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This ma y have been discussed before, sorry if that is the case. We are looking at ways to promote, help the game, in England they have a non league day where  they have games kicking off at different times of the day and supporters traveling to watch two or three games. I appreciate that it may not attract many however I think anything is worth a try.

Kennie  is forward thinking and I am sure that he good manage to sort fixtures out in venues as near as possible to each other to allow those that wanted to to attend.

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iirc the juniors have been approached to take part in the annual Scottish groundhop in the past but for one reason or another haven't. The annual Scottish groundhop is next weekend.

 

 

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33 minutes ago, Seaside Sam said:

This ma y have been discussed before, sorry if that is the case. We are looking at ways to promote, help the game, in England they have a non league day where  they have games kicking off at different times of the day and supporters traveling to watch two or three games. I appreciate that it may not attract many however I think anything is worth a try.

Kennie  is forward thinking and I am sure that he good manage to sort fixtures out in venues as near as possible to each other to allow those that wanted to to attend.

We have that in eosfl next Saturday 

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From the big thread. Perhaps now with Kennie there's more chance of a West Juniors groundhop happening in the future?

On 12/01/2019 at 21:21, Pyramidic said:

The EOSL are going to have a very successful Groundhop Weekend at the end of March:

Friday 29th March
Dunipace v Bonnyrigg (8pm)

Saturday 30th March
Camelon v Edinburgh Utd (11am)
Inverkeithing v Heriot-Watt Uni (2:15pm)
Blackburn v Preston (5:15pm)
Linlithgow v Jeanfield (8pm)

Sunday 31st March
Peebles v Newtongrange (12:30pm)

There could be up to a thousand spectators for the Linlithgow v Jeanfield game if both teams have a chance of winning the Conference C final

Why on earth are the Juniors not supporting the Groundhoppers?

For clubs it is not only a money making exercise but a great way to put our clubs on the football map.

The Hoppers may be bringing up to three coaches from England for the six game weekend and then there those coming up by car.  There will even be groundhoppers coming over from Germany

 

 

I had a chat with a fellow groundhopper about this a while ago.  Apparently the meeting with West Region JFA reps was going quite well but then this old guy put a stop to things.  It does not take much to fathom out who the old guy must have been but why on earth would he put a stop to such an innovative change that involved permutation of fixtures over three days many months hence?

The Groundhopper Rep could not understand what the problem was.  However, if he had known who he was dealing with and the stubborn resistance to any change and the problems the WRJFA  have had making advanced fixture permutations, the Rep would have known he was facing a battle that had no likelihood of a successful outcome.

Kennie has certainly improved the fixture making this season. But I still feel that there is a firm resistance to any innovations of this nature in the West Region.  Am I wrong? 

Does the West Region want their own Groundhop?  Or are we still sticking our head in the sand.

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My opinion may well differ from many or most, but I shall air it all the same.

I choose, of my own free will, to travel up from London on Friday night to watch a normally scheduled Junior game before returning home Saturday evening to resume my version of normality until Friday comes once more. I have done this for 4 years now and wouldn't change a minute of it.

Unlike the anoraks who think the world owes them a living, I don't think the football revolves around me. Junior football kicks off at its scheduled time for the benefit of those who follow their team. It should not, in my opinion, change everything for the sake of extremists, most of whom will spend nothing in your town or village as they will be too busy climbing aboard their minibus for their next fix to do so.  A few extra on the gate is all well and good, but these people won't be back to your club and accommodating these people with stupid kick off times will inconvenience the lifeblood of your club, the regulars, who may not be able to attend, due to  having a life outside football.

Once you have shown you value a quick buck over loyalty, this might be remembered, far longer, I suspect than the anoraks will remember your club down the line, as it's just a numbers game to them, to see how much football they can cram into a finite period.

The argument that it is a 'one off' is one plenty parrot who are fans of the gluttony of football. It is exactly that which should be remembered. It is a one for the sake of a few quid, the same few quid and more that might be lost from regulars who cannot attend or who stay away because their day has been turned into a circus by nerds who bring little to football, other than pestering overworked club officials on their nerdfest days.

I have always found football at this level full of excellent characters and would love more people from South of the border to experience it and enjoy it. If the nerds won't drag their clipboards and pens to the juniors, because they can only watch one game, not four, so be it. Remember, they'll not be back. 

It's just an opinion, as I said...but from someone happy to fall in with clubs' agendas...not the other way around.

 

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Just a mad idea but could this not be tied in to moving the Evening Times Cup next season? Use the September International break & schedule the games accordingly, would be a no brainer for the paper to actually get some leverage behind the competition they sponsor & as the "best" teams will be involved they would attract bored senior fans alongside the groundhoppers.

