Linlithgow Rose - 2019 onwards

[GordonS]

20 hours ago, Auld Heid said:

Scullion and Thom were so far apart every hoof from Blackburn left us woefully exposed. Given their combined experience that was worrying.
 

This is the whole problem, and it's the same as last year. If you spend any time watching the two centre halves you notice that they don't talk to each other and they rarely look at each other. It's the most important partnership on a football pitch, you've always got to know where your other centre half is. You've got to know who's going and who's staying, and you've got to tell your partner when they can't go. You've got to keep the gap between you down, and not the bloody 40 yards it regularly was yesterday.

What really worries me is that, given this now stretches into a second season since Leiper left, I'm not confident Bradley knows how to set up a defence. These issues are rolling from game to game to game without improvement. I think Leiper kept his defence organised and since he left, no-one is doing it. Thom is a skilled player but he's very quiet and he's not an organiser on the pitch.

If this isn't immediately sorted we have no chance of finishing higher than 3rd or 4th. 

19 hours ago, sponsorsladdie said:

At the other end we did create a number of chances and should have had a few more goals. Not sure why we had a goal chopped off for offside in the first half when I didn’t think any of our players touched it before a Blackburn player turned it into their own net

I overheard the linesman explaining it to Barbour, he said the ball was heading for the big baldy player at the back post - Scullion, then. I couldn't see exactly how near it got to him, but I don't think any of us understand the offside law any more. 

19 hours ago, Burnie_man said:

and at the end should have had a penalty when Danny Campbell again got in behind your backline, stabbed a shot which your keeper blocked with his legs, and with Drummond running into the box towards the loose ball was bundled over. Ref waved it away.

I agree, that looked a clear penalty to me. Not sure who it was but one of our players leapt from the ground across the front of the striker, with no attempt to play the ball. The fourth goal was a runaway against a team chasing an equaliser. 3-3 would have been a fairer reflection.

[surely not!]

Given our circumstances yesterday I thought we may have went 3 at the back.

That said given the experience of the defence it was worrying that Scullion and Thom looked like strangers to each other.

Surely they ARE strangers to each other?

Experience is one thing, but you can’t overestimate the time it takes to understand each other’s game.

[Burnie_man]

Wait, what, they have barely played together and need time to gel.  Having an inexpierienced midfield in front didn't help them.  Having one fb out of position and one who isn't didnt help either.
Pre season was good and we got a result yesterday, the positives have outweighed the negatives by far and this will be a good season.
Blackburn barely got a kick the second half so how you reckon 3-3 would have been fair is  beyond me.
Keep calm.

Wait, what, barely got a kick second half, eh? Sure, you were on top for the first 20 mins of the half but after that we were well in it and had several chances to equalise and should have had a penalty at the death which would probably have earned a point.

[Burnie_man]

Shock, a Blackburn perspective is different from a Linlithgow one.
I was impressed with the hosts yesterday, the front two were decent.  
 

It's not perspective, to say we never got a kick of the ball second half is simply not accurate, otherwise Linlithgow wouldn't have resorted to slowing the game down late on in the game to protect their slender lead.

[GordonS]

1 hour ago, Greygoose said:

Wait, what, they have barely played together and need time to gel.  Having an inexpierienced midfield in front didn't help them.  Having one fb out of position and one who isn't didnt help either.

Pre season was good and we got a result yesterday, the positives have outweighed the negatives by far and this will be a good season.

Blackburn barely got a kick the second half so how you reckon 3-3 would have been fair is  beyond me.

Keep calm.

You don't need to have played together to know you need to look at and talk to your centre half partner. All you need is to have played centre half before. And if you're an inexperienced partnership it's even more important that you focus on communication. I watched them for long stretches and they absolutely did not do that. I'm not just talking about a minor issue, this was catastrophically bad defending that really ought to have been exploited more. This is worse than when I was playing uni football.

