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The Official Airdrieonians Thread - 2019/20 and beyond


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21 minutes ago, Glenmavis Diamond said:

Not at all. But when it's fans of othe teams who seem to be revelling in the possibility of racism having haooened, it's quite sad. 

Who is revelling in this? You've just completely made that shit up. 

I may be a fan of another club but I'm a fan who watched Rico play for two years and he was nothing but a gentleman and an asset to the club whilst he was representing us, on account of absolutely everyone who conversed with him. I don't really like to see someone who served my team well be treated like shite. 

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5 minutes ago, Diamond1924 said:

Deary, deary me pal.
 

All these rhetorical questions have given me a sore head. Your replies speak volumes. It’s not my job to educate you on what the priority should be or provide you with some critical thought. 
 

All the best with whatever you’re trying to get at. 

Yet you keep coming back Mr New Fan. This page has seen players, wife's, girlfriend's and even former employees come on and pretend to be your average fan. Agents might be the new one to add to the list. 

You've side stepped a simple question of what would justice be to you. You've clearly got your bee in a bonnet about the club over this. So all the best to you too for whatever YOU are trying to get at. 

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1 minute ago, The Moonster said:

Who is revelling in this? You've just completely made that shit up. 

I may be a fan of another club but I'm a fan who watched Rico play for two years and he was nothing but a gentleman and an asset to the club whilst he was representing us, on account of absolutely everyone who conversed with him. I don't really like to see someone who served my team well be treated like shite. 

Jump on every team thread when former players don't get treated well? 

Your Rico love in is admirable but I've supported Airdrie for a long time and have never seen a situation where an agent slates the club and accuses them of covering up racism. So I'm sorry if I seem defensive of my club for not finding a culprit when there was only one witness who hasn't been able to identify the alleged offender. 

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1 minute ago, Glenmavis Diamond said:

Jump on every team thread when former players don't get treated well? 

Your Rico love in is admirable but I've supported Airdrie for a long time and have never seen a situation where an agent slates the club and accuses them of covering up racism. So I'm sorry if I seem defensive of my club for not finding a culprit when there was only one witness who hasn't been able to identify the alleged offender. 

Generally, aye. I post on a lot of teams threads, sort of the reason for a multi-club forum. If you don't want folk like me commenting then maybe it's best you avoid multi-club forums. 

Ah well if there's never been a case like this before that means it didn't happen. Jesus man :lol: have a good day, I'll bow out here. 

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14 minutes ago, Glenmavis Diamond said:

Yet you keep coming back Mr New Fan. This page has seen players, wife's, girlfriend's and even former employees come on and pretend to be your average fan. Agents might be the new one to add to the list. 

You've side stepped a simple question of what would justice be to you. You've clearly got your bee in a bonnet about the club over this. So all the best to you too for whatever YOU are trying to get at. 

Can’t help myself. Your ignorance is grim.

Justice for me would be to have a racist fan identified, dealt with and banned indefinitely. Instead we have had none of that. 
 

It’s beyond me how as a ‘fan’, you wouldn’t want the same. I pity you and the rest of the we’re innocent brigade. 
 

Your comments are a verbal exclamation of the problem here and only go on to attract more attention from other Scottish clubs regarding this incident and their impression of our fans. 
 

Poor, poor show.

Edited by Diamond1924
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Can’t help myself. Your ignorance is grim.
Justice for me would be to have a racist fan identified, dealt with and banned indefinitely. Instead we have had none of that. 
 
It’s beyond me how as a ‘fan’, you wouldn’t want the same. I pity you and the rest of the we’re innocent brigade. 
 
Your comments are a verbal exclamation of the problem here and only go on to attract more attention from other Scottish clubs regarding this incident and their impression of our fans. 
 
Poor, poor show.

That would be justice for all of us. But I’m at a total loss right now as to how we achieve this? We seem to being going round in circles.

Was the investigation not good enough - did we not investigate properly? From everything I have read what more can be done to find the person responsible if witnesses cannot ID them?

For me it needs to be handed over to Police Scotland if this hasn’t been done - at the end of the day, it’s a crime. Or some independent body set-up so clubs aren’t self-policing and there is a consistent process for how these incidents are investigated and support provided.
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16 minutes ago, Diamond1924 said:

Can’t help myself. Your ignorance is grim.

Justice for me would be to have a racist fan identified, dealt with and banned indefinitely. Instead we have had none of that. 
 

It’s beyond me how as a ‘fan’, you wouldn’t want the same. I pity you and the rest of the we’re innocent brigade. 
 

Your comments are a verbal exclamation of the problem here and only go on to attract more attention from other Scottish clubs regarding this incident and their impression of our fans. 
 

Poor, poor show.

You're absolutely at it. 

