Billy Gilmour

[Bing.McCrosby]

3 hours ago, Satoshi said:

When has he not performed? De Zerbi praised his training then his match performance.

This thing on size is complete nonsense too, unlike most sports you can be an excellent footballer despite being quite short. Many players shorter than Gilmour have succeeded, and it hasn't stopped him being signed for millions in the EPL. He's barely in his 20s and will already be a millionaire.

Think he's doing alright.

The most feeble comment on Scottish football has always been that the youth football only focuses on physical traits, have you seen our teams? Ryan Fraser is the shortest player in the EPL.

Not like you to completely miss the point and change the point to something else

Nobody is saying you can't be short and be a good footballer.

However a team of players gilmour or messi's size isn't going to do well.

If you put 2 teams of exactly equal abilities on a pitch but one teams bigger and stronger, then that team will win. Im not sure whats controversial or unclear about that.

[Satoshi]

Oh yeah a team of Messi would be dreadful.

Good lord.

Give me a team of Messi over a team of any other player.

If the smaller team is faster and more agile they might win.

The body fat percentage and muscle mass index will be maximised for all top level players, and if they are good professionals they will stay within that range. I'm sure Iniesta could have bulked up to look like Tevez if he really wanted to, but it would make him a worse player so he didn't.

Tim Wiese moved into bodybuilding after being a footballer. As a footballer, even a goalkeeper, he had to keep his muscle mass down.

So Gilmour, like all top players will have sports scientists advising him on his physical condition. He should (and will) listen to them. Does anyone disagree with that?

Middle aged das on the on the internet saying he needs to bulk up should have their antiquated views safely put in the bin where they belong.

[HalfCutNinja]

3 hours ago, Satoshi said:

How would you know?

All top level players will have personal development plans based on a number of metrics including their physical characteristics.

If the coaches think Gilmour should be increasing weight and muscle mass then he will be doing it. If they would rather he focus on agility and mobility then he will be doing that. Peoples bodies mature at different ages and I'm sure they take that into account too.

Brighton would have known Gilmours physical stats (in great detail) during the medical and signed him anyway.

They know much better than some guy on the internet who has only ever seen him play on TV.

And your statement the players have to be strong seems pretty ludicrous unless you qualify what strong is, Pirlo was openly disdainful of stuff like warm ups but seemed to do okay. At 68kg can't imagine he spent too much time on weight training. Gilmour is currently 60kg (according to the internet) 6 kg less than Modric and 2kg more than Lingard. Juan Mata was 61kg.

In isolation the figures mean nothing though, the clubs will know a players optimal weight and will measure him against that.

I can tell. Keep an eye on it through his career. It's a problem for him. People are built different physically, some just don't quite have it at the very top level. Gilmour is giving indications he might be like that. Also defensively he is..... well horrific. Miles and miles and miles off where he needs to be.

These two things are going to be huge problems for him. Though one of them is an easy fix. 

Of course they know better than me. But if there wasn't an issue it wouldn't have affected his game time the last 18 months. Yet it has.

[HalfCutNinja]

1 hour ago, Satoshi said:

Oh yeah a team of Messi would be dreadful.

Good lord.

Give me a team of Messi over a team of any other player.

If the smaller team is faster and more agile they might win.

The body fat percentage and muscle mass index will be maximised for all top level players, and if they are good professionals they will stay within that range. I'm sure Iniesta could have bulked up to look like Tevez if he really wanted to, but it would make him a worse player so he didn't.

Tim Wiese moved into bodybuilding after being a footballer. As a footballer, even a goalkeeper, he had to keep his muscle mass down.

So Gilmour, like all top players will have sports scientists advising him on his physical condition. He should (and will) listen to them. Does anyone disagree with that?

Middle aged das on the on the internet saying he needs to bulk up should have their antiquated views safely put in the bin where they belong.

No mate a team of Messi's would get battered in both senses of the word. Physicality is part of the game. You're getting a bit arsey at people making valid and legitimate points. It's not Da's. Go and listen to any top player talk about any other top player. I guarantee you they use the word 'strong' cause it really does matter. You can be as skillful as you want if you can't hold people, strong and competitive people, off then it doesn't matter. They'll just take the ball off you.

It's interesting you mention Iniesta actually. I always thought he was slightly built and small. I was absolutely amazed the first time I saw him live how strong he was. Him in particular I've told that story about many times. To see him waltzing past two or three big tough guys and have the strength to hold them off was quite remarkable to witness.