The reason I'm pretty alarmed is, though the personnel have changed, it's a repeat of last season when we shipped goals to anyone half decent. Four at Beith, five at East Stirling, four at home to Dunbar, four at Broxburn (which cost us everything), two at home to Jeanfield in a match we controlled, three at home to Ormiston, three at Preston... 

With genuine respect to Blackburn, getting a result against them isn't in itself an achievement for Rose. We beat them 7-0 there only a few months ago, and 5-1 in the home game. 

Blackburn should have made it 3-1 before half time, they should have had a penalty late on and there was a shot that whistled past the post. They had much the better of midfield across most of the game (because we were outnumbered) and they won the tactical battle. They also worked harder. We got away with it, and no more.

The only comfort is that it improved in the second half because Barbour didn't go forward so much and Thom was able to stay more central. Maybe it'll improve when Gray can get back over there. But given the experience of last season I think we're in for a repeat.

[GordonS]

56 minutes ago, Greygoose said:

Tinted glasses I see, we will agree to disagree.   

Went to a difficult place on opening day of season with a disjointed team and won, that's what counts come next May.

 

A difficult place where we won 7-0 a little over four months ago, against a team that lost 7 of their 12 league matches at home last season, including 2-0 v Craigroyston, 4-3 v Heriot Watt and 3-0 v Stirling Uni EOS. 

C'mon.

[Burnie_man]

1 hour ago, Greygoose said:

Tinted glasses I see, we will agree to disagree.   

Went to a difficult place on opening day of season with a disjointed team and won, that's what counts come next May.

 

It's not tinted glasses if you're obviously wrong.

[juniornews]

4 hours ago, GordonS said:

You don't need to have played together to know you need to look at and talk to your centre half partner. All you need is to have played centre half before. And if you're an inexperienced partnership it's even more important that you focus on communication. I watched them for long stretches and they absolutely did not do that. I'm not just talking about a minor issue, this was catastrophically bad defending that really ought to have been exploited more. This is worse than when I was playing uni football.

The reason I'm pretty alarmed is, though the personnel have changed, it's a repeat of last season when we shipped goals to anyone half decent. Four at Beith, five at East Stirling, four at home to Dunbar, four at Broxburn (which cost us everything), two at home to Jeanfield in a match we controlled, three at home to Ormiston, three at Preston... 

With genuine respect to Blackburn, getting a result against them isn't in itself an achievement for Rose. We beat them 7-0 there only a few months ago, and 5-1 in the home game. 

Blackburn should have made it 3-1 before half time, they should have had a penalty late on and there was a shot that whistled past the post. They had much the better of midfield across most of the game (because we were outnumbered) and they won the tactical battle. They also worked harder. We got away with it, and no more.

The only comfort is that it improved in the second half because Barbour didn't go forward so much and Thom was able to stay more central. Maybe it'll improve when Gray can get back over there. But given the experience of last season I think we're in for a repeat.

FFS 

[Bufty Boots]

4 hours ago, GordonS said:

You don't need to have played together to know you need to look at and talk to your centre half partner. All you need is to have played centre half before. And if you're an inexperienced partnership it's even more important that you focus on communication. I watched them for long stretches and they absolutely did not do that. I'm not just talking about a minor issue, this was catastrophically bad defending that really ought to have been exploited more. This is worse than when I was playing uni football.

The reason I'm pretty alarmed is, though the personnel have changed, it's a repeat of last season when we shipped goals to anyone half decent. Four at Beith, five at East Stirling, four at home to Dunbar, four at Broxburn (which cost us everything), two at home to Jeanfield in a match we controlled, three at home to Ormiston, three at Preston... 

With genuine respect to Blackburn, getting a result against them isn't in itself an achievement for Rose. We beat them 7-0 there only a few months ago, and 5-1 in the home game. 