Inconclusive evidence = unable to identify the culprit. How you make the leap to me not wanting the same is nothing short of moronic. Of course I do. But I also don't see how that will happen without evidence of who the culprit is. And I don't buy that the club have not done enough. Its in their best interests to catch and ban the person. They'd come out of this looking great if they achieved that. 

The only people trying to continually attract attention are you and the agent. Now that could be two people or one. Only you know. I have my suspicions but sadly don't have enough evidence. 

Edited by Glenmavis Diamond
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14 minutes ago, Glenmavis Diamond said:

You're absolutely at it. 

Inconclusive evidence = unable to identify the culprit. How you make the leap to me not wanting the same is nothing short of moronic. Of course I do. But I also don't see how that will happen without evidence of who the culprit is. And I don't buy that the club have not done enough. Its in their best interests to catch and ban the person. They'd come out of this looking great if they achieved that. 

The only people trying to continually attract attention are you and the agent. Now that could be two people or one. Only you know. I have my suspicions but sadly don't have enough evidence. 

He's on here to get a reaction to play the racism card brand "all airdrie fans are racists" to make Rico look even more like a victim 

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So there's folk on here obviously think Rico is "at it" or made it up or whatever.

 

Why would he do that ? Honest answers , folk haven't believed him from that start , so why would he lie ? Or someone lie about thier own fans?

And if there's folk on here that are angry that he's still upset by what he feels is the lack of a proper investigation ( im not saying it was proper or not) then why is he a "rat" for that ? Why you all so angry that he's unhappy ? It's a weird mentality! The club might feel vindicated but he doesn't,  so why is that vitriol worthy? 

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1 hour ago, Diamond1924 said:

Can’t help myself. Your ignorance is grim.

Justice for me would be to have a racist fan identified, dealt with and banned indefinitely. Instead we have had none of that. 
 

It’s beyond me how as a ‘fan’, you wouldn’t want the same. I pity you and the rest of the we’re innocent brigade. 
 

Your comments are a verbal exclamation of the problem here and only go on to attract more attention from other Scottish clubs regarding this incident and their impression of our fans. 
 

Poor, poor show.

 

You are outing yourself here. This is utter nonsense.

At no point has Glenmavis, or any other Airdrie fan that I can see, said that they would not want a fan found to be racist to be banned for life. The discussion has been based around the suitability of the process by which such a fan would be found to be guilty. The vast majority of fans seem to be of the opinion that they wanted the club to investigate this as well as they can given the limitations a football club has to investigate such incidents. And most are questioning why the Police were not brought in to ensure it is dealt with properly, such is their want to see this dealt with. Even the fans who haven't been discussing this are just saying that you can't just decide someone is guilty without sufficient evidence, not that this unknown fan is innocent, just that there isn't enough evidence to find guilty. Which you'd think would be stating the obvious.

You are perfectly entitled to think the investigation was not good enough (although that is just another argument for bringing the Police in), maybe it wasn't, I've no idea. But spare us the pathetic attempt to paint reasonable fans as people not caring about racism, it's desperate.

Edited by Diamonds are Forever
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Difficult to understand what exactly has went on as someone that is entirely not "in the know", but from what I can see Rico's statement doesn't actually specifically mention that he heard what was said himself, and given that most fans including those I'd trust on these matters (I wasn't actually at this game) have said they never heard anything I'd say the story that the racist remark was made in relatively quiet conversation and was overheard and reported by another spectator (the parent of another player) seems extremely plausible. Rico released a solid statement after the Alloa game explaining what had happened and the next morning the club announced that they would be investigating the incident. At this point everything seems to working fine. Rico had said that the club were supporting him and we had no reason to believe that the club would fail to conduct a solid investigation.

A few weeks on and the club announce that due to lack of evidence and only one witness they have been unable to take further action. On its own this would be disappointing but fine as we all know that dishing out a punishment without proper evidence could leave you in a difficult position from a legal standpoint.

The issue with the statement is the comment, "It was also important to ensure that our club and supporters as a whole, were not unfairly accused of using racist language. We believe that this process has been a vindication." That sentence is at best poorly worded and at worst throwing Rico under the bus.

The comments from Rico's brother and his agent, as well as Rico's absence from the squad at the weekend make things look even worse. These comments claim that the investigation was basically a farce and that Rico has been poorly treated by the club. These claims should be taken as seriously as the initial allegations of racism. The club wrongly stated that the investigation process was a "vindication". You can't use "lack of evidence" as a vindication on behalf of an entire football club and its fanbase. However, what would be a vindicating process would be if the club could prove that they acted properly and ethically in their investigation process. If they can't prove this and one of our players claims they did not act properly or ethically then it looks very bad indeed, whether that be by mistake or design. I hope to see Rico back in the team soon, but after reading some comments from certain fans on here and on other social medias I'm worried about what kind of reception he could receive.

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4 minutes ago, Rossm25 said:

So there's folk on here obviously think Rico is "at it" or made it up or whatever.

