Club Licencing

[Dev]

17 minutes ago, leftbehind said:

Still think there are a few under age finals to be completed on Sundays but could be wrong. But agree if contractors in place and liason with power company is ongoing then its full steam ahead.     The car park is going to be busy in the months ahead.

Is there any possibility of getting the Lights up and working by the next Licencing Meeting? When would that be - the meeting?

[craigkillie]

All the licenses granted at the last SFA meeting will received the stamp of approval at the next scheduled SFA Meeting on June 12th.  The big business that day is a perusal of the applicants for the Scottish team manager post,  plus our women are in France for the World Cup so could be a few short that day. Don't see any other business being discussed.

Scotland will already have played their next two competitive matches by then, so you'd hope the applicants had already been perused. The story yesterday was that they'd already made their decision.

[FairWeatherFan]

21 minutes ago, leftbehind said:

  The club web site has been very silent on this matter.

 

As they said they would the day after they made their statement on the matter.

[Pyramidic]

Be nice if the SFA paid some attention to the petition but I am not holding my breath.

 

 

[bluedragon]

At least there is the planning consent approval that Bonnyrigg can now raise:

When can work start on the erection of the pylons?

 

That is very positive news. Bonnyrigg Rose were told for the first time on 11 December 2018 that they needed floodlights to meet the Entry Level club licence. They have done all the preparatory work to allow a planning application to be lodged 30 days later. From other reports it appears that the club has everything else in place to install the lights. Alongside this it has met all the other Entry Level criteria.

It is understandable that Bonnyrigg’s case takes the headlines as there is the added issue of promotion to the Lowland League. However, the other clubs may be making similar progress on installation/upgrading. I am still hoping that for the good of the game SFA will very quickly look again at how these clubs have been treated.

I am sorry to have to repeat it again but in England the process is so much easier. Although the system is different there are some useful parallels. For these  specific issues the clubs are at the equivalent of English Step 7 clubs. Step 6 is also the level at which clubs can enter the FA Cup. A club promoted to Step 6 from Step 7 needs to have floodlights installed by 30 September and meet all the other requirements of Grade H by 31 March.

FA Cup matches must be played at grounds that meet Grade H (including floodlights). However, a club promoted from Step 7 to Step 6 is allowed to enter the FA Cup even if they are still in the process of achieving the higher ground grading. The worse thing that might happen is for a club to be required to play “home” ties at a compliant ground.

So in England's relatively mature  non-league Pyramid where floodlight requirements have been clear for many seasons the system still allows clubs crossing that threshold the time for installation and while they are in the process of doing so they are able to take their place in the higher league and play in the FA Cup.

 

 

[parsforlife]

Be nice if the SFA paid some attention to the petition but I am not holding my breath.
 
 

To Ian maxwell et all 1500 people is easily ignored. Even if this petition reached full potential and people really got behind it what are we taking about on an extreme scale 10000? It will be written off as a minority.

[Footballfirst]

Bonnyrigg Statement

http://www.bonnyriggrosefc.co.uk/teams/118321/news/club-statement-sfa-membership-application-update-2427081.html

Direct appeal to SFA rejected.