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4 hours ago, Moomintroll said:

Just a mad idea but could this not be tied in to moving the Evening Times Cup next season? Use the September International break & schedule the games accordingly, would be a no brainer for the paper to actually get some leverage behind the competition they sponsor & as the "best" teams will be involved they would attract bored senior fans alongside the groundhoppers.

...or, more probably, the fringe players of the 'best' teams, who are interested in the league and junior cup only. ( not that this would bother the anoraks, they'd watch anything and everything, as long as they can tick in in their  book, Ipad or whatever.) Trust me, the sound of the worst of the breed dissecting some previous park visit, instead of watching the game they're at is enough to turn even the mild mannered furious. You are better off without the nasal whining spotter types.

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My opinion may well differ from many or most, but I shall air it all the same.
I choose, of my own free will, to travel up from London on Friday night to watch a normally scheduled Junior game before returning home Saturday evening to resume my version of normality until Friday comes once more. I have done this for 4 years now and wouldn't change a minute of it.
Unlike the anoraks who think the world owes them a living, I don't think the football revolves around me. Junior football kicks off at its scheduled time for the benefit of those who follow their team. It should not, in my opinion, change everything for the sake of extremists, most of whom will spend nothing in your town or village as they will be too busy climbing aboard their minibus for their next fix to do so.  A few extra on the gate is all well and good, but these people won't be back to your club and accommodating these people with stupid kick off times will inconvenience the lifeblood of your club, the regulars, who may not be able to attend, due to  having a life outside football.
Once you have shown you value a quick buck over loyalty, this might be remembered, far longer, I suspect than the anoraks will remember your club down the line, as it's just a numbers game to them, to see how much football they can cram into a finite period.
The argument that it is a 'one off' is one plenty parrot who are fans of the gluttony of football. It is exactly that which should be remembered. It is a one for the sake of a few quid, the same few quid and more that might be lost from regulars who cannot attend or who stay away because their day has been turned into a circus by nerds who bring little to football, other than pestering overworked club officials on their nerdfest days.
I have always found football at this level full of excellent characters and would love more people from South of the border to experience it and enjoy it. If the nerds won't drag their clipboards and pens to the juniors, because they can only watch one game, not four, so be it. Remember, they'll not be back. 
It's just an opinion, as I said...but from someone happy to fall in with clubs' agendas...not the other way around.
 
For the bulk of clubs the prospect of an additional 200-250 fans through the gate at £6 a time, plus 200 additional programme sales, 200 or so club pin badges and the same again in pies and bovrils is enough the make the inconvenience of a minor deviation in kick off time acceptable.

Will the ground hoppers come back? No probably not. Will their money help keep small clubs afloat? Most definitely.

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5 hours ago, froggie said:

My opinion may well differ from many or most, but I shall air it all the same.

I choose, of my own free will, to travel up from London on Friday night to watch a normally scheduled Junior game before returning home Saturday evening to resume my version of normality until Friday comes once more. I have done this for 4 years now and wouldn't change a minute of it.

Unlike the anoraks who think the world owes them a living, I don't think the football revolves around me. Junior football kicks off at its scheduled time for the benefit of those who follow their team. It should not, in my opinion, change everything for the sake of extremists, most of whom will spend nothing in your town or village as they will be too busy climbing aboard their minibus for their next fix to do so.  A few extra on the gate is all well and good, but these people won't be back to your club and accommodating these people with stupid kick off times will inconvenience the lifeblood of your club, the regulars, who may not be able to attend, due to  having a life outside football.

Once you have shown you value a quick buck over loyalty, this might be remembered, far longer, I suspect than the anoraks will remember your club down the line, as it's just a numbers game to them, to see how much football they can cram into a finite period.

The argument that it is a 'one off' is one plenty parrot who are fans of the gluttony of football. It is exactly that which should be remembered. It is a one for the sake of a few quid, the same few quid and more that might be lost from regulars who cannot attend or who stay away because their day has been turned into a circus by nerds who bring little to football, other than pestering overworked club officials on their nerdfest days.

I have always found football at this level full of excellent characters and would love more people from South of the border to experience it and enjoy it. If the nerds won't drag their clipboards and pens to the juniors, because they can only watch one game, not four, so be it. Remember, they'll not be back. 

It's just an opinion, as I said...but from someone happy to fall in with clubs' agendas...not the other way around.

 

A wee bit harsh on the hopperati but some good points nevertheless.

The organised mass groundhops are strange situations indeed, where as you say the regular fans are somewhat marginalised for the day for the sake of a one-off earner for the clubs involved...and it must be stressed that that's all it will ever be, a one-off. Nobody's making new fans out of them, as the nature of the hobby dictates that all those people who flooded through your gates will be somewhere else the following week and somewhere else again the week after that.