Messi commonly is called freakishly strong too by colleagues. But his size would mean a team that size would get rinsed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bing.McCrosby]

1 hour ago, Satoshi said:

Oh yeah a team of Messi would be dreadful.

Good lord.

Give me a team of Messi over a team of any other player.

If the smaller team is faster and more agile they might win.

The body fat percentage and muscle mass index will be maximised for all top level players, and if they are good professionals they will stay within that range. I'm sure Iniesta could have bulked up to look like Tevez if he really wanted to, but it would make him a worse player so he didn't.

Tim Wiese moved into bodybuilding after being a footballer. As a footballer, even a goalkeeper, he had to keep his muscle mass down.

So Gilmour, like all top players will have sports scientists advising him on his physical condition. He should (and will) listen to them. Does anyone disagree with that?

Middle aged das on the on the internet saying he needs to bulk up should have their antiquated views safely put in the bin where they belong.

So you think gilmour is being advised to keep his body mass down?

Again you have completely changed the point to suit yourself. It was to teams of equal abilities. So a team of messi's against a team of 6tf messi's. You changed the point because its obvious im correct.

A team of messi's tho would struggle to deal with basic crosses and long balls. Never mind high shots.

There is a reason why center backs and goalkeepers are big. Its a massive advantage. Its an advantage to be big in any position.

[Satoshi]

1 hour ago, HalfCutNinja said:

No mate a team of Messi's would get battered in both senses of the word. Physicality is part of the game. You're getting a bit arsey at people making valid and legitimate points. It's not Da's. Go and listen to any top player talk about any other top player. I guarantee you they use the word 'strong' cause it really does matter. You can be as skillful as you want if you can't hold people, strong and competitive people, off then it doesn't matter. They'll just take the ball off you.

It's interesting you mention Iniesta actually. I always thought he was slightly built and small. I was absolutely amazed the first time I saw him live how strong he was. Him in particular I've told that story about many times. To see him waltzing past two or three big tough guys and have the strength to hold them off was quite remarkable to witness.

Messi commonly is called freakishly strong too by colleagues. But his size would mean a team that size would get rinsed.

 

So which team of x player would beat a team of Messis exactly?

A team of Jordan Henderson's?

40 minutes ago, BingMcCrosby said:

So you think gilmour is being advised to keep his body mass down?

Again you have completely changed the point to suit yourself. It was to teams of equal abilities. So a team of messi's against a team of 6tf messi's. You changed the point because its obvious im correct.

A team of messi's tho would struggle to deal with basic crosses and long balls. Never mind high shots.

There is a reason why center backs and goalkeepers are big. Its a massive advantage. Its an advantage to be big in any position.

I have no idea what Gilmour is being asked to do as part of his personal development plan. Neither do you.

I'm virtually certain it won't be gain 10kg. And if it was he could do it easily, if I could do it easily I'm fairly sure professional athletes could as well.

I'm not surprised you get it totally wrong about size too. The world's best player of all time, Messi is short. Maradona was short. Pele wasnt tall. Baresi wasn't tall. Frankly, that's all the evidence you need. If it was such a massive advantage the best players would all be tall. They are not, most of the best players of all time are of average height or shorter.

Having a low centre of gravity helps in football. Being smaller helps with acceleration and agility.

A good team will have a mixture of body sizes as, obviously, being taller helps in some positions.

It's all irrelevant to Gilmour though as it doesn't really help in his position. If his coaches want him to gain weight and muscle he will be. If they don't he won't. Any idiot can lift weights in a gym for a few hours a day. If the coaches wanted it he will be.

The das saying he's too slight, obviously, know f**k all about his body shape and ideal weight / muscle distribution. The team who signed him for >£10m do and obviously don't view it as an impediment.

[HalfCutNinja]

8 minutes ago, Satoshi said:

So which team of x player would beat a team of Messis exactly?

A team of Jordan Henderson's?

I have no idea what Gilmour is being asked to do as part of his personal development plan. Neither do you.

I'm virtually certain it won't be gain 10kg. And if it was he could do it easily, if I could do it easily I'm fairly sure professional athletes could as well.

I'm not surprised you get it totally wrong about size too. The world's best player of all time, Messi is short. Maradona was short. Pele wasnt tall. Baresi wasn't tall. Frankly, that's all the evidence you need. If it was such a massive advantage the best players would all be tall. They are not, most of the best players of all time are of average height or shorter.

Having a low centre of gravity helps in football. Being smaller helps with acceleration and agility.