 

Why would he do that ? Honest answers , folk haven't believed him from that start , so why would he lie ? Or someone lie about thier own fans?

And if there's folk on here that are angry that he's still upset by what he feels is the lack of a proper investigation ( im not saying it was proper or not) then why is he a "rat" for that ? Why you all so angry that he's unhappy ? It's a weird mentality! The club might feel vindicated but he doesn't,  so why is that vitriol worthy? 

What does Rico want now, that is the big question....    If he cannot provide any further evidence to backup the incident further,    The club has stated the case is closed, insufficient evidence....     Why is that so hard to comprehend,   The lefties amongst our posters are not happy and never will be in this world......

 

 

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Getting very unseemly in here. 

We've no idea, from the outside, how this has been handled. However, if it is the case that Rico Quitongo, to whom the club have a duty of care first and foremost as their employee, feels let down, then there is at least a fair chance that he has indeed been let down. That he feels this way (assuming he does, I have no confirmation of this that I can rely upon and deeply hope this is not true) is in and of itself a failure, as the club should have made damn sure it was not possible for him to feel let down by their efforts, even if they could not in the end identify the racist moron in question. 

None of us know this, not right now. If Rico does not feel he has had proper support from the club, in my view that is a failure and something that could and should have been avoided. The guy himself said at the get go he knows you cannot always catch the idiots so it isn't like he had unrealistic expectations of how easy it would be to pick out and confirm one guy. It should not be impossible, then, to leave the player frustrated as we all are that the culprit could not be found whilst still feeling he had the full support and exhaustive efforts of the club at his back. 

I sincerely hope that he has had that support and if I'm honest I do find it hard to believe that the genuinely good people in the club would have failed to make Rico feel fully supported, but I cannot rule it out as a literal impossibility. 

Ultimately, again, we have no way of knowing as things stand if Rico's agent is being unprofessional and unfair, or if they are lashing out because they have a genuine and justified grievance with the investigation and the club handling. 

To reiterate, though, the club have a duty of care; looking after the employee should be the number 1 priority of the employer in such instances. It's deeply depressing that a young man has to deal with this when going about their work, or in society in general, and we as a support base, like all support bases, need diligent self-policing to try and stamp out anything like this happening in the stands, home or away. Anyone who wants to support Airdrie (in a sensible, non bigoted way) should feel they will be welcomed with open arms and have no concerns about how welcome they may or may not be by fellow supporters. Listen to the latest OTL podcast interview with an Asian former supporter to hear what I mean. That is deeply, deeply shameful and made my skin crawl.

Anyone who wants to come and play for Airdrie should expect that same welcome, and should be able to expect that if they are getting a bit of grief from their supporters, it is purely on the basis of their performance, without any chance of their ethnicity or orientation or anything else coming into it. 

..I was on such a high after Saturday as well. Hate that this thread is full of this issue and not the usual glorying in an utter pumping of Falkirk, but it has to be done I suppose. 

 

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On 17/10/2021 at 15:43, CapitalDiamond said:

Latest podcast up. A look at Racism given the Quitongo incident and was lucky to have Brian McPhee and Tariq Ashrif come on to talk to their experiences in football.

Not an easily listen

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/otl-podcast/id1458037240?i=1000538766798

Great job with the podcast. This is a really harrowing, powerful and important listen. I don’t think anything could underline the importance of calling and stamping out racism when we see or hear it more than Tariq’s story. 

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4 minutes ago, AndyDD said:

Getting very unseemly in here. 

We've no idea, from the outside, how this has been handled. However, if it is the case that Rico Quitongo, to whom the club have a duty of care first and foremost as their employee, feels let down, then there is at least a fair chance that he has indeed been let down. That he feels this way (assuming he does, I have no confirmation of this that I can rely upon and deeply hope this is not true) is in and of itself a failure, as the club should have made damn sure it was not possible for him to feel let down by their efforts, even if they could not in the end identify the racist moron in question. 

None of us know this, not right now. If Rico does not feel he has had proper support from the club, in my view that is a failure and something that could and should have been avoided. The guy himself said at the get go he knows you cannot always catch the idiots so it isn't like he had unrealistic expectations of how easy it would be to pick out and confirm one guy. It should not be impossible, then, to leave the player frustrated as we all are that the culprit could not be found whilst still feeling he had the full support and exhaustive efforts of the club at his back. 

I sincerely hope that he has had that support and if I'm honest I do find it hard to believe that the genuinely good people in the club would have failed to make Rico feel fully supported, but I cannot rule it out as a literal impossibility. 

Ultimately, again, we have no way of knowing as things stand if Rico's agent is being unprofessional and unfair, or if they are lashing out because they have a genuine and justified grievance with the investigation and the club handling. 