As an update to our statement released last week we received a reply from SFA CEO Ian Maxwell yesterday to our direct appeal and are disappointed but not altogether surprised to reveal that it has also been rejected. (Full reply to direct appeal at the foot of the page). This is despite testimonials sent on our behalf by MSPs, our council and not least the platinum Quality Mark Community Club of which we are an associate who have previously represented the SFA at the Scottish Parliament.
We have invested upwards of six figures in ground and facility improvements at New Dundas Park over the past four seasons, not counting the work completed and substantial capital purchases made by our two main sponsors (The McDermott Group & Grant Fitzsimmons & Son) as part of their sponsorship. It also doesn't count the labour costs which a lot of the friends of the club have given free gratis. A significant element of that investment was with licensing criteria in mind, for example when we had to make several costly adjustments to our changing rooms in order to meet the criteria.
This is however not the end of the road for us, as despite the labyrinthine nature of the different articles and licensing documents, there is still one option open to us which we are seeking guidance on from parties outside of the club whether to pursue. We owe it to our players and supporters to explore every available option open to us until each of those options have been exhausted. We sold a vision to our supporters at our EGM last March of what the future would look like if we joined the East of Scotland league after 120 years of Scottish Junior Football membership, but the stark reality at present is that we have swapped one glass ceiling for another.
In parallel we are pleased to announce that we have received planning consent from Midlothian Council today for our floodlights installation. We agreed several months ago to acquire floodlights from Midlothian Council which were previously used at the old Newbattle High School campus and have concluded that purchase as a result of receiving planning consent today. Work will commence early next week on the installation of these floodlights, which means that we will have to forego some grant funding which we could have availed of had we stuck to our original plans. We feel however that it is imperative we have these in place as soon as is possible. G Fitzsimmons and Son are covering a significant portion of the costs as part of their sponsorship for next season and we are extremely grateful for their continued support of the club. There is still a substantial figure to cover so we are asking our supporters and local businesses, indeed any supporters for their help with this by donating to our funding page that we have set up this evening on this link. We are indebted to our supporters for the response received in our fundraising efforts so far.
People can draw their own conclusions on the reasons given for our direct appeal rejection but at a very high level:
- On the subject of the Scottish Cup there are seven clubs with National Club License awards that currently don’t have floodlights. In addition there are several other clubs who will enter the preliminary rounds as winners of other leagues/cups who also don’t have floodlights, based on the current Scottish Cup format. We are one of those having won the East of Scotland League (but we will have lights by then)
- Still on the Scottish Cup the last time an actual game was held on a midweek afternoon was eight years ago. Also under the current format Scottish Cup replays up to and including round 3 are played the following Saturday.
- Changes made at short notice to the Licensing system is one of the reasons the derogation procedure exists. We were given an undertaking as recently as April at a meeting of Lowland League & East of Scotland League delegates at Easter Road by the SFA VP that derogation requests would be reviewed and assessed based on the requests submitted; i.e. if there were plans in place to meet the criteria. This is completely contrary to what has actually taken place.
- The biggest concern for all clubs at our level should be paragraph four, where it appears that the board of our national association have taken proactive steps in order to curtail a membership ‘influx’. This has meant that five clubs along with ourselves were denied membership by the actions of the SFA board. This is despite scope to allow up to 200 members, with only 90 member clubs at present. This is completely at odds with the SFA values and their overarching principle to help develop clubs at all levels.
We should be celebrating our league title, looking forward to a cup final next Sunday against the Lowland League champions and promotion to that league, wondering along with the rest of the country who the next manager of the men’s national team will be and getting ready to cheer on Shelley Kerr’s side at their first World Cup.
What we shouldn’t be doing is this – it isn’t right, fair or proper.

Reply to direct appeal
“Having checked internally, I can confirm that there is no appeal route available for clubs going through the application process.

The Board rejected all applicant club derogations as a matter of policy. All applications must be treated equally with the minimum criteria being met in full rather than the Board subjectively deciding which clubs have met ‘enough’ of the criteria enough to allow approval.

Additionally, in the build up to a new season, leagues and clubs require certainty around their membership to allow proper planning on and off the pitch. Situations where league membership requires to be changed last minute are impractical and must be avoided.

I appreciate that the floodlighting criteria was added during your application process. We found ourselves in the unusual position of having 12 clubs apply for membership at roughly the same time and had to consider the impact this influx would have.

One major consideration is the Scottish Cup and we receive consistent feedback from members that postponed/replay fixture dates which, due to a lack of floodlighting, are required to be Saturday afternoons as opposed to midweek evenings are hugely problematic. Clubs are required to cancel league fixtures, with associated hospitality and match income being severely impacted. We have also had issues – one such this season – which meant that a 5th round tie would have to have been played on a midweek afternoon had it gone to a replay, which would have had a serious impact across a number of areas.

