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ICTChris

Dundee councillor suspended

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Dundee councillor Gregor Murray has been officially censured by the Standards Commission for Scotland for sending abusive messages on Twitter.  Murray was found to have "used terms that were insulting and offensive during a Twitter exchange with a member of the public, on gender issues, in January and July of last year and as such behaved in a disrespectful manner".  

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/local/dundee/892784/watchdog-finds-dundee-councillor-breached-code-of-conduct-with-offensive-tweets/

Councillor Murray has now left the SNP, claiming that the party is institutionally transphobic, saying "as a trans person I do not feel welcome or safe within the party structure".  Murray compared transphobia in the SNP to the anti-semitism row in the Labour Party and Islamophobia among Conservative members.

SNP MSP Joan McAlpine has welcomed Councillor Murray's suspension with the following statement

D6nTtJEWAAEy5zj.jpg

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/local/dundee/891789/exclusive-dundee-councillor-gregor-murray-quits-snp-over-partys-institutional-transphobia/

I didn't actually realise that elected officials could be suspended in this way, I'm unsure how I feel about it.  I think if you are elected then there should be a high bar for you to be removed from your position.

I don't think I agree with his assessment of the SNP but this appears to be the controversy over transgender rights becoming prominent in Scottish politics.  From what I understand this issue is behind some of the discussions around Joanna Cherry MP.

Do any P&Bers have experience of this issue and what are people's thoughts on the matter?

 

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I had to google what "terf" means.

That's me learned something for today.

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I'm sure it's mere coincidence that he left the SNP in dramatic fashion claiming "institutional transphobia" in a Courier interview literally the day before this decision was made. 

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31 minutes ago, Romeo said:

I had to google what "terf" means.

That's me learned something for today.

Is it what posh folk put in their gardens?

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1 hour ago, ICTChris said:

I don't think I agree with his assessment of the SNP...

Careful now...that, I believe, is what triggered Cllr. Murray's Twitter rants (being called 'he').

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Transgender people have the same effect on middle class,  middle aged British women as Paul Pogba has on yer Da. 

Rage out of all proportion. 

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11 minutes ago, The Master said:

Careful now...that, I believe, is what triggered Cllr. Murray's Twitter rants (being called 'he').

I didn't do that deliberately, I think manners are important even if you might not agree with what people say.  

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33 minutes ago, ICTChris said:

I didn't do that deliberately, I think manners are important even if you might not agree with what people say.  

Oh I wasn't suggesting you deliberately used a pronoun that Cllr. Murray finds offensive. It was more a comment on what started this whole ridiculous saga in the first place; rather than a simple "actually, I'd prefer it if you didn't use he/him/his when referring to me", they went off on one.

 

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The councillors comments do seem pretty extreme.

What is the basis for saying that the SNP is transphobic or unsafe for trans people?

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2 hours ago, ICTChris said:

I didn't actually realise that elected officials could be suspended in this way, I'm unsure how I feel about it.  I think if you are elected then there should be a high bar for you to be removed from your position.

 

Equally there should be a high bar on how elected officials conduct themselves. I think it'd be quite a good idea for quite a lot of elected officials to get the f**k off twitter tbh.

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The whole issue seems to be almost surreal. Having read bits and pieces on various elements of it, I am probably less enlightened on the subject than I was before I even knew there were issues. Some of it is simply mind boggling. Read an article a while back and the gist of it was that the author believed that lesbians who didn't want to sleep with trans women who still had penises were bigots, and this viewpoint seemed to have a fair amount of support.

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4 minutes ago, Ross. said:

The whole issue seems to be almost surreal. Having read bits and pieces on various elements of it, I am probably less enlightened on the subject than I was before I even knew there were issues. Some of it is simply mind boggling. Read an article a while back and the gist of it was that the author believed that lesbians who didn't want to sleep with trans women who still had penises were bigots, and this viewpoint seemed to have a fair amount of support.

Both sides are utterly heads gone. Total hysteria created almost exclusively on twitter about a relatively rare condition that has been around since Adam (call me Sandra) and Eve. Haven't noticed any beardy people in dresses trying to invade the ladies toilets in Inverness as yet.

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3 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Both sides are utterly heads gone. Total hysteria created almost exclusively on twitter about a relatively rare condition that has been around since Adam (call me Sandra) and Eve. Haven't noticed any beardy people in dresses trying to invade the ladies toilets in Inverness as yet.

Heads gone would be a polite description of some of the comments that were attached to the article. The one positive was that it seems that any woman who doesn't find me attractive is simply a bigot, which seemed to be the prevailing message from the folk who supported it.

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3 hours ago, Romeo said:

I had to google what "terf" means.

That's me learned something for today.

#METOO

What I'd like to know is who makes up these words and descriptions and also when did it happen ??

Sometimes I feel like I've been transported to the twilight zone.............

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2 minutes ago, WATTOO said:

#METOO

What I'd like to know is who makes up these words and descriptions and also when did it happen ??

Sometimes I feel like I've been transported to the twilight zone.............

It's a perfectly cromulent word.

You need to embiggen your vocabulary.

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If I were asked to address someone using non-gender specific terms I’d be happy to do so.  Some folk, however, will make a big deal about it.

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8 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

If I were asked to address someone using non-gender specific terms I’d be happy to do so.  Some folk, however, will make a big deal about it.

Better off just referring to women as "burds" and guys "blokes", that way it tends to offend everyone and then you can't be accused of anything other than being a "dick" (So I'm told anyway)......

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51 minutes ago, WATTOO said:

Better off just referring to women as "burds" and guys "blokes", that way it tends to offend everyone and then you can't be accused of anything other than being a "dick" (So I'm told anyway)......

Some people will even be offended at this and insist that you call them a fanny. :P

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4 hours ago, Romeo said:

I had to google what "terf" means.

That's me learned something for today.

 

Weren't you a terf before you had the operation?

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