Savage Henry Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 I don't think much was wrong with the old rule of intent. Obviously it can be debatable at times, but this one for example wasn't intentional.The problem was almost no handball was ever “intentional” by any common definition of the word. But at the same time, if what we saw tonight is a penalty offence then the game is a bogey. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resk Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 I don't think much was wrong with the old rule of intent.^^^ this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 Depends on definition of intent though. Lots of times, people throw their arms out to deliberately make themselves bigger, and for me, that's intent, and should be punished. Yet I'm willing to bet a lot of folk would call it harsh. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diamonds are Forever Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 7 minutes ago, Scary Bear said: So the rule of the game is now, blooter the ball as hard as you can at their arm and you’ll get a penalty? Mental. That's what Mane did in the Champions League Final, players are already on to it. I just don't get the reasoning behind the change, my only conclusion is that they want to make it easier for referees. However as has been said, there are many things you could do to make it easier for referees but that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. The solution is for the refereeing to get better, not make the law simpler. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurkst Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 If only we'd got that ref against Japan 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resk Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 The problem was almost no handball was ever “intentional” by any common definition of the word. Is having fewer fouls being awarded for handball really a problem though? The deliberate handball rule was to stop William Webb Ellis types picking the ball up and running with it and was a key part of what made football football and not rugby. It functioned fine for a hundred years, okay referees have to use the balance of probabilities to guess whether the player intended it or not but that's the referee's job. This shitshow is basically down to arsehole fans and commentators screaming every time the ball is in the air, fkin instant replays, and FIFA panicking and thinking that changing the rules will improve the game. f**k it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keptie Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 I don't suppose the rule makers could include common sense into the rule book. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QwaarJet Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 Great advert for the women's game, poor advert for FIFA. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 I don't suppose the rule makers could include common sense into the rule book.By its very definition, common sense can not be legislated for. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 15 minutes ago, Savage Henry said: if what we saw tonight is a penalty offence then the game is a bogey. Indeed 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 Is having fewer fouls being awarded for handball really a problem though? The deliberate handball rule was to stop William Webb Ellis types picking the ball up and running with it and was a key part of what made football football and not rugby. It functioned fine for a hundred years, okay referees have to use the balance of probabilities to guess whether the player intended it or not but that's the referee's job. This shitshow is basically down to arsehole fans and commentators screaming every time the ball is in the air, fkin instant replays, and FIFA panicking and thinking that changing the rules will improve the game. f**k it. I agree. But the rule makers didn’t. I think the old rule was preferable to the current farce. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 6 minutes ago, resk said: okay referees have to use the balance of probabilities to guess whether the player intended it or not but that's the referee's job. This shitshow is basically down to arsehole fans and commentators screaming every time the ball is in the air, fkin instant replays, and FIFA panicking and thinking that changing the rules will improve the game. The 'big issue' is that FIFA seem to want to marginalise referees rather than doing the sensible thing and having better referees. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 Of course, simply having better referees is really easy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resk Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 The 'big issue' is that FIFA seem to want to marginalise referees rather than doing the sensible thing and having better referees.Yes, and I have a similarly tear-stained ill-informed seething rant about VAR all ready to go. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaDundee Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 Anyone who supports VAR should redirect themselves to the Wrestling board where all the other virgins hang out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A96 Posted June 25, 2019 Share Posted June 25, 2019 1 hour ago, resk said: Is having fewer fouls being awarded for handball really a problem though? The deliberate handball rule was to stop William Webb Ellis types picking the ball up and running with it and was a key part of what made football football and not rugby. It functioned fine for a hundred years, okay referees have to use the balance of probabilities to guess whether the player intended it or not but that's the referee's job. This shitshow is basically down to arsehole fans and commentators screaming every time the ball is in the air, fkin instant replays, and FIFA panicking and thinking that changing the rules will improve the game. f**k it. For years now we’ve had pundits and especially managers and players criticising referees for being inconsistent in their decisions , whether that’s the same ref or refs in general. The pundits have also , for the most part , been broadly in favour of some sort of technology being used to assist refs to reach the right decision, although you won’t find so many admitting to that now. I think FIFA have made some rule changes or issued directives in conjunction with the introduction of VAR in response to the pundits etc calling , parrot-fashion for consistency. What we’re seeing now with the handball in the penalty box is the new rules being applied consistently. And , surprise, surprise , the result is some very harsh penalties being awarded. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 That's what Mane did in the Champions League Final, players are already on to it. I just don't get the reasoning behind the change, my only conclusion is that they want to make it easier for referees. However as has been said, there are many things you could do to make it easier for referees but that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. The solution is for the refereeing to get better, not make the law simpler.I don't think it was designed to make it easier for referees, I think it was designed for the clowns who were constantly going on about the laws being too subjective.If anything it's going to be harder for most referees now - I think this handball rule has been specifically designed with VAR in mind. If you don't have VAR it's basically impossible to make considerations about a "natural silhouette" and so on. That's going to basically leave us with two different versions of the sport depending on whether VAR is in use or not. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diamonds are Forever Posted June 26, 2019 Share Posted June 26, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, craigkillie said: I don't think it was designed to make it easier for referees, I think it was designed for the clowns who were constantly going on about the laws being too subjective. If anything it's going to be harder for most referees now - I think this handball rule has been specifically designed with VAR in mind. If you don't have VAR it's basically impossible to make considerations about a "natural silhouette" and so on. That's going to basically leave us with two different versions of the sport depending on whether VAR is in use or not. I agree that may have been their reasoning, it would be a bit of a coincidence that it has come in just as VAR is becoming a big part if the game at the top level if not. But I'm not sure I agree it makes it harder. It would be interesting to see how many times the ball hits a player's arm in a match and what percentage of those were given as offences. From what I've seen with the new law being applied it seems that the vast majority of occasions where the ball hits a hand it's going to be an offence. Even if the referee decided before the game just to give a handball anytime the ball hits a hand they are probably going to be right (going by the new law) obout 80-90% of the time. I think that makes it easier for them to get the right the decision. Even that is true though, that is still not a defence of the law. Edited June 26, 2019 by Diamonds are Forever 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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