragraph: "The way things are isn't the way they have to be".

He's right.  

[Melanius Mullarkey]

16 hours ago, Dons_1988 said:

You wanting to tell us something?

Sounds like he’s sat on his falsers again.

[gannonball]

On 18/07/2019 at 17:47, GordonS said:

It's not competitive sport. It's sport driven by commercialism rather than by competition.

Did you know that revenue from merchandise is split equally among NFL clubs? If you buy a Cowboys jersey in LA, the money is split evenly among all 32 clubs. The only money NFL clubs raise and keep for themselves is matchday revenue and corporate sponsorship. Everything else - TV, merchandise and licensing - is split equally regardless of performance, number of viewers in Texas, number of shirts sold.

Imagine the profit from every sellick tap was split 12 ways, or 42 ways equally across Scotland. Imagine UEFA's 2.73 billion Euros from the TV rights for club competitions was split equally among participants.

The way things are isn't the way they have to be. More people watch sport when it's competitive than when it's predictable, and Scottish football has been locked in a death-grip for half a lifetime. Your assumption that "this is how sport is, if you don't like it piss off" is really naive.

That competitive nobody can really be promoted or relegated? A boys club if there ever was one in sport.

[wastecoatwilly]

From supporting Scots clubs in Europe to american football is worst than the fecking egg chasers. 

[sparky88]

On 18/07/2019 at 18:00, craigkillie said:

And imagine Arbroath could just up sticks and move to East Kilbride or Bathgate because there was a bigger market there.

Prior to promotion and relegation to the fourth tier, Scottish football effectively was a franchise system. At least one without the equalization if incomes and salary caps etc. 

 

For example, Annan owe their place in the league to the fact the SFL wanted a geographic spread of clubs at the time.