Blackburn should have made it 3-1 before half time, they should have had a penalty late on and there was a shot that whistled past the post. They had much the better of midfield across most of the game (because we were outnumbered) and they won the tactical battle. They also worked harder. We got away with it, and no more.

The only comfort is that it improved in the second half because Barbour didn't go forward so much and Thom was able to stay more central. Maybe it'll improve when Gray can get back over there. But given the experience of last season I think we're in for a repeat.

Were there any positives from yesterday for you GordonS or are you thinking the worst for the season ahead?

I am a glass half full kind of guy so will play ying to your yang. 

Going forward we looked good. Barbour missed two sitters in the first half and the Blackburn keeper had three or four good saves. In the second half we played a lot better football and again missed some great chances. 

We won a game away from home missing a number of key personnel.

We have no right to look at last seasons results and use them as a barometer for this season. We won - there are plenty teams in that league who would have been happy to have three points on the board after their first game - but that isn’t enough for most of our supporters who post on here. 

With the positivity shown on here you would think we had lost! 

[grinderbrokeyourhearts]

Great to get the points. It's always tricky this time of year with suspensions.

Always disappointed when I see holidays as an excuse, for me a player shouldn't sign if they can't commit to start the season but thats just my opinion.

We need to stop shipping goals and Bradley needs to prove he can set up a defence and quickly. Our clean sheet record since her returned has been pretty bad.

Going forward we are banging the goals in, if we just get a settled defence and midfield we'll be right up there.

Htg

[roseyposey]

On ‎27‎/‎07‎/‎2019 at 18:13, Burnie_man said:

Well you guys will definitely get value for money this season, there will be goals aplenty at both ends.

Talking points for me was the elbow on Andy McQuillan first half which only saw yellow and should have been red, then Andy rushing his shot which perhaps should have made it 3-1 at the break. However I thought we got away with one with the OG which was ruled out, not sure why.

Second half we were asleep and the OG was unfortunate and let you back in it and for 20 mins we were struggling a wee bit, but back we came and at the end should have had a penalty when Danny Campbell again got in behind your backline, stabbed a shot which your keeper blocked with his legs, and with Drummond running into the box towards the loose ball was bundled over. Ref waved it away. Before that Drummond, who had been pushed up from centre half, had another good chance to level.

Needless to say we were cought hopping pushing for the equaliser and conceded a fourth as time ran out, but overall a very good performance against a team which has quality all over the park, but one which has defensive issues. Our long balls were causing havoc, particularly first half.  If we keep that level of performance up we'll stay up.

Thought Danny Smith was the best player on the park, and Darren Mitchell in goals for us pulled off some very good stops.

Thankfully the video quite clearly shows Gary Thom's so called elbow was nothing of the sort and never a red card. Anyone watching that and saying otherwise is at it 

[HTG]

17 minutes ago, grinderbrokeyourhearts said:

Always disappointed when I see holidays as an excuse, for me a player shouldn't sign if they can't commit to start the season but thats just my opinion.

If only life was simple. We had 3 weeks of close season. Guys with kids still at school. Others are told when to take holidays by their work. It's inevitable clubs will have people on holiday. We've got boys who have done 15 pre season sessions including 5 games. They get criticised for not doing pre season and not being fit enough. They're working men first and football players second. Most teams need to manage this. 

[Burnie_man]

18 minutes ago, roseyposey said:

Thankfully the video quite clearly shows Gary Thom's so called elbow was nothing of the sort and never a red card. Anyone watching that and saying otherwise is at it 

The incident at 5.20? It clearly shows he caught Andy with his elbow, now whether it was deliberate or not only Thom knows, he certainly saw Andy coming. More than a few people over the other side breathed a sigh of relief when only a yellow was shown. Nobody is "at it".

[GordonS]

6 hours ago, Greygoose said:

Are they not allowed to sign players and compete like.  

Don't think you know much about football.

I know exactly who Blackburn signed and where they came from. I also know who they lost. They're maybe slightly stronger than last season, but not much.

