D.A.F.C Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 At Thursday's Supporter's meeting, I asked Ross McArthur why clubs like our own don't get together and demand a more equitable split of the income the SPFL generates from TV. The clubs finishing 1 and 2 in the Premiership (no prizes for guessing who they are and are likely to be for the next 100 years) receive 23%, so the remaining 40 clubs have to share 77%. Here's the full breakdown:- Premiership1st - £3.18m (13.4%)2nd - £2.28m (9.6%)3rd - £1.96m (8.25%)4th - £1.72m (7.25%)5th - £1.6m (6.75%)6th - £1.48m (6.25%)7th - £1.36m (5.75%)8th - £1.3m (5.5%)9th - £1.24m (5.25%)10th - £1.19m (5.0%)11th - £1.13m (4.75%)12th - £1.07m (4.5%) Championship1st - £533,000 (2.25%)2nd - £450,000 (1.9%)3rd - £379,000 (1.6%)4th - £308,000 (1.3%)5th - £237,000 (1.0%)6th - £213,000 (0.9%)7th - £201,000 (0.85%)8th - £190,000 (0.80%)9th - £178,000 (0.75%)10th - £166,000 (0.7%) League 11st - £119,000 (0.50%)2nd - £102,000 (0.43%)3rd - £83,000 (0.35%)4th - £81,000 (0.34%)5th - £78,000 (0.33%)6th - £76,000 (0.32%)7th - £73,000 (0.31%)8th - £71,000 (0.30%)9th - £69,000 (0.29%)10th - £66,000 (0.28%) League 21st - £64,000 (0.27%)2nd - £62,000 (0.26%)3rd - £59,000 (0.25%)4th - £57,000 (0.24%)5th - £55,000 (0.23%)6th - £52,000 (0.22%)7th - £50,000 (0.21%)8th - £47,000 (0.20%)9th - £45,000 (0.19%)10th - £43,000 (0.18%) This is a bit sour grapes but if you look at the money breakdown plus the TV share it seems that unless you are rangers and Celtic then we are all on a race to part time football and low crowds.Aberdeen hearts hibs will be above that but outside of that if any other side drops into the championship then it's a worry.The standard of football has dropped considerably recently and crowds are dropping. Next season could be really bad with United and Falkirk leaving and replaced with accies and arbroath possibly.Championship teams are going to struggle to stay full time in a few years. The top league in Scotland has caused quite a bit of this with the 10000 seater stadium rule plus the closed shop with an 11/1 voting structure that means the OF will always veto everything. I know we overspent and so did other teams but I feel like it's a race to the bottom.Higher prices, lower standard, no competition outside Celtic. Can it survive another twenty years of this? -2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 21 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said: At Thursday's Supporter's meeting, I asked Ross McArthur why clubs like our own don't get together and demand a more equitable split of the income the SPFL generates from TV. The clubs finishing 1 and 2 in the Premiership (no prizes for guessing who they are and are likely to be for the next 100 years) receive 23%, so the remaining 40 clubs have to share 77%. Here's the full breakdown:- Premiership 1st - £3.18m (13.4%) 2nd - £2.28m (9.6%) 3rd - £1.96m (8.25%) 4th - £1.72m (7.25%) 5th - £1.6m (6.75%) 6th - £1.48m (6.25%) 7th - £1.36m (5.75%) 8th - £1.3m (5.5%) 9th - £1.24m (5.25%) 10th - £1.19m (5.0%) 11th - £1.13m (4.75%) 12th - £1.07m (4.5%) Championship 1st - £533,000 (2.25%) 2nd - £450,000 (1.9%) 3rd - £379,000 (1.6%) 4th - £308,000 (1.3%) 5th - £237,000 (1.0%) 6th - £213,000 (0.9%) 7th - £201,000 (0.85%) 8th - £190,000 (0.80%) 9th - £178,000 (0.75%) 10th - £166,000 (0.7%) League 1 1st - £119,000 (0.50%) 2nd - £102,000 (0.43%) 3rd - £83,000 (0.35%) 4th - £81,000 (0.34%) 5th - £78,000 (0.33%) 6th - £76,000 (0.32%) 7th - £73,000 (0.31%) 8th - £71,000 (0.30%) 9th - £69,000 (0.29%) 10th - £66,000 (0.28%) League 2 1st - £64,000 (0.27%) 2nd - £62,000 (0.26%) 3rd - £59,000 (0.25%) 4th - £57,000 (0.24%) 5th - £55,000 (0.23%) 6th - £52,000 (0.22%) 7th - £50,000 (0.21%) 8th - £47,000 (0.20%) 9th - £45,000 (0.19%) 10th - £43,000 (0.18%) This is a bit sour grapes but if you look at the money breakdown plus the TV share it seems that unless you are rangers and Celtic then we are all on a race to part time football and low crowds. Aberdeen hearts hibs will be above that but outside of that if any other side drops into the championship then it's a worry. The standard of football has dropped considerably recently and crowds are dropping. Next season could be really bad with United and Falkirk leaving and