Linlithgow Rose CFC 2019-20

[gaz5]

Well let’s be frank... if I was a player signed with Dunipace would I rather be getting pumped every week in a shitty EoS league next season or playing for Bo’ness United Juniors (rumours are that they’ll be backed well), who will be playing at Newtown Park, part of their Bo’ness community pathway and, added to that, prospects of being progressed into the senior side?? I know where I’d play...

Good luck to Linlithgow in their new venture. They have always been a well run amateur team.

But what a state of a post that is other than that. [emoji846]

Dunipace this season were pitched into the most difficult conference in the EoS, with teams of a calibre they have not been in the company of for the last 40 years at least.

For a team playing every week against teams spending more on single players than Dunipace's entire football operation, they have done pretty well, despite the results. They also haven't had their issues to seek (having to use 49 players so far due to an injury list the likes that I've never seen before!).

Anyone who has watched this season has conceded that the improvement on the park, despite results against some of the East's top, well established clubs, has been huge.

Next season Dunipace will play in a competitive conference at Teir 7 and, given their plan is a year further down the line, have more resources of their own to be able to compete at that level. Not to mention one of the best facilities in non league football which is still being developed, one where they are owners, not tenants.

Let's follow through your "if I were a player, what would I chose" logic though. I'll throw in:

- Would I rather play in a first team, the flagship team at a club, in the best structure with the top teams in the East (and LL/SoS for cup competitions), or a reserve side in a different structure with none of the traditional big clubs left?

- Would I rather be in cup draws with Bonnyrigg, Linlithgow, Spartans, Kelty etc. or the teams in the East Juniors proposed South league for next season (Scottish Junior cup excluded, if it survives).

- Would I rather have the chance of playing in the senior Scottish cup, given Dunipace have applied for a licence and hope to get it before June deadline?

Note: this is something Bo'ness United Juniors could never offer if indeed they are "in the pathway" for Bo'ness United Seniors, because you can only enter one side into cup competitions - See Stirling University where their senior team are the cup entrants with EoS team sitting idle. Reserve teams can't enter the same cup competitions as their senior team.

- On that cup note, when the East structure is finally merged, as it will be, are players going to be happy not being able to enter cups (that the senior team enter) or ever being able to get promoted if they win a league because the senior team is in the league above and that's not allowed?

There are plenty of considerations with regards the Senior/Reserve/Pathway links that I'm not sure people have considered. It's not quite as straightforward as I think a lot of people think.

And for what it's worth, Dunipace have a reserve team in amateur football as well and an under 20's development team.

Players are players, they make funny decisions all the time, you can't second guess that.

But what I would say, given what Dunipace are trying to build and what they have to offer players as a result (they are not the Dunipace people think anymore and anyone who has been this season will know that), if the two teams are competing for players and they make the choice you are suggesting they probably weren't for us anyway.

Any roads, to answer your initial point, there are only 2 players at Dunipace currently who have been there any longer than this season and both have already signed extensions to the end of next season. Everyone else in the current squad was recruited this season and the majority of those who have been asked have also signed extensions for next year.

So, there isn't a player at Dunipace who has been there "the last couple of years" who hasn't already signed for Dunipace for next season.

Linlithgow have a couple of players in their group already who were released by Dunipace during the season and one they bought from Dunipace who hadn't turned up since the second game of Dunipace's season.

Maybe those existing players are what you meant?

[Sure & Stedfast]

23 minutes ago, gaz5 said:

Good luck to Linlithgow in their new venture. They have always been a well run amateur team.

But what a state of a post that is other than that.

Dunipace this season were pitched into the most difficult conference in the EoS, with teams of a calibre they have not been in the company of for the last 40 years at least.

For a team playing every week against teams spending more on single players than Dunipace's entire football operation, they have done pretty well, despite the results. They also haven't had their issues to seek (having to use 49 players so far due to an injury list the likes that I've never seen before!).

Anyone who has watched this season has conceded that the improvement on the park, despite results against some of the East's top, well established clubs, has been huge.

Next season Dunipace will play in a competitive conference at Teir 7 and, given their plan is a year further down the line, have more resources of their own to be able to compete at that level. Not to mention one of the best facilities in non league football which is still being developed, one where they are owners, not tenants.

Let's follow through your "if I were a player, what would I chose" logic though. I'll throw in:

- Would I rather play in a first team, the flagship team at a club, in the best structure with the top teams in the East (and LL/SoS for cup competitions), or a reserve side in a different structure with none of the traditional big clubs left?

- Would I rather be in cup draws with Bonnyrigg, Linlithgow, Spartans, Kelty etc. or the teams in the East Juniors proposed South league for next season (Scottish Junior cup excluded, if it survives).

- Would I rather have the chance of playing in the senior Scottish cup, given Dunipace have applied for a licence and hope to get it before June deadline?

Note: this is something Bo'ness United Juniors could never offer if indeed they are "in the pathway" for Bo'ness United Seniors, because you can only enter one side into cup competitions - See Stirling University where their senior team are the cup entrants with EoS team sitting idle. Reserve teams can't enter the same cup competitions as their senior team.