A good team will have a mixture of body sizes as, obviously, being taller helps in some positions.

It's all irrelevant to Gilmour though as it doesn't really help in his position. If his coaches want him to gain weight and muscle he will be. If they don't he won't. Any idiot can lift weights in a gym for a few hours a day. If the coaches wanted it he will be.

The das saying he's too slight, obviously, know f**k all about his body shape and ideal weight / muscle distribution. The team who signed him for >£10m do and obviously don't view it as an impediment.

You're getting completely the wrong end of the stick and don't really have a clue what you're talking about.

[Bing.McCrosby]

Just now, HalfCutNinja said:

You're getting completely the wrong end of the stick and don't really have a clue what you're talking about.

Thats a common theme with him

Just now, Satoshi said:

So which team of x player would beat a team of Messis exactly?

A team of Jordan Henderson's?

I have no idea what Gilmour is being asked to do as part of his personal development plan. Neither do you.

I'm virtually certain it won't be gain 10kg. And if it was he could do it easily, if I could do it easily I'm fairly sure professional athletes could as well.

I'm not surprised you get it totally wrong about size too. The world's best player of all time, Messi is short. Maradona was short. Pele wasnt tall. Baresi wasn't tall. Frankly, that's all the evidence you need. If it was such a massive advantage the best players would all be tall. They are not, most of the best players of all time are of average height or shorter.

Having a low centre of gravity helps in football. Being smaller helps with acceleration and agility.

A good team will have a mixture of body sizes as, obviously, being taller helps in some positions.

It's all irrelevant to Gilmour though as it doesn't really help in his position. If his coaches want him to gain weight and muscle he will be. If they don't he won't. Any idiot can lift weights in a gym for a few hours a day. If the coaches wanted it he will be.

The das saying he's too slight, obviously, know f**k all about his body shape and ideal weight / muscle distribution. The team who signed him for >£10m do and obviously don't view it as an impediment.

Again, nobody is saying a good player cant be small.

Its a team game, if you have a team of very small weaker players players they wouldn't be competitive. Im surprised this is even debatable.

[Bing.McCrosby]

Reported today Chelsea and Liverpool chasing Caicedo. Could be great news for young Bilmour.

[HalfCutNinja]

4 minutes ago, BingMcCrosby said:

Thats a common theme with him

Again, nobody is saying a good player cant be small.

Its a team game, if you have a team of very small weaker players players they wouldn't be competitive. Im surprised this is even debatable.

I watched one of those Si Ferry interviews can't remember what they're called with Barry Robson. It's always interesting to listen to an actual player talk about these things. They can give insights you could never get from just watching.

He was talking about playing against Barcelona with Celtic. Mentioned Ronaldinho. We all know how skillful and talented he was. Do you know what the first thing Robson mentioned about him? Said he has this huge arse that he uses to hold you off and you just can't get round him to get at the ball. Do you think there's a single fan in the world who would have identified that as one of his strengths? Of course not.

Heard the same thing about Zidane from Gary Neville I think it was. Couldn't believe how big he was. Skill is great but it has to be matched with a level of physicality or you just won't be a top player.

Gilmour has shown he's got it. But his lack of physicality may restrict the type of role and type of team he can play in. He'll need to drop off a wee bit to avoid direct physical confrontations cause he'll lose them. And in his position you have defensive responsibility, which will create a problem for him if he doesn't get stronger. Not necessarily much heavier, but if he isn't physically able to get much stronger in the frame that he's got that will be an issue for his ability to compete at the highest level.

[Loominous]

1 hour ago, BingMcCrosby said:

Its a team game, if you have a team of very small weaker players players they wouldn't be competitive. Im surprised this is even debatable.

Sort of like when a Female team plays against a Male team maybe?

[Satoshi]

3 hours ago, HalfCutNinja said:

You're getting completely the wrong end of the stick and don't really have a clue what you're talking about.

That will be why you didn't address a single point in my post then.

Smart enough to know you have no response, at least.

3 hours ago, BingMcCrosby said:

Thats a common theme with him

Again, nobody is saying a good player cant be small.

Its a team game, if you have a team of very small weaker players players they wouldn't be competitive. Im surprised this is even debatable.

So it's a yes on 11 x Jordan Henderson beating 11 x Messi? Wild.

Smaller, weaker players might (or might not) compensate by being faster and more agile. Paul Pogba is technically excellent and 6 foot 4, he is no where near as good a playmaker as Xavi or Pirlo (or many others). His height restricts him being as agile as shorter players. He spent his whole youth career dominating partly because of his size, he didn't need to develop his mind to work faster than those bigger than him.