To reiterate, though, the club have a duty of care; looking after the employee should be the number 1 priority of the employer in such instances. It's deeply depressing that a young man has to deal with this when going about their work, or in society in general, and we as a support base, like all support bases, need diligent self-policing to try and stamp out anything like this happening in the stands, home or away. Anyone who wants to support Airdrie (in a sensible, non bigoted way) should feel they will be welcomed with open arms and have no concerns about how welcome they may or may not be by fellow supporters. Listen to the latest OTL podcast interview with an Asian former supporter to hear what I mean. That is deeply, deeply shameful and made my skin crawl.

Anyone who wants to come and play for Airdrie should expect that same welcome, and should be able to expect that if they are getting a bit of grief from their supporters, it is purely on the basis of their performance, without any chance of their ethnicity or orientation or anything else coming into it. 

..I was on such a high after Saturday as well. Hate that this thread is full of this issue and not the usual glorying in an utter pumping of Falkirk, but it has to be done I suppose. 

 

 

This is an excellent post and looks at the whole thing from a different (and very important) angle. Regardless of the outcome of the investigation it's clear that on a personal level something has gone very wrong here and the club have to take some responsibility for that. The wording of the statement (which has been covered at length) really did not help and is an indication that the club are lacking in this area.

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26 minutes ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

 

You are outing yourself here. This is utter nonsense.

At no point has Glenmavis, or any other Airdrie fan that I can see, said that they would not want a fan found to be racist to be banned for life. The discussion has been based around the suitability of the process by which such a fan would be found to be guilty. The vast majority of fans seem to be of the opinion that they wanted the club to investigate this as well as they can given the limitations a football club has to investigate such incidents. And most are questioning why the Police were not brought in to ensure it is dealt with properly, such is their want to see this dealt with. Even the fans who haven't been discussing this are just saying that you can't just decide someone is guilty without sufficient evidence, not that this unknown fan is innocent, just that there isn't enough evidence to find guilty. Which you'd think would be stating the obvious.

You are perfectly entitled to think the investigation was not good enough (although that is just another argument for bringing the Police in), maybe it wasn't, I've no idea. But spare us the pathetic attempt to paint reasonable fans as people not caring about racism, it's desperate.

I see no issue with disagreeing with an inconclusive racial investigation. It appeared to me that some on here seem to find that a satisfactory conclusion. That blows my mind.

 

I’m not prepared to forget about it until it’s either proven or not proven and I think that is entirely and morally justified.
 

I will certainly not be satisfied with an inconclusive investigation regarding the racial abuse of a young Airdrie player. 
 

I’ll stick to my and many others opinion. Thank you 

Edited by Diamond1924
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20 minutes ago, Passionate said:

What does Rico want now, that is the big question....    If he cannot provide any further evidence to backup the incident further,    The club has stated the case is closed, insufficient evidence....     Why is that so hard to comprehend,   The lefties amongst our posters are not happy and never will be in this world......

 

 

He probably wants support and for folk not to instantly turn on him just because in their opinion it's "case closed"  and maybe just people to have a bit of understand about how sensitive a subject this is.  

 

Not saying I understand either to be honest , and we will probably never know the truth , but if I'm a "lefty" for hoping for a better reaction in 2021 from our supporters over an issue like this and for the club to put out something better than a statement that looks like it's been written by robot working for the daily mail then fair enough. 

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45 minutes ago, Rossm25 said:

So there's folk on here obviously think Rico is "at it" or made it up or whatever.

 

Why would he do that ? Honest answers , folk haven't believed him from that start , so why would he lie ? Or someone lie about thier own fans?

And if there's folk on here that are angry that he's still upset by what he feels is the lack of a proper investigation ( im not saying it was proper or not) then why is he a "rat" for that ? Why you all so angry that he's unhappy ? It's a weird mentality! The club might feel vindicated but he doesn't,  so why is that vitriol worthy? 

To clarify, Rico did not hear anything. A father of a team mate approached the alleged abuser and obviously this was relayed to Rico.

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1 minute ago, Rossm25 said:

He probably wants support and for folk not to instantly turn on him just because in their opinion it's "case closed"  and maybe just people to have a bit of understand about how sensitive a subject this is.  

 

Not saying I understand either to be honest , and we will probably never know the truth , but if I'm a "lefty" for hoping for a better reaction in 2021 from our supporters over an issue like this and for the club to put out something better than a statement that looks like it's been written by robot working for the daily mail then fair enough. 

Did you listen The The OTL podcast,  listen to Brian McPhees interview, inspiring stuff from somebody who has been in the trenches and suffered it and came through the other side,  A legend amongst our support, No colour, No creed ,  One of us,  he is just Brian the 'B' ,  and I put him in greater esteem after having listened to him on this subject.....      Rico and his advisors could do worse than listen to this and speak to Brian than go to a media whore like Marvin Bartley..

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