Detournement Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 36 minutes ago, Carnoustie Young Guvnor said: And he's the youngest player to ever play for Scotland u21s in history, and the youngest player ever to score for Scotland u21s too. How is that average? That's literally the precise opposite of average. I'm talking about his performances in the last few fixtures. He didn't take control of the games. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Fletcher was among the best players we had, we called him up, used him and his age and experience was irrelevant. Everyone is in agreement that Gilmour is probably 5th in line for a starting midfield spot, so we all agree he's among the best we've got. If McGinn doesn't make it through injury and McTominay picks up a knock, do you have Gilmour stepping in or do you pick MacLean/Jack/Shinnie? It was 17 years ago and has zero relevance to today. You're as well using Dennis Law as an example as well. 5 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Will he? I thought he was "bang average" for the U21s? Not sure we can use Billy in the June friendlies, we'll need to get our best players together so that we can prepare for the qualifiers and Nations League games. Can't play him in the qualifiers or Nations League games, too important to throw in a guy we haven't used before. If we qualified I'm not sure I'd call up Gilmour, is a major tournament really the best place to throw in a young guy? See how this circle of absolute pish can just keep regurgitating? It needs broken at some point, sooner is better than later. I didn't say he was bang average, that was someone else. As for the rest, just a strawman argument. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairn Necessities Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 I'd play Gilmour in our next international . We have nothing to lose. He could get 120 caps if he starts now. Or 12 if he turns out to be pish. Looks better than all other options at the moment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: It was 17 years ago and has zero relevance to today. You're as well using Dennis Law as an example as well. Right, even if I concede this doesn't count, do you agree or disagree with the rest of that paragraph? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnoustie Young Guvnor Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, Detournement said: I'm talking about his performances in the last few fixtures. He didn't take control of the games. And I'm saying who cares, that was months ago. As a teenager you develop very quickly, he controlled the game against Liverpool last week 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
velo army Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: It was 17 years ago and has zero relevance to today. You're as well using Dennis Law as an example as well. Curious here, but why has it zero relevance today? Is there a cut-off point for relevance or are you just creating an arbitrary line to support your tenuous argument against including Gilmour? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnoustie Young Guvnor Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 Realistically we don't have four or five for that role. Gilmour sits and protects his back four, we don't have many like that. For that role we have McTominay and Jack. That's not McGinn's game and he's not fit anyway, not Armstrong's game, not McGregor's game either. And for the final its probably the most important area of the park. We will really need two players doing that job. And here's the kicker, who is Norway's most influential player? You're mostly going to say Haaland but you'd be wrong, he's hardly played for them. The man that makes them tick is Odegaard. Young, talented midfielder. Who is the perfect player to combat him? Its Billy fuckin Gilmour. Odegaard would ream Ryan Jack. Its time to back our young players and be brave for once. I think Clarke will pick him tbh, and I would expect to see him get game time against Israel with a view to him playing a large chunk of the final. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnoustie Young Guvnor Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 And Odegaard played for Norway at 15 btw. Just throwing that out there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 17 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Right, even if I concede this doesn't count, do you agree or disagree with the rest of that paragraph? Yes, if injury forces the issue I'd rather see him given the chance ahead of Shinnie or Jack, particularly if McTominay is out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 20 minutes ago, Bairn Necessities said: I'd play Gilmour in our next international . We have nothing to lose. Oh my 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing.McCrosby Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 27 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Everyone is in agreement that Gilmour is probably 5th in line for a starting midfield spot, so we all agree he's among the best we've got. Why do you think "everyone" agrees with what you think? When a quick look on this page and the couple before show a large variety of options? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 14 minutes ago, velo army said: Curious here, but why has it zero relevance today? Is there a cut-off point for relevance or are you just creating an arbitrary line to support your tenuous argument against including Gilmour? 17 years, I don't think an arbitrary line is required, common sense will do. