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Louis Litt

Christchurch Mosque Shootings

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1 hour ago, Granny Danger said:

It’s facile argument from a ‘look at me’ poster and doesn’t merit further comment.

No, it's not.

The shooter's words include the following;

“The origins of my language is European, my culture is European, my political beliefs are European, my philosophical beliefs are European, my identity is European and, most importantly, my blood is European,”

He quite clearly views himself as a product of a European construct. The New Zealand he knows; its cities, its culture, its language, its political system, its legal system and rule of law, its human rights protection etc would not exist without immigration/imperialism. While the physical body would obviously exist, New Zealand (and his native Straya) would not.

I don't really have a problem with this, as basically every country or settlement in the world is the result of multiple 'thefts' of land and resources over thousands of years. I don't really see the sense in getting upset about something that pretty much every culture in the history of our species has indulged in when given the opportunity/necessity.

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1 hour ago, Ross. said:

I only had a quick scan through it but I thought it was clear for the most part that large bits of what he had put in there were clearly parody and intended to be ironic. The Spyro the Dragon answer was a pretty obvious dig at the people who react by blaming computer games and violent movies for these kind of atrocities. He wanted people to keep talking about it rather than just state the obvious, that he is nothing more than a right wing racist with a few screws loose.

I had a brief glance but realised this was just what the c**t wanted, millions of people around the world reading his ravings. Not going anywhere near his video.

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10 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

No, it's not.

The shooter's words include the following;

“The origins of my language is European, my culture is European, my political beliefs are European, my philosophical beliefs are European, my identity is European and, most importantly, my blood is European,”

He quite clearly views himself as a product of a European construct. The New Zealand he knows; its cities, its culture, its language, its political system, its legal system and rule of law, its human rights protection etc would not exist without immigration/imperialism. While the physical body would obviously exist, New Zealand (and his native Straya) would not.

I don't really have a problem with this, as basically every country or settlement in the world is the result of multiple 'thefts' of land and resources over thousands of years. I don't really see the sense in getting upset about something that pretty much every culture in the history of our species has indulged in when given the opportunity/necessity.

Nice of the Europeans to allow the Maori to hang around really.

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Just now, welshbairn said:

Nice of the Europeans to allow the Maori to hang around really.

Not saying it was 'nice'. Just that it was no different to what has happened anywhere else.

Colonialism is not a European thing.

What happened to the inhabitants of Sri Lanka who were there when the Sinhalese arrived across the water from India about 1500 years ago and took over? How many of them are left?

What of the genocides that accompanied the conquests made by the Mongols or by ancient Chinese rulers?

There is nothing historically unusual in what happened in Australia and New Zealand. Or in the British Empire. It's just history. People live somewhere and control the land until someone else does. People who have lost land in modern times took it from someone else a long time ago. I really don't understand why people now want to view it through some kind of prism of ethics.

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1 minute ago, JTS98 said:

Not saying it was 'nice'. Just that it was no different to what has happened anywhere else.

Colonialism is not a European thing.

What happened to the inhabitants of Sri Lanka who were there when the Sinhalese arrived across the water from India about 1500 years ago and took over? How many of them are left?

What of the genocides that accompanied the conquests made by the Mongols or by ancient Chinese rulers?

There is nothing historically unusual in what happened in Australia and New Zealand. Or in the British Empire. It's just history. People live somewhere and control the land until someone else does. People who have lost land in modern times took it from someone else a long time ago. I really don't understand why people now want to view it through some kind of prism of ethics.

It's the language that the lunatic right use to claim that we're being invaded and colonised by Muslims and we'll soon be living under Sharia Law.

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1 minute ago, welshbairn said:

It's the language that the lunatic right use to claim that we're being invaded and colonised by Muslims and we'll soon be living under Sharia Law.

I highly doubt we will be, and I don't doubt that this lad is sick in the head.