replaced with accies and arbroath possibly. Championship teams are going to struggle to stay full time in a few years. The top league in Scotland has caused quite a bit of this with the 10000 seater stadium rule plus the closed shop with an 11/1 voting structure that means the OF will always veto everything. I know we overspent and so did other teams but I feel like it's a race to the bottom. Higher prices, lower standard, no competition outside Celtic. Can it survive another twenty years of this? Scottish football can survive. Maybe not all the current clubs can. Why should clubs in the fourth tier get a share of TV money when better supported clubs in the juniors and Highland league don't? Would it increase the standard much if all clubs had an extra 50k per year? What do those sums look like when divided by the number of supporters? What do you propose? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 Attendances are only dropping at clubs who have a shite season. Should that club have a good season attendances will increase. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: Attendances are only dropping at clubs who have a shite season. Should that club have a good season attendances will increase. Correct. 2 minutes ago, ali_91 said: Red dotted for saying the words ‘really bad,’ while discussing Falkirk’s relegation. Also correct. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.A.F.C Posted May 18, 2019 Author Share Posted May 18, 2019 27 minutes ago, coprolite said: Scottish football can survive. Maybe not all the current clubs can. Why should clubs in the fourth tier get a share of TV money when better supported clubs in the juniors and Highland league don't? Would it increase the standard much if all clubs had an extra 50k per year? What do those sums look like when divided by the number of supporters? What do you propose? Aberdeen can survive because of Stuart Milne, spending £5M a year on wages isn’t sustainable. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 1 hour ago, ali_91 said: Why on Earth would Junior clubs get TV money from the Senior games TV deal? Or to put another way, why should clubs outside the top tier get money for the top tier being on the telly? 1 hour ago, D.A.F.C said: Aberdeen can survive because of Stuart Milne, spending £5M a year on wages isn’t sustainable. Historically Milne and others have propped up losses. It is sustainable if they continue to do that, but is high risk and i’d Prefer if the dons were self sufficient, I don’t particularly like the way the cash is shared either, particularly with the top two. I am playing devil’s advocate (ie being a dick) because the OP is a non specific whine that reads like a toddler tantrum. There are probably good arguments for a change but the spl insisting on 10k 20 years ago is not one. Let’s hear some. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy. Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 Worth mentioning there was a vote to a more "even spread" of the money, but two clubs voted against it. Celtic and Aberdeen... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, D.A.F.C said: Aberdeen can survive because of Stuart Milne, spending £5M a year on wages isn’t sustainable. For Aberdeen spending £5M on wages is easily sustainable. Season ticket sales alone will bring in circa £3M. Then there's prize money from the league and cups, as well as a share of the TV money. Then there's shirt sponsorship and sponsorship of all the boards around the pitch. Then there's merchandise sales. Then there's walk up ticket sales and away support ticket money and sales of food and drink at the ground. Add in corporate packages as well. They can easily afford wages of £5M a year. Edited May 18, 2019 by DA Baracus 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.A.F.C Posted May 18, 2019 Author Share Posted May 18, 2019 For Aberdeen spending £5M on wages is easily sustainable. Season ticket sales alone will bring in circa £3M. Then there's prize money from the league and cups, as well as a share of the TV money. Then there's shirt sponsorship and sponsorship of all the boards around the pitch. Then there's merchandise sales. Then there's walk up sales and away support ticket money and sales of food and drink at the ground. Add in corporate packages as well. They can easily afford wages of £5M a year.That's why they are cutting the budget then. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 Just now, D.A.F.C said: Just now, DA Baracus said: For Aberdeen spending £5M on wages is easily sustainable. Season ticket sales alone will bring in circa £3M. Then there's prize money from the league and cups, as well as a share of the TV money. Then there's shirt sponsorship and sponsorship of all the boards around the pitch. Then there's merchandise sales. Then there's walk up sales and away support ticket money and sales of food and drink at the ground. Add in corporate packages as well. They can easily afford wages of £5M a year. That's why they are cutting the budget then. They're paying for a new training ground and the upkeep of Pittodrie is apparently increasing each year. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Im_Rodger Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 It has changed slightly:- Ladbrokes Premiership1st - 13.40% - £3,350,000 2nd - 9.60% - £2,400,000 3rd - 8.25% - £2,062,500 4th - 7.25% - £1,812,500 5th - 6.75% - £1,687,500 6th - 6.25% - £1,562,500 7th - 5.75% - £1,437,500 8th - 5.50% - £1,375,000 9th - 5.25% - £1,312,500 10th -5.00% - £1,250,000 11th - 4.75% - £1,187,500 12th - 4.50% - £1,125,000 Ladbrokes Championship1st - 2.25% - £562,500 2nd - 1.90% - £475,000 3rd - 1.60% - £400,000 4th - 1.30% - £325,000 5th - 1.00% - £250,000 6th - 0.90% - £225,000 7th - 0.85% - £212,500 8th - 0.80% - £200,000 9th - 0.75% - £187,500 10th - 0.70% - £175,000 Ladbrokes League 1 1st - 0.50% - £125,000 2nd - 0.43% - £107,500 3rd - 0.35% - £87,500 4th - 0.34% - £85,000 5th - 0.33% - £82,500 6th - 0.32% - £80,000 7th - 0.31% - £77,500 8th - 0.30% - £75,000 9th - 0.29% - £72,500 10th - 0.28% - £70,000 Ladbrokes League 2 1st - 0.27% - £67,500 2nd - 0.26% - £65,000 3rd - 0.25% - £62,500 4th - 0.24% - £60,000 5th - 0.23% - £57,500 6th - 0.22% - £55,000 7th - 0.21% - £52,500 8th - 0.20% - £50,000 9th - 0.19% - £47,500 10th - 0.18% - £45,000 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Snooty Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 (edited) baws Edited May 18, 2019 by Lord Snooty 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 4 hours ago, RandomGuy. said: Worth mentioning there was a vote to a more "even spread" of the money, but two clubs voted against it. Celtic and Aberdeen... Any redistribution, however unlikely, would involve all top division teams contributing to the pot from their share. There isn't a snowball's chance in Hell any of them would vote for that, especially Aberdeen who theoretically would have to put in the 3rd or 4th biggest share. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomGuy. Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 Just now, Sergeant Wilson said: Any redistribution, however unlikely, would involve all top division teams contributing to the pot from their share. There isn't a snowball's chance in Hell any of them would vote for that, especially Aberdeen who theoretically would have to put in the 3rd or 4th biggest share. Tbf why should they? They've earned the right to more money by being better. St Johnstone spent years in the second tier, with the lack of money, muddling around within our means until the time came to get promoted. I dont see why it's some hardship for other clubs to do the same. The majority would just hurl the extra income at big names that never earn them anything back anyway. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 1 minute ago, RandomGuy. said: Tbf why should they? They've earned the right to more money by being better. St Johnstone spent years in the second tier, with the lack of money, muddling around within our means until the time came to get promoted. I dont see why it's some hardship for other clubs to do the same. The majority would just hurl the extra income at big names that never earn them anything back anyway. I agree, I was just pointing out that the concept that two teams were the only barrier to the land of milk and honey in lower divisions. That doesn't mean the two concerned aren't a massive problem. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 7 hours ago, D.A.F.C said: At Thursday's Supporter's meeting, I asked Ross McArthur why clubs like our own don't get together and demand a more equitable split of the income the SPFL generates from TV. The clubs finishing 1 and 2 in the Premiership (no prizes for guessing who they are and are likely to be for the next 100 years) receive 23%, so the remaining 40 clubs have to share 77%. Championship 1st - £533,000 (2.25%) 2nd - £450,000 (1.9%) 3rd - £379,000 (1.6%) 4th - £308,000 (1.3%) 5th - £237,000 (1.0%) 6th - £213,000 (0.9%) 7th - £201,000 (0.85%) 8th - £190,000 (0.80%) 9th - £178,000 (0.75%) 10th - £166,000 (0.7%) This is a bit sour grapes but if you look at the money breakdown plus the TV share it seems that unless you are rangers and Celtic then we are all on a race to part time football and low crowds. Aberdeen hearts hibs will be above that but outside of that if any other side drops into the championship then it's a worry. The standard of football has dropped considerably recently and crowds are dropping. Next season could be really bad with United and Falkirk leaving and replaced with accies and arbroath possibly. Championship teams are going to struggle to stay full time in a few years. The prize money for Division 1 clubs in the final year of the SFL was as follows (STV link): 1st - £68,000 2nd - £67,000 3rd - £66,000 4th - £65,000 5th - £64,000 6th - £62,000 7th - £61,000 8th - £60,000 9th - £59,000 10th - £57,000 If clubs managed to operate at full-time level on that sort of money, then they certainly shouldn't be struggling on 3-8 times as much. If they are, then I'd suggest that's down to their own mismanagement rather than anything else. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazbart Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 5 minutes ago, craigkillie said: The prize money for Division 1 clubs in the final year of the SFL was as follows (STV link): 1st - £68,000 2nd - £67,000 3rd - £66,000 4th - £65,000 5th - £64,000 6th - £62,000 7th - £61,000 8th - £60,000 9th - £59,000 10th - £57,000 If clubs managed to operate at full-time level on that sort of money, then they certainly shouldn't be struggling on 3-8 times as much. If they are, then I'd suggest that's down to their own mismanagement rather than anything else. Wow that is an eye opener. Didn’t realise it was so low before. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 5 hours ago, RandomGuy. said: Worth mentioning there was a vote to a more "even spread" of the money, but two clubs voted against it. Celtic and Aberdeen... The financial distribution was changed at that point (albeit first didn't lose out as much as second, for obvious reasons). The thing that Aberdeen voted against changing was the 11-1 voting majority for certain issues (including league reconstruction and prize money). That was then carried across from the SPL into the SPFL as part of the merger, with some extra rules for each of the other divisions etc. That hasn't always been a bad thing - there were several fairly unpleasant things which might have made it through with a 9-3 vote (8-8-8 leagues and colt teams spring to mind). 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the west curve Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 7 hours ago, DA Baracus said: Attendances are only dropping at clubs who have a shite season. Should that club have a good season attendances will increase. Dunfermline give out attendances far in excess of the actual number. This could work against them if the local populate think these figures are correct. They will think the club is doing great without needing to go. “ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parsforlife Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Dunfermline give out attendances far in excess of the actual number. This could work against them if the local populate think these figures are correct. They will think the club is doing great without needing to go. “I highly doubt anyone that doesn’t go to games would suddenly turn up if they thought crowds were lower.Very very few people go to games as a way ‘to help out’. Certainly not outwith times of financial crisis. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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