QPSpider1867 Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 Anywhere but 10th!Easiest way to not finish 10th in League 2 is to not be in League 2 I guess I’m confident this group can make the play offs. [emoji835]️[emoji836]️ 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Your Own Socks Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 2 hours ago, QPSpider1867 said: Easiest way to not finish 10th in League 2 is to not be in League 2 I guess I’m confident this group can make the play offs. ️️ El Presidente said at one of the recent meetings that our ambition should be to be mainstays in L1. Confusing signals then to state that position 41 is a result! Sincerely hope Mark and the players have bigger ambition. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The man with no name Posted August 12, 2019 Share Posted August 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Bring Your Own Socks said: El Presidente said at one of the recent meetings that our ambition should be to be mainstays in L1. Confusing signals then to state that position 41 is a result! Sincerely hope Mark and the players have bigger ambition. I said anywhere but 10th. 1st is not 10th, neither is 2nd etc. We should aim to finish as high as possible. The worst case possible is 10th. That really is nightmare scenario stuff and has to be avoided at all costs! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 It has been suggested with some authority earlier in this thread that because our players are signed on professional contracts then that already makes us a professional club with no need to consult members on any change to the constitution. Interesting though that when i make further enquiries I establish that none of our players (i.e. excluding loanees) are signed on professional contracts. As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts for a sum of £1. That has not been the case for some time now, and whilst some on here wish to use that previous technicality to circumvent due process I think factual accuracy is kind of important in a matter as important as this. Just for the record, here is the form on the SFA website, and all of our players are registered as amateur per the box in A4. Therefore any suggestions that the club is already a professional one simply by virtue of being part of a professional league (as has always been the case whatever it's now called!) are misleading, inaccurate and utter bunkum. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The man with no name Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, The Spider said: It has been suggested with some authority earlier in this thread that because our players are signed on professional contracts then that already makes us a professional club with no need to consult members on any change to the constitution. Interesting though that when i make further enquiries I establish that none of our players (i.e. excluding loanees) are signed on professional contracts. As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts for a sum of £1. That has not been the case for some time now, and whilst some on here wish to use that previous technicality to circumvent due process I think factual accuracy is kind of important in a matter as important as this. Just for the record, here is the form on the SFA website, and all of our players are registered as amateur per the box in A4. Therefore any suggestions that the club is already a professional one simply by virtue of being part of a professional league (as has always been the case whatever it's now called!) are misleading, inaccurate and utter bunkum. I'm all for factual accuracy. On the form where it says "Player status" we have had players signed by Queen's Park where the "Professional" status has been ticked. We have a current player whose status is "professional". While others wish to ignore the fact we have had professional players play for the club and we currently have a professional playing the Club, these are indesputable facts! Edited August 13, 2019 by The man with no name 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reclusespider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 28 minutes ago, The Spider said: It has been suggested with some authority earlier in this thread that because our players are signed on professional contracts then that already makes us a professional club with no need to consult members on any change to the constitution. Interesting though that when i make further enquiries I establish that none of our players (i.e. excluding loanees) are signed on professional contracts. As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts for a sum of £1. That has not been the case for some time now, and whilst some on here wish to use that previous technicality to circumvent due process I think factual accuracy is kind of important in a matter as important as this. Just for the record, here is the form on the SFA website, and all of our players are registered as amateur per the box in A4. Therefore any suggestions that the club is already a professional one simply by virtue of being part of a professional league (as has always been the case whatever it's now called!) are misleading, inaccurate and utter bunkum. You exclude loan players but surely these players must be registered under the club name as professional? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, Reclusespider said: You exclude loan players but surely these players must be registered under the club name as professional? Indeed we do, which as i previously highlighted is why clause 6.2 had to be amended to include "other players", but who pays the wages of these loanees? It may be a fine dividing line between fieldng a professional or in the case of so many nowadays former (i.e. re-instated amateurs) professional players, but the bottom line is that Queen's Park have never paid any player to play for us which as i understand it is what this debate is all about..............i.e. whether in future QP should be paying our players. So all our E J James's can highlight all the instances they want about how we have pushed the boundaries of amateurism to it's fullest extent, but until we cross the line of actually paying players then within the guidelines of our constitution we continue to field amateur teams and remain an amateur club, albeit not as pure as we originally were. The time will come for the President & Committee to either "piss or get off the potty" on this issue, but until then it's "business" as usual. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 42 minutes ago, The man with no name said: I'm all for factual accuracy. On the form where it says "Player status" we have had players signed by Queen's Park where the "Professional" status has been ticked (the technicality I referred to above which as you know was purely to satisfy a league requirement - why do you think the league no longer make it necessary for us to do that anymore? Answer - because they are amateur players and it was a stupid rule to make amateur players sign professional contracts which caused oll sorts of HMRC issues) We have a current player whose status is "professional". (the loanee I referred to above where we previously changed our constitution to make that possible) While others wish to ignore the fact we have had professional players play for the club and we currently have a professional playing the Club, these are indesputable facts! (quite correct - but it's equally indisputable that our club has never paid their wages which I thought was what the potential change was all about) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick1867 Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 1 hour ago, The Spider said: It has been suggested with some authority earlier in this thread that because our players are signed on professional contracts then that already makes us a professional club with no need to consult members on any change to the constitution. Interesting though that when i make further enquiries I establish that none of our players (i.e. excluding loanees) are signed on professional