A View From The Terrace.

[DA Baracus]

Nah, Gretna should be roundly criticised for their ludicrous, blatantly unsustainable rise. As others said last week, the whole 'fairy tale' stuff was always absolute bollocks.

Absolutely zero sympathy for the idiocy of the 'model' that allowed that nonsense.

That the lad from Gretna 2008 said they emphasise they are not the same as Gretna is telling.

 

Also, David Irons saying many clubs have gone bust since Gretna did is such easily disproven nonsense. Only one club I can recall have went bust since.

[mizfit]

Just now, DA Baracus said:

Nah, Gretna should be roundly criticised for their ludicrous, blatantly unsustainable rise. As others said last week, the whole 'fairy tale' stuff was always absolute bollocks.

Absolutely zero sympathy for the idiocy of the 'model' that allowed that nonsense.

That the lad from Gretna 2008 said they emphasise they are not the same as Gretna is telling.

 

Also, David Irons saying many clubs have gone bust since Gretna did is such easily disproven nonsense. Only one club I can recall have went bust since.

“We’re no the same, but what a great 4 years.” f**k off.

[PSJ.84]

Hahahaha f**k Gretna and f**k James Grady.  
 

 

No I’m not bitter, at all. 

[Sarto Mutiny]

10 hours ago, DA Baracus said:

Nah, Gretna should be roundly criticised for their ludicrous, blatantly unsustainable rise. As others said last week, the whole 'fairy tale' stuff was always absolute bollocks.

Absolutely zero sympathy for the idiocy of the 'model' that allowed that nonsense.

That the lad from Gretna 2008 said they emphasise they are not the same as Gretna is telling.

 

Also, David Irons saying many clubs have gone bust since Gretna did is such easily disproven nonsense. Only one club I can recall have went bust since.

I don't blame Gretna themselves or anyone involved at the club*, they did what they did and must have known how it would eventually end. The fault, such as it was, came from friendly media types like Chick Young who perpetuated the fairytale nonsense and gave a clearly unsustainable club the soft soap treatment from day one.

Dundee United, in other news, remain the only club to lose a top flight game at home to Gretna.

 

*except James Grady, because he's James Grady

[gannonball]

On 22/03/2023 at 19:43, TheScarf said:

They played Celtic at Livi. Big team found imo. 

It was a shambles, the tickets were already printed as if we were playing them at Fir Park so I can remember turning up Livi not knowing which stand to sit in, basically became a free for all.

Also tinhat on here but I don't quite get the bitterness and hatred towards Gretna tbh (St. Johnstone fans aside). If a philanthropist took over your club and wanted to spunk money on players outwith your level I doubt many would be complaining. It's not as if Brooks Mileson had much to do with the Scottish media so the whole 'fairytale' stuff wasn't really orchestrated PR by Gretna. Yes all of a sudden fans came from nowhere to support them but the same would happen if it happened to any other lower league club in Scotland, albeit Gretna are more of an extreme example of this due to having little fan base in the first place and size of town. 

[johnnydun]

On 23/03/2023 at 03:09, Jacky1990 said:

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/36621/12836005/kevin-mcnaughton-former-cardiff-and-scotland-player-discusses-his-battle-with-depression

Not really sure where else to put this but pretty gutwrenching to hear a young successful guy speak like that.

As someone who faces his own demons on a daily basis, really powerful to hear someone like Kevin speaningso openly about it.

Asking for help is a hard but rewarding step. Hope anyone on this forum going through stuff takes those steps if they need it.

I met Kevin McNaughton a couple of time when he was coaching my young lad, this was before his episode. A thoroughly nice guy and it is absolutely brilliant to see him back from that dark place.

Like you say, good to have him speak so openly about mental health. As we know on the depression thread, mental health can deteriorate for anyone at anytime.

If anyone is a lurker to P&B, or maybe you don't venture into the General Nonsense part of the forum, the Depression Thread can be found there. It is non judgmental and a well respected thread with no piss taking. If you feel you can't speak to anyone in real life, please post your troubles on there. The regulars on the thread can really help through experience. You are not alone.

Even writing it down helps.

Don't suffer in silence.

[Scotty Tunbridge]

Yeah the Kevin McNaughton section was really good.

The banker was a bit of a shit segment this week obviously. May be hamstrung by the championship moving their card to Friday night but could have still used Leagues 1/2 and the challenge cup final to make it a wee bit better.

[DA Baracus]

1 hour ago, gannonball said:

It was a shambles, the tickets were already printed as if we were playing them at Fir Park so I can remember turning up Livi not knowing which stand to sit in, basically became a free for all.