My only point was that the previous poster's dismissal of the idea that NZ wouldn't exist without immigration was a weak dismissal. All countries exist because of what could be termed immigration and/or aggressive land seizure.

I don't understand the modern trend for being squeamish about it. It's what people do. It's what people have always done, and it's what people will always do. It's deeply silly when people talk as if Europeans invented colonization or somehow have more to apologise for in this regard than anyone else. This is an idea that is deeply ignorant of the history of our species.

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1 minute ago, Barry Ferguson's Hat said:

Worth noting that according to Maori tradition, Maoris were not the original inhabitants of what we now call New Zealand. They colonised it. 

http://rsnz.natlib.govt.nz/volume/rsnz_48/rsnz_48_00_004950.html

Pretty much no people on the planet is the 'original' inhabitant of where they live.

The idea itself is silly.

Just something for middle class people to worry about while reading the Guardian.

People are dicks to each other and like taking stuff from each other.

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28 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

I don't really have a problem with this, as basically every country or settlement in the world is the result of multiple 'thefts' of land and resources over thousands of years. I don't really see the sense in getting upset about something that pretty much every culture in the history of our species has indulged in when given the opportunity/necessity.

I don't either and am firmly in the 'migration improves/develops/ the human landscape' camp.  I'd go further and say London (the city I know best and in which I have lived the longest) is a hugely better place to live and work in 2019 than it was when I went to Uni in 1981.  It has its own issues but few of them are down to immigration.

BUT, tragically, we have a fair few people around without your sense of historical change.

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40 minutes ago, JTS98 said:

I highly doubt we will be, and I don't doubt that this lad is sick in the head.

My only point was that the previous poster's dismissal of the idea that NZ wouldn't exist without immigration was a weak dismissal. All countries exist because of what could be termed immigration and/or aggressive land seizure.

I don't understand the modern trend for being squeamish about it. It's what people do. It's what people have always done, and it's what people will always do. It's deeply silly when people talk as if Europeans invented colonization or somehow have more to apologise for in this regard than anyone else. This is an idea that is deeply ignorant of the history of our species.

I agree he may be mentally ill and if so, or for that matter even if not, he could easily find spurious reasons to kill people who are different from him even if any issue relation to European heritage is removed.

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Just went on twitter there, pleasingly few hot takes and YouTube getting deserved pelters. You have to hope this can lead to some action on fascist and violent content.

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1 hour ago, JTS98 said:

No, it's not.

Detourment is a troll with a long history of wacky conspiracy theories and other shit to fish for bites.
 

Quote


The shooter's words include the following;

“The origins of my language is European, my culture is European, my political beliefs are European, my philosophical beliefs are European, my identity is European and, most importantly, my blood is European,”

He quite clearly views himself as a product of a European construct. The New Zealand he knows; its cities, its culture, its language, its political system, its legal system and rule of law, its human rights protection etc would not exist without immigration/imperialism. While the physical body would obviously exist, New Zealand (and his native Straya) would not.

 

He is a white nationalist, even covered his guns in references to the "14 words".  I do not think anyone is disputing that.

 

49 people have been killed by a white nationalist terrorist. I am not of a mind to indulge an attention seeker on this thread.

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34 minutes ago, Barry Ferguson's Hat said:

Worth noting that according to Maori tradition, Maoris were not the original inhabitants of what we now call New Zealand. They colonised it. 

http://rsnz.natlib.govt.nz/volume/rsnz_48/rsnz_48_00_004950.html

That is an outdated and discredited theory. The Maori were very likely the first humans to arrive in New Zealand.

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It could be that the whole popular nationalist racist thing started with libtards being ironic.

Quote

The in-joke-filled, irony-laden vocabulary of the far-right online communities that spawned the terror attack in Christchurch on Friday makes it “extremely difficult” to distinguish a sick joke from a deadly serious threat, according to experts on the international far right and online information warfare.

