Scottish Budget 2019

[BawWatchin]

Just now, Scary Bear said:

The boy from Dawson’s Creek probably is quite rich.

But is it his definition of rich?

[git-intae-thum]

The taxation carpet baggers are and will continue to be a laughably miniscule nuisance.

However Scotland having full control of all its own revenue would be the best solution.

A big start would be a Holyrood statistics centre. A proper analysis of all the ins and outs is long overdue. Should have been set up long before publication of the woefully inadequate statistical basis for the growth commission. Very important for moving forward.

Come on Scottish govt.

 

[welshbairn]

On 13/12/2018 at 11:03, Scary Bear said:

If the money was piling up in my bank account i’d agree that I was “rich”, but it’s not. I have two cars, both of which are 10+ years old. I have 3 kids to care for. I take 1 holiday a year for 1 week in a cottage somewhere in the U.K. I am not rolling in cash. That’s a couple on combined salary of £60k before tax. 

I suppose it depends on your definition of rich.

Have you got a big mortgage?

[Scary Bear]

1 hour ago, welshbairn said:

Have you got a big mortgage?

£120k.

£695 a month.

Edited December 15, 2018 by Scary Bear

[roman_bairn]

Ill be open about this and admit that I earn considerably in excess of the higher tax band. My wife does too. Consequently we will ‘lose’ around £3-4K annually combined compared to our English counterparts.

I don’t have a real issue with paying a bit more under an SNP Government (I would under anyone else who I believe would squander it though), after all we get some really good services including free healthcare for the elderly, and free prescriptions. I strongly advocate better services and anything which helps to take more beyond the poverty line.

However, I do think there needs to be consideration that the ‘top 8%’ includes entrepreneurs and indeed if we continue with the policy of not rewarding the ‘rich’ to any extent, some will leave the country or be less likely to invest in Scotland. The impact of that is potentially the loss of opportunities (jobs) being generated for those less well off.

So I think this needs to be the last bash of the upper tax bands under the tax system for a while although I fear it won’t ......

 

[welshbairn]

14 minutes ago, roman_bairn said:

Ill be open about this and admit that I earn considerably in excess of the higher tax band. My wife does too. Consequently we will ‘lose’ around £3-4K annually combined compared to our English counterparts.

I don’t have a real issue with paying a bit more under an SNP Government (I would under anyone else who I believe would squander it though), after all we get some really good services including free healthcare for the elderly, and free prescriptions. I strongly advocate better services and anything which helps to take more beyond the poverty line.

However, I do think there needs to be consideration that the ‘top 8%’ includes entrepreneurs and indeed if we continue with the policy of not rewarding the ‘rich’ to any extent, some will leave the country or be less likely to invest in Scotland. The impact of that is potentially the loss of opportunities (jobs) being generated for those less well off.

So I think this needs to be the last bash of the upper tax bands under the tax system for a while although I fear it won’t ......

 

By the sounds of that you must be earning over £100,000 each, wouldn't have thought 3-4K would make anyone earning that think about moving to another country, or even a bit more. Sounds like you're both doing pretty well for yourselves in Scotland. Avoid fights in Ruel Street and you'll be fine.

[parsforlife]

I
However, I do think there needs to be consideration that the ‘top 8%’ includes entrepreneurs and indeed if we continue with the policy of not rewarding the ‘rich’ to any extent,
 

The rich are rewarded every day, it's kinda why there rich.


It's a progressive tax system, not one with a earnings limit.

[git-intae-thum]

5 hours ago, ThatBoyRonaldo said:

Is that not the remit of the Scottish Fiscal Commission which already exists?

Assuming you are talking about GERS - the SG is unlikely to disavow their own figures.

They are not SG's figure though are they. They are the figures provided to the Scottish govts civil servants from the treasury.

The problem is the statistics that are used to compile GERS are a (deliberate) fudge showing estimates of key revenue and spends. The majority of taxation is taken at UK level...so we do not get an accurate figure of Scottish revenue, only an estimate based on populational percentage. 

This means taxation on companies making all their profit in Scotland but headquartered outwith only show in Scottish revenue figures as a revenue take based on our percentage of the rUK population 

The variances in output that such a numbers fallacy leads too could probably be counted in billions.

They have us paying for all kinds of shit in London and the South East that in little way is relevant to Scotland. These items are listed as UK wide expenditure.

Further..... they then do not count in the Scottish revenue take, income from those rUK items Scottish expenditure has been apportioned too.  Its as if we have bought shares in a company but are not getting a share of the returns.

GERS is a trap used to beat the cause of independence on an annual basis.

Its a difficult one for the Scottish govt because with most tax collected at a UK level they are never going to get an accurate picture from the treasury. Nevertheless they need to come up with some kind of rebuttal or addendum annually. 