As you are aware the new Scottish Cup broadcasting contract includes televised fixtures in rounds 1, 2 and 3 which will provide an excellent platform for the lower levels of the game in this country. The BBC have the right to choose matches at variable kick off times, which may well require floodlighting at venues given the time of year, meaning that the number of games available for selection could be severely limited.

Please be assured the decision wasn’t taken lightly. We were aware of the implications for your club in particular and I understand the frustration and disappointment you must feel, however the Board must take decisions considering the impact on the Scottish game as a whole, rather than considering individual circumstances.

I appreciate this is not the reply you were hoping for however trust you can appreciate the Boards position.”

 

 

Updated 18:31 - 17 May 2019 by Brendan Parkinson

Edited May 17, 2019 by Footballfirst

[Gimme]

In short the clubs were lied to.

[Footballfirst]

5 minutes ago, Gimme said:

In short the clubs were lied to.

Without a doubt.

Ian Maxwell questions the impact of new clubs which goes against the whole ethos of the Pyramid.

I appreciate that the floodlighting criteria was added during your application process. We found ourselves in the unusual position of having 12 clubs apply for membership at roughly the same time and had to consider the impact this influx would have.

Bonnyrigg are rightly aggrieved by what Rod Petrie told them

- Changes made at short notice to the Licensing system is one of the reasons the derogation procedure exists. We were given an undertaking as recently as April at a meeting of Lowland League & East of Scotland League delegates at Easter Road by the SFA VP that derogation requests would be reviewed and assessed based on the requests submitted; i.e. if there were plans in place to meet the criteria. This is completely contrary to what has actually taken place.

SFA not fit for purpose

[cmontheloknow]

Has Ian Maxwell headed one too many footballs in his time? Pretty sure Talbot v Ayr kicked off early for telly.

[Gimme]

There are some utterly shameful admissions there that show how far out of touch they are with the game they are supposed to oversee.

The whole saga has shown that the SFA are unaware of their own rules and it doesn't look like that's changed in any way over the past week or so.

[stanley]

Disgusting.  Doesn't bode well for the future.  Seems like they will keep upping the requirements.  

[stanley]

Also, the fact that Whitehill Welfare will be allowed to continue in the division with no floodlights yet Bomnyrigg will be rejected for having no floodlights is unreal.

Not an attack on Whitehill Welfare before anyone replies to defend them.  

[Pyramidic]

SFA reply:

" I appreciate that the floodlighting criteria was added during your application process. We found ourselves in the unusual position of having 12 clubs apply for membership at roughly the same time and had to consider the impact this influx would have. "

THIS IS AN UTTER DISGRACE - what a justification from a National Football Association!

 

[bravehearts dad]

Dare I think(that’s dangerous) criteria for applying for a license next season will make undersoil heating mandatory.

 

All football fans time to boycott the sfa. Do not by any tickets to watch our National team!!!

C’mon The Rose 

[ShrimpLok]

Shocking to see an admission that the licensing criteria were changed purely to try and reduce the number of future applications. 

The fact the Chief Executive doesn’t even have the brains to lie about this is possibly  even more worrying than the fact they did it in the first place!

[wullie robb]

Reading that statement from the SFA is almost identical to Reading a statement from Theresa May. 

Wants you to believe it but knows it's a lie.... 

[FuzzyBear]

It is absolutely mental that our game is run by such a band of imbeciles. Maxwell should be emptied for that response alone.

[Deanburn Dave]

Can there be any other sporting authority with less interest in competently supporting, promoting and developing clubs.

These freeloading blazer wearing erseholes should be hunted.

[FuzzyBear]

Can there be any other sporting authority with less interest in competently supporting, promoting and developing clubs.

These freeloading blazer wearing erseholes should be hunted.

Spot on DD