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Burnie_man said: No they're not. They got a freak win in Croatia, but aside from that the results have been poor, and I would be astonished if we end up being anywhere near qualifying. This is not a particularly strong group of players, with or without Gilmour - the only area we have any sort of quality is central midfield, and we have some absolute jersey fillers in other parts of the pitch, especially full-back. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 Just now, Burnie_man said: Yes, if injury forces the issue I'd rather see him given the chance ahead of Shinnie or Jack, particularly if McTominay is out. We got there in the end. Normally one of Jack, Shinnie or MacLean would be in the squad in addition to those already mentioned, so calling up Gilmour this time instead makes sense. 2 minutes ago, BingMcCrosby said: Why do you think "everyone" agrees with what you think? When a quick look on this page and the couple before show a large variety of options? I'd say the majority on here agree that he's at least 5th in line at the moment, even Burnie_man is conceding that and he doesn't think he should be called up, some argue he's closer to a starting spot. If you disagree with that I'm happy to hear your argument. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonS Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 33 minutes ago, Bairn Necessities said: I'd play Gilmour in our next international . We have nothing to lose. He could get 120 caps if he starts now. Or 12 if he turns out to be pish. Looks better than all other options at the moment. Well, we could lose the play-offs and miss out on a first tournament finals in 22 years, plus the unique experience of playing at home in a tournament finals, so there is that... Anyway, before last week I would have said it's too soon to put him in the squad. Not now, I'm confident he could do a job, especially away from home against a strong opponent as he has composure and he keeps things simple. I'm not sure how reliable he'd be under pressure, in a team seeing little of the ball. The list of players ahead of him at the back of midfield is short enough that he makes the squad at least. If a guy has enough maturity then 18 isn't remotely too young for international football, and he certainly seems like a well-grounded young man. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 18 minutes ago, craigkillie said: They got a freak win in Croatia, but aside from that the results have been poor, and I would be astonished if we end up being anywhere near qualifying. This is not a particularly strong group of players, with or without Gilmour - the only area we have any sort of quality is central midfield, and we have some absolute jersey fillers in other parts of the pitch, especially full-back. It was a deserved win, and a decent draw in the Czech Republic. Poor home form has cost us so far but 4-6 points from the next 2 games has us well in contention for at least a play-off. Less than that and they're friendlies in September and October. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 19 minutes ago, The Moonster said: We got there in the end. Normally one of Jack, Shinnie or MacLean would be in the squad in addition to those already mentioned, so calling up Gilmour this time instead makes sense. I'd say the majority on here agree that he's at least 5th in line at the moment, even Burnie_man is conceding that and he doesn't think he should be called up, some argue he's closer to a starting spot. If you disagree with that I'm happy to hear your argument. My point is this isn't the game to hand him a debut or for him to get splinters on the bench. However, in a situation where we have injury problems then that changes and you have a look at who is available to plug gaps. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnoustie Young Guvnor Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: My point is this isn't the game to hand him a debut or for him to get splinters on the bench. However, in a situation where we have injury problems then that changes and you have a look at who is available to plug gaps. Why isn't it a game to hand his debut? What's the worst that could happen? He's our best player in the form of his life and more confident than he's ever been. This is absolutely the time to give him his debut. He's riding the crest of a wave and we could be the beneficiaries. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 (edited) 1 minute ago, Carnoustie Young Guvnor said: Why isn't it a game to hand his debut? What's the worst that could happen? He's our best player in the form of his life and more confident than he's ever been. This is absolutely the time to give him his debut. He's riding the crest of a wave and we could be the beneficiaries. FFS, just like Harry Souttar? Edited March 10, 2020 by Burnie_man -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing.McCrosby Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 28 minutes ago, The Moonster said: I'd say the majority on here agree that he's at least 5th in line at the moment, even Burnie_man is conceding that and he doesn't think he should be called up, some argue he's closer to a starting spot. If you disagree with that I'm happy to hear your argument. I'd agree with this more sensible phrasing. I'd have him straight in the team personally. I can't understand why people wouldn't. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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