contracts. As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts for a sum of £1. That has not been the case for some time now, and whilst some on here wish to use that previous technicality to circumvent due process I think factual accuracy is kind of important in a matter as important as this. Just for the record, here is the form on the SFA website, and all of our players are registered as amateur per the box in A4. This is hardly an exclusive, this has been known for a while now . Indeed I think you were one of the last people to realise this, going by some of your posts over the last couple of seasons The point people are making is us cherry picking the bits of amateurism that suit us, while the club operates on almost every other level as a professional one. If we were a true amateur club then we should be playing in the amateur leagues imo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick1867 Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 1 hour ago, The Spider said: Therefore any suggestions that the club is already a professional one simply by virtue of being part of a professional league (as has always been the case whatever it's now called!) are misleading, inaccurate and utter bunkum. I haven't read anyone who has said that so stop twisting people's words. All people said was we are now pushing the boundaries, which you have admitted yourself Pretty shite from you to be honest 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The man with no name Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 1 hour ago, The Spider said: If you register a player with a status as "professional" then their legal status is professional (the clue is in the wording). You can fool yourself all you want but the Club has played professionals before. Not only that but it will have fielded teams where the vast majority of players (if not all) are professional. I would suggest that is not amateur team! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris the Spider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 Going back to Saturday - it was great to see the players chat to the fans. Even "auld steamers" like me. Wullie Muir was in great form and even sat with me and another couple of auld steamers at the end of the night having a wee drink. Great to have him back. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 1 hour ago, The man with no name said: it will have fielded teams where the vast majority of players (if not all) are professional Perhaps you would like to back-up that purported statement of fact with an example of one of the games this took place in. I'll be happy to provide the team-lines for it so that we can all see who these so-called professional players were. Otherwise, please feel free to continue to throw these random statements at us so we can all take them as gospel. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The man with no name Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 12 minutes ago, The Spider said: Perhaps you would like to back-up that purported statement of fact with an example of one of the games this took place in. I'll be happy to provide the team-lines for it so that we can all see who these so-called professional players were. Otherwise, please feel free to continue to throw these random statements at us so we can all take them as gospel. 4 hours ago, The Spider said: I As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts That was tough! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris the Spider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 To be honest I couldn't really care less how professional we have been in the past. What is important to me is that we survive (and maybe even prosper) in senior football. The best chance of that happening is to go professional. The committee should do whatever it takes to make that happen asap. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Your Own Socks Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 To be honest I couldn't really care less how professional we have been in the past. What is important to me is that we survive (and maybe even prosper) in senior football. The best chance of that happening is to go professional. The committee should do whatever it takes to make that happen asap.Live long and prosper, eh? Now who said that? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spider Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts for a sum of £1. That has not been the case for some time now, and whilst some on here wish to use that previous technicality to circumvent due process. Re-quoted my original version for you as you seem to have deleted part of by mistake - I think it's an insult to the players concerned to suggest that they were professional when they clearly weren't being paid for playing for us. Boris has nailed it when he says that it's the future that matters, so it's now up to the Committee to produce business models for both scenarios and let the members decide the best way forward. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
williebraveheart Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, The Spider said: As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts for a sum of £1. That has not been the case for some time now, and whilst some on here wish to use that previous technicality to circumvent due process. Re-quoted my original version for you as you seem to have deleted part of by mistake - I think it's an insult to the players concerned to suggest that they were professional when they clearly weren't being paid for playing for us. Boris has nailed it when he says that it's the future that matters, so it's now up to the Committee to produce business models for both scenarios and let the members decide the best way forward. And as time rumbles on there seems no urgency other than to have meetings about possible further meetings. Would somebody please take the reins, make a decision and present it for acceptance by the membership. At the moment we appear rudderless. I respect the work the president has done and admire his motives. Please no just get on with it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The man with no name Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 21 minutes ago, The Spider said: As we all know a few years ago the league insisted that our players be registered on professional contracts for a sum of £1. That has not been the case for some time now, and whilst some on here wish to use that previous technicality to circumvent due process. Re-quoted my original version for you as you seem to have deleted part of by mistake - I think it's an insult to the players concerned to suggest that they were professional when they clearly weren't being paid for playing for us. Boris has nailed it when he says that it's the future that matters, so it's now up to the Committee to produce business models for both scenarios and let the members decide the best way forward. That "technicality" just happens to be the legal status of the players. You delude yourself all you want. As others state, it's not the past that will dictate the decision but what kind of Club we want for future generations. Will there be a future for the club? I sincerely hope so. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hampden Diehard Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 And as time rumbles on there seems no urgency other than to have meetings about possible further meetings. Would somebody please take the reins, make a decision and present it for acceptance by the membership. At the moment we appear rudderless. I respect the work the president has done and admire his motives. Please no just get on with it. Willie You have omitted "as far as I know" between the words "urgency" and "other". The fact that there has been answering on the subject would, as far as I know, suggest that the situation is moving on apace. Unlike what happened re the vote on Brexit, hopefully the electorate will be given the full facts to allow them to make a considered decision. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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