Also tinhat on here but I don't quite get the bitterness and hatred towards Gretna tbh (St. Johnstone fans aside). If a philanthropist took over your club and wanted to spunk money on players outwith your level I doubt many would be complaining. It's not as if Brooks Mileson had much to do with the Scottish media so the whole 'fairytale' stuff wasn't really orchestrated PR by Gretna. Yes all of a sudden fans came from nowhere to support them but the same would happen if it happened to any other lower league club in Scotland, albeit Gretna are more of an extreme example of this due to having little fan base in the first place and size of town. 

Nah many fans would rightly be worried if someone like Mileson started bankrolling their club given how unsustainable thar 'model' is.

Different if it's someone like the guy at Ross County as the cashflow wouldn't suddenly dry up without warning one day and there would be a managed transition to a lower budget, but with a model like Gretna had it was always going to end badly and without sympathy.

Agree though that the media did play a part in the whole 'fairytale' bollocks, but the majority of fans didn't buy it at all and saw it for what it was.

Disappointed that they didn't show any of the hiding Derry gave them at Fir Park. Also, was there not a game at Fir Park when the Gretna manager was locked out because he'd fired but no one had told him? 

Don't blame the players for going there as they were getting very good wages. Gretna were paying SPL wages when in the 2nd division seemingly!

[Comrie]

2 minutes ago, DA Baracus said:

 

Don't blame the players for going there as they were getting very good wages. Gretna were paying SPL wages when in the 2nd division seemingly!

I think Bingham dropped down to Gretna due to them offering near four figures a week and a three year deal.

Wildest wages that level until Rangers threw a big suitcase of cash at Kevin Kyle.

[DA Baracus]

6 minutes ago, Comrie said:

I think Bingham dropped down to Gretna due to them offering near four figures a week and a three year deal.

Wildest wages that level until Rangers threw a big suitcase of cash at Kevin Kyle.

The Kevin Kyle story of his Sevco wages will always make me laugh.

[gannonball]

6 minutes ago, DA Baracus said:

Nah many fans would rightly be worried if someone like Mileson started bankrolling their club given how unsustainable thar 'model' is.

Different if it's someone like the guy at Ross County as the cashflow wouldn't suddenly dry up without warning one day and there would be a managed transition to a lower budget, but with a model like Gretna had it was always going to end badly and without sympathy.

Agree though that the media did play a part in the whole 'fairytale' bollocks, but the majority of fans didn't buy it at all and saw it for what it was.

Disappointed that they didn't show any of the hiding Derry gave them at Fir Park. Also, was there not a game at Fir Park when the Gretna manager was locked out because he'd fired but no one had told him? 

Don't blame the players for going there as they were getting very good wages. Gretna were paying SPL wages when in the 2nd division seemingly!

I think now they would be more wary now but back then there hadn't been an owner I could remember doing this without racking up severe debt where as Mileson was mainly just using his cash untill illness. And yes I can vaguely remember Alexander saying he was going to turn up for a match as manager as no one had told him officially he had been relieved of that position. Tbh as much as you want stable clubs in Scottish football batshit crazy stories like this rightly or wrongly make it more  interesting.

[miketheheadlesschicken]

1 hour ago, gannonball said:

It's not as if Brooks Mileson had much to do with the Scottish media so the whole 'fairytale' stuff wasn't really orchestrated PR by Gretna.

That’s not completely true. It was similar to how the media got fooled by Craig Whyte. There was an air of arrogance from Gretna, which is not surprising when you had a squad of players who’d willingly dropped down levels purely for the money being led by someone like Rowan Alexander. The media were happy to print stories in the early days where Alexander claimed that their success wasn’t down to money and that others were just jealous. One journalist printed a story that a Gretna player had been racially abused at every ground in the then Third Division despite having not played at every ground. Fact checking didn’t matter. The media lapped it up and Gretna definitely played their part in feeding it.

[RandomGuy.]

1 hour ago, gannonball said:

Also tinhat on here but I don't quite get the bitterness and hatred towards Gretna tbh

Presumably because, as a fan of a top flight club throughout, you could avoid the pandering, condescending, nature of their rise amongst their "fans" and the media. Alongside the horrendous attitude you had people hounded every time they dared to mention it was unsustainable and would end badly.

[Molotov]

1 hour ago, gannonball said:

Also tinhat on here but I don't quite get the bitterness and hatred towards Gretna tbh (St. Johnstone fans aside). If a philanthropist took over your club and wanted to spunk money on players outwith your level I doubt many would be complaining. 

Me neither.

Plenty of wealthy individuals have “invested” into Scottish football and many of these fans who sneer at Gretna welcomed such individuals into their club to allow them to spend their way to success. 

Most have failed. Some clubs even went into administration as a result eg Dundee, Motherwell, Livingston, Hearts etc.