- On that cup note, when the East structure is finally merged, as it will be, are players going to be happy not being able to enter cups (that the senior team enter) or ever being able to get promoted if they win a league because the senior team is in the league above and that's not allowed?

There are plenty of considerations with regards the Senior/Reserve/Pathway links that I'm not sure people have considered. It's not quite as straightforward as I think a lot of people think.

And for what it's worth, Dunipace have a reserve team in amateur football as well and an under 20's development team.

Players are players, they make funny decisions all the time, you can't second guess that.

But what I would say, given what Dunipace are trying to build and what they have to offer players as a result (they are not the Dunipace people think anymore and anyone who has been this season will know that), if the two teams are competing for players and they make the choice you are suggesting they probably weren't for us anyway.

Any roads, to answer your initial point, there are only 2 players at Dunipace currently who have been there any longer than this season and both have already signed extensions to the end of next season. Everyone else in the current squad was recruited this season and the majority of those who have been asked have also signed extensions for next year.

So, there isn't a player at Dunipace who has been there "the last couple of years" who hasn't already signed for Dunipace for next season.

Linlithgow have a couple of players in their group already who were released by Dunipace during the season and one they bought from Dunipace who hadn't turned up since the second game of Dunipace's season.

Maybe those existing players are what you meant?

Fair points and good post!

[sdafa2]

30 minutes ago, gaz5 said:

Linlithgow have a couple of players in their group already who were released by Dunipace during the season and one they bought from Dunipace who hadn't turned up since the second game of Dunipace's season.

Maybe those existing players are what you meant?

Linlithgow thistle (new bo'ness) or rose? 

Didn't think amateur teams were allowed to pay/ pay for players?

[gaz5]

Linlithgow thistle (new bo'ness) or rose? 
Didn't think amateur teams were allowed to pay/ pay for players?

Linlithgow Thistle.

No direct contact with the club, to be fair to them, but we knew that's where he was going when he emerged asking to be released after 6 months of radio silence.

As expected that's who he signed for the day after we received the fee we asked for, which to be fair was nominal, to cover his kit.

[Nimmo's Notes]

The player I spoke to (at a Boys'Brigade fundraising night!) was top scorer for Dunipace last season, playing from midfield. Was being played in defence when I saw him earlier this season but is not currently at the club. Don't want to name names as it's unfair on players. He did miss a few games through injury and work so may fallen out of the picture. He had stepped up from the youth squad so probably been there a few seasons. 

Why would he want to sign for Bo'ness Juniors? At the end of the day, players just want to play football, wherever it is. 

Watched Dunipace yesterday, incidentally, as Shire had no game. Lost 3-1 to Dundonald but very unfortunate. Led 1-0 at half time and should have been 3 or 4. Dundonald were stronger after the break but Dunipace were never out of it, didn't get the better of the refereeing decisions either. 

Great to see all the progress off the park. Getting there bit by bit. 

 

[Burnie_man]

Well let’s be frank... if I was a player signed with Dunipace would I rather be getting pumped every week in a shitty EoS league next season or playing for Bo’ness United Juniors (rumours are that they’ll be backed well), who will be playing at Newtown Park, part of their Bo’ness community pathway and, added to that, prospects of being progressed into the senior side?? I know where I’d play...

Progress into the senior side playing in a league you describe as shite, what does that make you and the league you're going to be playing in?

[gaz5]

The player I spoke to (at a Boys'Brigade fundraising night!) was top scorer for Dunipace last season, playing from midfield. Was being played in defence when I saw him earlier this season but is not currently at the club. Don't want to name names as it's unfair on players. He did miss a few games through injury and work so may fallen out of the picture. He had stepped up from the youth squad so probably been there a few seasons. 
Why would he want to sign for Bo'ness Juniors? At the end of the day, players just want to play football, wherever it is. 
Watched Dunipace yesterday, incidentally, as Shire had no game. Lost 3-1 to Dundonald but very unfortunate. Led 1-0 at half time and should have been 3 or 4. Dundonald were stronger after the break but Dunipace were never out of it, didn't get the better of the refereeing decisions either. 
Great to see all the progress off the park. Getting there bit by bit. 
 

Cheers Nimmo.

I know the player you are talking about, he's no longer at Dunipace, was released in January having not featured much this season. That was due to a combination of not being able to train (quite rightly and with our support pursuing a degree which meant attending university on our training nights) and a stronger group of players.

He's a great lad who I have a huge amount of time for personally and he left with our best wishes to find regular football, playing amateur just now.

He'll be a great addition to Linlithgow/Bo'ness for next season and will be good to see him step up from amateur again.

Aye, yesterday we were excellent first half. Should have been at least a couple in front at half time.

Another game in a long list this season that we should have taken points from we end up with nothing.

Fair play to Dundonald, they stick to what they are good at, but they got a fair bit of help in the second half.

RE: off the park changes, they really have been phenomenal in the last year. Everyone who comes to a game expecting to see the old Westfield is generally quite shocked, and there's more in progress.