References to “shitposting”, YouTube stars and the 17th century Battle of Vienna are hallmarks of “that online culture where everything can be a joke and extremist content can be a parody and deadly serious all on the same page,” said Ben Nimmo, a researcher at the Atlantic Council. “Distinguishing between the two is extremely difficult.

“You have these communities who routinely practice extreme rhetoric as a joke, so it’s very easy to fit in if you’re a real extremist.”

It also leads to situations where mainstream observers unknowingly aid terrorists by spreading propaganda without recognising it for what it is.

“The way we always have to look at manifestos like this: it’s a PR document, a propaganda document, that’s meant to be analysed, exposed, read and thought about,” said Patrik Hermansson, a researcher at Hope Not Hate. “The more confusing it is, the more it might be spread.”

 

Edited by welshbairn

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It could be that the whole popular nationalist racist thing started with libtards being ironic.
The in-joke-filled, irony-laden vocabulary of the far-right online communities that spawned the terror attack in Christchurch on Friday makes it “extremely difficult” to distinguish a sick joke from a deadly serious threat, according to experts on the international far right and online information warfare.
References to “shitposting”, YouTube stars and the 17th century Battle of Vienna are hallmarks of “that online culture where everything can be a joke and extremist content can be a parody and deadly serious all on the same page,” said Ben Nimmo, a researcher at the Atlantic Council. “Distinguishing between the two is extremely difficult.
“You have these communities who routinely practice extreme rhetoric as a joke, so it’s very easy to fit in if you’re a real extremist.”
It also leads to situations where mainstream observers unknowingly aid terrorists by spreading propaganda without recognising it for what it is.
“The way we always have to look at manifestos like this: it’s a PR document, a propaganda document, that’s meant to be analysed, exposed, read and thought about,” said Patrik Hermansson, a researcher at Hope Not Hate. “The more confusing it is, the more it might be spread.”
 

I agree very much with this, it also happened because social media went for algorithmic vs human moderation. That's why p&b is so good as it still depends on human mods to keep it relatively sane.

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34 minutes ago, dorlomin said:

Detourment is a troll with a long history of wacky conspiracy theories and other shit to fish for bites.
 

He is a white nationalist, even covered his guns in references to the "14 words".  I do not think anyone is disputing that.

 

49 people have been killed by a white nationalist terrorist. I am not of a mind to indulge an attention seeker on this thread.

Detourment is Wisbit. A gravity denying, still living with his mother at 40, St Mirren pyjama wearing sad sack. 

 

The far right hate mongers on Twitter like Shapiro, Lauren Southern and that Nazi c**t from Coatbridge seem to be implementing deflection and whataboutery in a way to excuse themselves from previously stoking up an anti-muslim current throughout their brain-dead following.

The world is fucked.

 

 

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I lived in Christchurch for a year 5/6 years ago and I used to regularly drive down Deans Avenue. Could have been me etc. 

 

It's gutting news to wake up to. This towns been through enough shit in recent years. New Zealand is the last place you'd expect this sort of thing too. 

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1 hour ago, Bobby Skidmarks said:

Detourment is Wisbit. A gravity denying, still living with his mother at 40, St Mirren pyjama wearing sad sack. 

 

The far right hate mongers on Twitter like Shapiro, Lauren Southern and that Nazi c**t from Coatbridge seem to be implementing deflection and whataboutery in a way to excuse themselves from previously stoking up an anti-muslim current throughout their brain-dead following.

The world is fucked.

 

 

Welcome back Bobby, thought he was HB. Had to google Lauren Southern and it seems she's deleted her Great Replacement video. Here's quite a good serious piss take of it with clips. It's about half an hour and you really have to watch/listen the whole thing to get it, and worth rewinding if it starts half way through, if anyone can be bothered watching it at all.

She's been in a serious whine about being accused of maybe being one of the radicalising sources of the Aussie c**t, so somebody kindly reminded her of this:

 

https://twitter.com/owen_mccord/status/1106610171055349760

Edited by welshbairn

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