I have to admit although I'm involved with a club, on off days I enjoy visiting new grounds whether on my tod or with a couple of pals, so I guess that qualifies me as a groundhopper of sorts - for me though part of the fun is arriving somewhere not knowing anything beforehand about the general vibe of the club. There's no uniformity in what the matchday experience will be like, and that's the beauty of just turning up unannounced.

And that's where the organised groundhops fall down for me - they demand a uniformity of experience where there normally is none...the sides MUST produce a match programme even if they've never done one before, they MUST have those wee enamel badges for sale that under normal circumstances a club would be lucky to shift half a dozen in a season and so on, which leads to anyone going to one of them having an ersatz matchday experience far removed from what they'd get at a normal game.

And heaven help them if there's no real ale for sale in their clubhouse :)

 

Edited by Hillonearth

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5 minutes ago, Gimme said:

For the bulk of clubs the prospect of an additional 200-250 fans through the gate at £6 a time, plus 200 additional programme sales, 200 or so club pin badges and the same again in pies and bovrils is enough the make the inconvenience of a minor deviation in kick off time acceptable.

Will the ground hoppers come back? No probably not. Will their money help keep small clubs afloat? Most definitely.

For the sake of any club who decides to become a performer in any circus, I hope your optimism is well placed/

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I've stated numerous times that I have no problem with any clubs sorting out a re-arranged kick-off time or date as long as it's not a deliberate attempt to gain an unfair advantage over other teams. So if a set of clubs want to get together and organise a 'Groundhop Day/Weekend', I'll be happy to accommodate it. I won't, however, actively try and force it onto clubs

Personally, I don't see what the attraction is for the away team. They could disrupt their normal routine and inconvenience their own players and fans for absolutely no financial reward to them, so why would they go for it.

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17 minutes ago, Hillonearth said:

A wee bit harsh on the hopperati but some good points nevertheless.

The organised mass groundhops are strange situations indeed, where as you say the regular fans are somewhat marginalised for the day for the sake of a one-off earner for the clubs involved...and it must be stressed that that's all it will ever be, a one-off. Nobody's making new fans out of them, as the nature of the hobby dictates that all those people who flooded through your gates will be somewhere else the following week and somewhere else again the week after that.

I have to admit although I'm involved with a club, on off days I enjoy visiting new grounds whether on my tod or with a couple of pals, so I guess that qualifies me as a groundhopper of sorts - for me though part of the fun is arriving somewhere not knowing anything beforehand about the general vibe of the club. There's no uniformity in what the matchday experience will be like, and that's the beauty of just turning up unannounced.

And that's where the organised groundhops fall down for me - they demand a uniformity of experience where there normally is none...the sides MUST produce a match programme even if they've never done one before, they MUST have those wee enamel badges for sale that under normal circumstances a club would be lucky to shift half a dozen in a season and so on, which leads to anyone going to one of them having an ersatz matchday experience far removed from what they'd get at a normal game.

And heaven help them if there's no real ale for sale in their clubhouse :)

 

As I said, I am very happy that my escapism from the drudgery that pays some bills doesn't require all and sundry to fall over backwards to accommodate me, others may be less worried and more arrogant.

The 'uniformity' of experience point you make is spot on. The lack of uniformity in my  experience each week is what makes it special. OK. I might be coming from a different angle to the anoraks, in terms of expectation and that I'll be back next week, but there is a point at which if you give someone 'everything' in terms of what they want, they'll simply want more. Minibus stuck in traffic...we'll change the kick off time and sod the regulars....

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9 minutes ago, froggie said:

For the sake of any club who decides to become a performer in any circus, I hope your optimism is well placed/

For a game like Camelon v Edinburgh United where there's not much to play for, I'm sure kicking off at 11am to suit the groundhoppers will be more beneficial than a normal kick-off.

Clubs have to agree with it so if your club doesn't think it would be worth it then they won't be doing it.

Just now, Kennie said:

Personally, I don't see what the attraction is for the away team. They could disrupt their normal routine and inconvenience their own players and fans for absolutely no financial reward to them, so why would they go for it.

I guess the point of the organised groundhop is that you visit all the grounds so the away team will benefit when it's their turn to host in future years?

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5 minutes ago, froggie said:

As I said, I am very happy that my escapism from the drudgery that pays some bills doesn't require all and sundry to fall over backwards to accommodate me, others may be less worried and more arrogant.

The 'uniformity' of experience point you make is spot on. The lack of uniformity in my  experience each week is what makes it special. OK. I might be coming from a different angle to the anoraks, in terms of expectation and that I'll be back next week, but there is a point at which if you give someone 'everything' in terms of what they want, they'll simply want more. Minibus stuck in traffic...we'll change the kick off time and sod the regulars....