Doing it sustainably as you say. Getting there bit by bit. We're definitely a different club now than I think many expect or certainly remember.

[Sure & Stedfast]

8 minutes ago, Burnie_man said:

13 hours ago, Sure & Stedfast said:

Well let’s be frank... if I was a player signed with Dunipace would I rather be getting pumped every week in a shitty EoS league next season or playing for Bo’ness United Juniors (rumours are that they’ll be backed well), who will be playing at Newtown Park, part of their Bo’ness community pathway and, added to that, prospects of being progressed into the senior side?? I know where I’d play...

Progress into the senior side playing in a league you describe as shite, what does that make you and the league you're going to be playing in?

The senior Bo’ness side will be in a competitive premier league. You mistake the point.

[Guest]

33 minutes ago, Nimmo's Notes said:

The player I spoke to (at a Boys'Brigade fundraising night!) was top scorer for Dunipace last season, playing from midfield. Was being played in defence when I saw him earlier this season but is not currently at the club. Don't want to name names as it's unfair on players. He did miss a few games through injury and work so may fallen out of the picture. He had stepped up from the youth squad so probably been there a few seasons. 

Why would he want to sign for Bo'ness Juniors? At the end of the day, players just want to play football, wherever it is. 

Watched Dunipace yesterday, incidentally, as Shire had no game. Lost 3-1 to Dundonald but very unfortunate. Led 1-0 at half time and should have been 3 or 4. Dundonald were stronger after the break but Dunipace were never out of it, didn't get the better of the refereeing decisions either. 

Great to see all the progress off the park. Getting there bit by bit. 

 

That makes things clearer, think I now know who the player is. He hasn't been at the club since leaving at the turn of the year. Sadly it didn't work out for him this season due to other commitments he had, which is a shame. He will be another player linking up with his former manager at linlithgow/boness juniors. Good luck to him, hopefully it works out for him. 

It does put the original, 'players leaving dunipace' into perspective. A bit of an overstatement by Frank. (sure and Stedfast) 

Apologies for consuming this thread. Best of luck to both new teams, their managers and players. Hopefully they can progress well and build a sustainable future at junior level. 

[Burnie_man]

The senior Bo’ness side will be in a competitive premier league. You mistake the point.

I dont mistake the point at all, you describe the EoS as a shitty league, the Premier will be exceptional next season, and the Conferences will be a much stronger and more competitive environment than the 8 team league you'll enjoy next season.

[Sure & Stedfast]

32 minutes ago, gogsy said:

Was Sure and Stedfast there as well?

Haha! Well played sir

[Black Pennel]

Think I preferred the "old" Dunipace rather than this new thrusting, dynamic, macho version. Fans of clubs that've been in the EoS for about twenty minutes looking down snidely on clubs who couldn't or wouldn't join. Really ?...

[gaz5]

Think I preferred the "old" Dunipace rather than this new thrusting, dynamic, macho version. Fans of clubs that've been in the EoS for about twenty minutes looking down snidely on clubs who couldn't or wouldn't join. Really ?...

I think you need to go back and read the thread again.

No one connected with Dunipace has made any negative comments about any club, at any point nor mentioned clubs joining/not joining the EoS.

The Dunipace talk in here, all of which was factual, was in response to a fan of another club making negative, incorrect comments, dare I say looking down on and being snide towards Dunipace.

There's been nothing in there from any poster connected with Dunipace (only 2 posters to my knowledge, myself and G4Mac), looking down on or being snide towards any other club in response. Indeed both of our comments towards Linlithgow Thistle have been positive and no other club has been mentioned.

Please feel free to provide evidence from the posts to the contrary and we can discuss, if you believe differently, otherwise that's an entirely inaccurate, baseless accusation.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Black Pennel said:

Think I preferred the "old" Dunipace rather than this new thrusting, dynamic, macho version. Fans of clubs that've been in the EoS for about twenty minutes looking down snidely on clubs who couldn't or wouldn't join. Really ?...

This thread has no such remarks black Pennel, nor does any other as far as I'm aware. The responses were regarding the club being mentioned in quite a negative fashion by another poster. 

I wish all the new clubs well and have said numerous times that I hope the ersjfa integrates into the eosfl and the sjfa comes into the pyramid. (it will make it very competitive and more interesting from tier 9 all the way up to tier 5....which would be great) 

As for a new thrusting, dynamic and macho.... Not sure where this comes across. However, the club is rightly excited about its future. It is now a club on an upward trajectory, with a very bright future, with many people who work tirelessly to make it as successful as they can for both the local community and future generations of players currently in our youth set up. The club is in a fantastic place, after years of struggle, but one thing we will never forget is where we came from and what it took to get where we are. We have nothing but respect for other clubs and our history, but will obviously not support any ill informed and derogatory comments towards the club across any playform. That is what every volunteer or fan would do for their club. 

That all being said, again good luck to all teams for the rest of their season and next season. I have thoroughly enjoyed this season, the step up in standard and look forward to a fully integrated pyramid which is balanced and fair in the next few seasons.