 

 

 

[gannonball]

4 minutes ago, miketheheadlesschicken said:

That’s not completely true. It was similar to how the media got fooled by Craig Whyte. There was an air of arrogance from Gretna, which is not surprising when you had a squad of players who’d willingly dropped down levels purely for the money being led by someone like Rowan Alexander. The media were happy to print stories in the early days where Alexander claimed that their success wasn’t down to money and that others were just jealous. One journalist printed a story that a Gretna player had been racially abused at every ground in the then Third Division despite having not played at every ground. Fact checking didn’t matter. The media lapped it up and Gretna definitely played their part in feeding it.

I don't remember a huge amount of articles like that but will take your word for it. The Rangers situation was slightly different for me as the previous owner had wined and dined journalists for decades who were hoping to still stay on the gravy train at Rangers. I would also like personally thank them for not doing their work at al and turning a blind eye to this obvious shyster which helped their downfall though.

1 minute ago, RandomGuy. said:

Presumably because, as a fan of a top flight club throughout, you could avoid the pandering, condescending, nature of their rise amongst their "fans" and the media. Alongside the horrendous attitude you had people hounded every time they dared to mention it was unsustainable and would end badly.

True I'm not going to pretend I was emotionally involved as a fan effected by this so admittedly I'm only really looking at this as an outsider. I don't recall people getting 'hounded' though, it's obvious if you rely on the income of one person your in big trouble if something happens. 

[miketheheadlesschicken]

Quote

THERE are two broad schools of thought on Gretna. Most people are drawn to them from a distance, relishing how Brooks Mileson has stirred up the pot in the lower leagues and interested in how this season his team has managed promotion to the First Division on what has the look of an unstoppable march to the SPL. Gamblers can also be counted among those who view them positively, having regularly cashed in on one of the most consistently rewarding fixed-odds opportunities of the British gaming industry.

On the other hand there are those who belittle and demean Gretna for obliterating their opposition with football's ultimate weapon, the chequebook. This is a group populated almost entirely by supporters, players and managers of those Third and Second Division clubs who for the past couple of seasons have been left prostrate like defeated enemies on a battlefield.

Rowan Alexander, whose stewardship of Gretna since November 2000 makes him the longest-serving manager in Scottish football, attributes this to jealousy. "There are a lot of green-eyed monsters out there but it all stems from the media. When we actually meet the teams, people on the boards and all that, they're fine. They accept what we're doing and appreciate what we're doing for Scottish football. But one or two managers prior to games say things in the media that make you think we're a money team, which is wrong."

"I think we're well on track, " says Alexander. "People knock the resources Brooks has given me and say we've bought our success but that's a lot of shite. I read an interesting article about all the players who were in the first team and how little they'd cost. . . if that was buying success I want more of it.”

https://www.heraldscotland.com/default_content/12403640.skys-limit-gretna-club-may-small-no-significant-history-thanks-vision-steely-determination-owner-brooks-mileson-manager-rowan-alexander-know-going---straight-top-michael-grant-reports/

[RandomGuy.]

12 minutes ago, gannonball said:

I don't recall people getting 'hounded' though, it's obvious if you rely on the income of one person your in big trouble if something happens. 

Fairly sure a few lower league chairmen were torn apart by the media as nothing more than bitter, small minded, jealous, fools.

As an aside, take a guess at what Scottish Journalist wrote this...

[DA Baracus]

14 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Fairly sure a few lower league chairmen were torn apart by the media as nothing more than bitter, small minded, jealous, fools.

As an aside, take a guess at what Scottish Journalist wrote this...

What a hideous article full of disgraceful, condescending pish. The shit about the lower leagues being a 'non event' and a 'graveyard' is abysmal, sneering garbage from a fucking moron (especially since the team he claims to win is no stranger to the lower leagues if he means under the top flight, which the article implies).  Also simply not true and never has been true.

Laughable how well this nonsense aged too. 'Astute businessman' indeed!

Edited March 25, 2023 by DA Baracus

[gannonball]

20 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Fairly sure a few lower league chairmen were torn apart by the media as nothing more than bitter, small minded, jealous, fools.

As an aside, take a guess at what Scottish Journalist wrote this...

That 2nd last paragraph is terrible. The style of writing and up selling says Tam Cowan but the sheer arrogance and soup taking suggest Traynor however think he was still pretending to be an Airdrie fan then so perhaps not.

[Archie McSquackle]

23 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Fairly sure a few lower league chairmen were torn apart by the media as nothing more than bitter, small minded, jealous, fools.

As an aside, take a guess at what Scottish Journalist wrote this...

The paragraph about the financial misery affecting Motherwell, Dundee and Airdrie is astounding. That's exactly why people were concerned- they'd seen it all before.