But they both know that (or at least, they do now) hence why they don't respond to anything in my post.

Can we half more internet das commenting on the physiques of players? Half cut ninja knows more about Gilmours ideal muscle mass then the Brighton and Chelsea sports scientists, it seems.

Edited December 20, 2022 by Satoshi

[Bing.McCrosby]

1 hour ago, Loominous said:

Sort of like when a Female team plays against a Male team maybe?

I've never watched a male vs female match, I wasn't aware it was a thing. But its a good example, the best womans team in the world would struggle to beat an average mens team. They might be more skilled but would lose almost every challenge.

[Bing.McCrosby]

Just now, Satoshi said:

That will be why you didn't address a single point in my post then.

Smart enough to know you have no response, at least.

So it's a yes on 11 x Jordan Henderson beating 11 x Messi? Wild.

Smaller, weaker players might (or might not) compensate by being faster and more agile. Paul Pogba is technically excellent and 6 foot 4, he is no where near as good a playmaker as Xavi or Pirlo (or many others). His height restricts him being as agile as shorter players. He spent his whole youth career dominating partly because of his size, he didn't need to develop his mind to work faster than those bigger than him.

But they both know that (or at least, they do now) hence why they don't respond to anything in my post.

Can we half more internet das commenting on the physiques of players? Half cut ninja knows more about Gilmours ideal muscle mass then the Brighton and Chelsea sports scientists, it seems.

Ok quite simply, if you have 2 teams of equal abilities. One is taller and stronger and one is smaller and weaker. Who do you think would win??

[HalfCutNinja]

19 minutes ago, Satoshi said:

That will be why you didn't address a single point in my post then.

Smart enough to know you have no response, at least.

So it's a yes on 11 x Jordan Henderson beating 11 x Messi? Wild.

Smaller, weaker players might (or might not) compensate by being faster and more agile. Paul Pogba is technically excellent and 6 foot 4, he is no where near as good a playmaker as Xavi or Pirlo (or many others). His height restricts him being as agile as shorter players. He spent his whole youth career dominating partly because of his size, he didn't need to develop his mind to work faster than those bigger than him.

But they both know that (or at least, they do now) hence why they don't respond to anything in my post.

Can we half more internet das commenting on the physiques of players? Half cut ninja knows more about Gilmours ideal muscle mass then the Brighton and Chelsea sports scientists, it seems.

You mean Brighton and Chelsea who didn't give him a game yeah? I didn't address any of your 'points' cause they're drivel and life's too short.

[Bing.McCrosby]

Just now, HalfCutNinja said:

You mean Brighton and Chelsea who didn't give him a game yeah? I didn't address any of your 'points' cause they're drivel and life's too short.

Im finding it quite funny you being called out for saying gilmour would improve if he gains some muscle mass.

It must be the most obvious thing that literally anybody could pinpoint as an area for him to improve. Yet apparently its not

If gilmour wasn't on a program to do so at Chelsea and Brighton I'd be absolutely staggered.

[Crawford Bridge]

@HalfCutNinja What's all this "I heard so and so talk about it in an interview" pish all about?

Are you not pretending to be an ex-professional anymore?

[HalfCutNinja]

29 minutes ago, BingMcCrosby said:

Im finding it quite funny you being called out for saying gilmour would improve if he gains some muscle mass.

It must be the most obvious thing that literally anybody could pinpoint as an area for him to improve. Yet apparently its not

If gilmour wasn't on a program to do so at Chelsea and Brighton I'd be absolutely staggered.

Of course he is. That's normal. He will have been since he was about 18. If you look at the two players in front of him at Brighton that's the first and most obvious difference between him and them. They're absolute powerhouses, he's powderpuff.

You'd be delighted to be in direct opposition to him. Probably the easiest midfielder in the premiership to play against right now. That's why his managers don't play him in the premiership.

 

[HalfCutNinja]

10 minutes ago, Crawford Bridge said:

@HalfCutNinja What's all this "I heard so and so talk about it in an interview" pish all about?

Are you not pretending to be an ex-professional anymore?

Do you have any posts not solely about another poster?

[Crawford Bridge]

55 minutes ago, HalfCutNinja said:

Do you have any posts not solely about another poster?

Yes, Yes I do.

See how easy it is to answer a straight forward question? Let's see if you can manage it?

Are you not pretending to be an ex-professional anymore?