If you can't see what I'm talking about with that defence then you've no idea what you're looking at when you look at a football pitch.

[GordonS]

2 hours ago, juniornews said:

FFS 

"juniornews"

Are you lost?

[juniornews]

12 minutes ago, GordonS said:

"juniornews"

Are you lost?

Just stunned how clueless you are 

[GordonS]

1 hour ago, Bufty Boots said:

Were there any positives from yesterday for you GordonS or are you thinking the worst for the season ahead?

I am a glass half full kind of guy so will play ying to your yang. 

Going forward we looked good. Barbour missed two sitters in the first half and the Blackburn keeper had three or four good saves. In the second half we played a lot better football and again missed some great chances. 

We won a game away from home missing a number of key personnel.

We have no right to look at last seasons results and use them as a barometer for this season. We won - there are plenty teams in that league who would have been happy to have three points on the board after their first game - but that isn’t enough for most of our supporters who post on here. 

With the positivity shown on here you would think we had lost! 

I can't agree with you that we can't look at last season's results as a barometer. Against the same teams, why not? They're our rivals in the league and surely it's got to be our ambition to win it.

I said before the game on here, and have been saying for ages, that we're great going forward. We need to score four or five to win games, and thankfully we usually do. It's a pleasure to watch a Linlithgow Rose team attack someone. I thought Meikle looked very capable on the ball (maybe less so off it, but that can come). The new Smith is clearly a player. Allum faded as the game went on but IMO he'll be the best forward we've had to put alongside TC since Herdy. TC took his goal really well and I think he could be a scary prospect for defences, coming in from the left with a little more space. He'll be a bugger to pick up. I don't think right back suited Barbour, but it was good to see him fired up, some of our guys can be a bit too nice at times. 

But all of that is undermined by a failure to get the centre halves playing right.  It ruined our season last year. It cost us the conference for sure, with the 4-3 at Broxburn and the 3-3 at home to Ormiston; Bonnyrigg were the league's best side but the somewhat fell over the line in the end, and if their last match had been against properly set up Rose, at Prestonfield, we could have taken them.

It's just so frustrating because it's the absolute basics of positioning for centre halves - play as a pair, know where your partner is, talk to each other, don't get pulled out if you don't know what's behind you, all the most simple things. Is it too much to ask?

[GordonS]

3 minutes ago, juniornews said:

Just stunned how clueless you are 

Back atcha bud. 

[grinderbrokeyourhearts]

I get it, I just don't like it!

I just find it hard to believe that it has to be when the first competitive game it. It can cost points and in this league a good start could win it.

If only life was simple. We had 3 weeks of close season. Guys with kids still at school. Others are told when to take holidays by their work. It's inevitable clubs will have people on holiday. We've got boys who have done 15 pre season sessions including 5 games. They get criticised for not doing pre season and not being fit enough. They're working men first and football players second. Most teams need to manage this. 

[Auld Heid]

10 hours ago, Bufty Boots said:

Were there any positives from yesterday for you GordonS or are you thinking the worst for the season ahead?

I am a glass half full kind of guy so will play ying to your yang. 

Going forward we looked good. Barbour missed two sitters in the first half and the Blackburn keeper had three or four good saves. In the second half we played a lot better football and again missed some great chances. 

We won a game away from home missing a number of key personnel.

We have no right to look at last seasons results and use them as a barometer for this season. We won - there are plenty teams in that league who would have been happy to have three points on the board after their first game - but that isn’t enough for most of our supporters who post on here. 

With the positivity shown on here you would think we had lost! 

My glass is often half empty - at least it felt a bit fuller by the end of the game.

Defensively in the first half we were dreadful - positional poor and lazy when out of possesion.  Last season the difference between success and failure was down to exactly the same problem.  Thankfully it improved in the 2nd half, albeit they still managed a few moments...!!

Delighted with 3 points - sort out the defence and then my glass may be half full this season