Groundhoppers either on their own or in small groups are normally fine - we actually had a non-league fan up from England yesterday who was on his way up North and stopped off on his way...nice guy who I spoke to for quite a while before the game.

In fact, I can only ever remember one problematic one in all the years I've been involved with the club a while back when a guy turned up demanding something weirdly specific like nineteen copies of the programme - we were in the Central Second at the time and had only done about thirty! Obviously if he'd rung ahead we could have run off as many as he wanted, but he wasn't happy about being told we had regulars to think of as well. He then pissed off everyone by brandishing a press pass - I think he must have done the match reports for some team in a local paper - which he thought granted him access to the entire club.

Last seen being more or less frogmarched out of the offices about 20 minutes prior to kickoff! Thankfully truly eccentric punters with that sense of entitlement seem to be few and far between...

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17 minutes ago, Hillonearth said:

Groundhoppers either on their own or in small groups are normally fine - we actually had a non-league fan up from England yesterday who was on his way up North and stopped off on his way...nice guy who I spoke to for quite a while before the game.

In fact, I can only ever remember one problematic one in all the years I've been involved with the club a while back when a guy turned up demanding something weirdly specific like nineteen copies of the programme - we were in the Central Second at the time and had only done about thirty! Obviously if he'd rung ahead we could have run off as many as he wanted, but he wasn't happy about being told we had regulars to think of as well. He then pissed off everyone by brandishing a press pass - I think he must have done the match reports for some team in a local paper - which he thought granted him access to the entire club.

Last seen being more or less frogmarched out of the offices about 20 minutes prior to kickoff! Thankfully truly eccentric punters with that sense of entitlement seem to be few and far between...

As someone who attends games alone or with friends I have made from Scotland watching games,  I can safely say I'm not a problem. What needs to be understood, however, the types these circuses appeal to are not football fans in most people's understanding of the term. We are talking about the type who will watch football six and seven days a week and feel that muti game orgies are their lifeblood and should be arranged as THEY see fit. If I player got injured , casing a delay in their schedule. the latter, not the former would be their primary concern....trust me, I've seen and heard it and it is why I distance myself from such types actively.

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On 24/03/2019 at 19:07, Kennie said:

I've stated numerous times that I have no problem with any clubs sorting out a re-arranged kick-off time or date as long as it's not a deliberate attempt to gain an unfair advantage over other teams. So if a set of clubs want to get together and organise a 'Groundhop Day/Weekend', I'll be happy to accommodate it. I won't, however, actively try and force it onto clubs

Personally, I don't see what the attraction is for the away team. They could disrupt their normal routine and inconvenience their own players and fans for absolutely no financial reward to them, so why would they go for it.

I am surprised that you as one of the more forward thinking  junior fan are not  enthusiastic to try something like this. The game needs something different, I don’t disagree that there may not be an attractive proposition to the away teams and also to some tradionalists who prefer a 2 pm KO whether it be for work commitments or other reasons.

If we do not try things we will never know if it would be a success or not!

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A potential 11am Saturday morning or 8pm Saturday night time kick off. No thank you in my opinion. Not for me and would put off regular loyal supporters who won't make the game. If an away game then home about midnight on Saturday if game is at 8pm....! I would be hugely disappointed to have our game moved to such a silly time for this.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Shannon said:

A potential 11am Saturday morning or 8pm Saturday night time kick off. No thank you in my opinion. Not for me and would put off regular loyal supporters who won't make the game. If an away game then home about midnight on Saturday if game is at 8pm....! I would be hugely disappointed to have our game moved to such a silly time for this.

 

 

Why because it's different. Imagine that

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49 minutes ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

Why because it's different. Imagine that

No, its because 11 am is a totally inconvenient time. Some players work on a Saturday morning.

Fans work on a Saturday morning or take their children to other activities.

You will easily lose 200 regular fans to wipe out the ones you gain.

Its OK if your crowds are about 20 anyway but anybody with a decent crowd gain nothing.

If its so good why do no teams ask to kick off at 11 am normally

 

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18 minutes ago, Wile E Coyote said:

No, its because 11 am is a totally inconvenient time. Some players work on a Saturday morning.

Fans work on a Saturday morning or take their children to other activities.

You will easily lose 200 regular fans to wipe out the ones you gain.

Its OK if your crowds are about 20 anyway but anybody with a decent crowd gain nothing.

If its so good why do no teams ask to kick off at 11 am normally

 

Groundhop dates were finalised last July, eight months notice would be  enough time for players of two teams playing at 11am would it not.

Edited by gogsy

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