 

[roman_bairn]

The rich are rewarded every day, it's kinda why there rich.


It's a progressive tax system, not one with a earnings limit.

The real ‘rich’ are rewarded through either genuine success, being born into money or tax avoidance loopholes.
The tax system as it stands does not reward anyone under £150k per annum imo.
I don’t quite earn what Welshbairn quoted, it depends on bonuses etc. However, whilst I consider myself lucky, I don’t consider myself rich. I guess it’s all relative really.

[roman_bairn]

By the sounds of that you must be earning over £100,000 each, wouldn't have thought 3-4K would make anyone earning that think about moving to another country, or even a bit more. Sounds like you're both doing pretty well for yourselves in Scotland. Avoid fights in Ruel Street and you'll be fine.

Yes, we both live in Scotland, but both working for non Scottish organisations and consequently getting taxed more than my colleagues.

My future plans are not in Scotland as things stand..

 

[doulikefish]

8 hours ago, roman_bairn said:

Yes, we both live in Scotland, but both working for non Scottish organisations and consequently getting taxed more than my colleagues.

 

 

• Location : bucuresti

[Cairn Terrier]

9 hours ago, roman_bairn said:

The real ‘rich’ are rewarded through either genuine success, being born into money or tax avoidance loopholes.
The tax system as it stands does not reward anyone under £150k per annum imo.
I don’t quite earn what Welshbairn quoted, it depends on bonuses etc. However, whilst I consider myself lucky, I don’t consider myself rich. I guess it’s all relative really.

Take it from me, you are rich.

 

[Baxter Parp]

23 hours ago, roman_bairn said:

Yes, we both live in Scotland, but both working for non Scottish organisations and consequently getting taxed more than my colleagues.

My future plans are not in Scotland as things stand..

 

https://mic.com/articles/109742/why-do-so-many-rich-people-think-they-re-in-the-middle-class#.SdcJ5a0OP

Why Do So Many Rich People Think They're in the Middle Class?

[roman_bairn]

https://mic.com/articles/109742/why-do-so-many-rich-people-think-they-re-in-the-middle-class#.SdcJ5a0OP
Why Do So Many Rich People Think They're in the Middle Class?

I believe the rich can buy whatever they want and never worry.
I on the other hand have to work to pay the mortgage etc so no, I’m not in that bracket.
I don’t even consider myself middle class. My father was a bus driver and I went to one of the worst comprehensive schools in Glasgow. It’s not even around anymore....

[Granny Danger]

Rich is being able to have a nice lifestyle for the rest of your days without working.

 

[Brother Blades]

Rich is being able to have a nice lifestyle for the rest of your days without working.

 

No it’s not. It certainly depends what age you are when making that statement.

An 18 year old with a million quid isn’t rich, an octogenarian with a million quid is.

 

I mean by your definition.

[Granny Danger]

1 hour ago, Brother Blades said:

No it’s not. It certainly depends what age you are when making that statement.

An 18 year old with a million quid isn’t rich, an octogenarian with a million quid is.

 

I mean by your definition.

That’s why I never said it was a set amount of money.  You are simply reinforcing that point.

 

[Brother Blades]

That’s why I never said it was a set amount of money.  You are simply reinforcing that point.
 

Ok, point accepted. Is it possible that someone aged 21 with £3m in the bank, could be considered rich? Or would the definition be entirely different.
My argument has holes, as does yours.

[git-intae-thum]

14 minutes ago, Brother Blades said:

Ok, point accepted. Is it possible that someone aged 21 with £3m in the bank, could be considered rich? Or would the definition be entirely different.
My argument has holes, as does yours.

Given that a very attainable 5% per cent per annum return £ would provide a passive income of £150,000 pa.....then yes that is a rich 21 year old.

....the question is surely down to the 21 year old. If the choose to spunk much of it on a mad lifestyle then they would be only temporarily rich fuds.

Edited December 17, 2018 by git-intae-thum

[vikingTON]

On 12/13/2018 at 07:19, Scary Bear said:

£43k seems to be where the magic happens. I wish I felt that buzz of being rich. In reality, just like everyone else, my standard of living has been on a downward spiral since about 2010/2011 when the austerity years started kicking in. No wage rises until this year, actually having to pay a few hundred for a public sector pension, receipts for all T&S (no pockling opportunities). It’s been a while since I looked at the real terms decline in my take home salary but it was around 15% last I looked.  It’s good that I can reinvest some of the 2% wage rise I got this year back into the system. My wife is a part-time lecturer at a college and earns a whopping £19k. 

It's genuinely hilarious that you think that your partner earning 80% of the annual full-time salary for a part-time role is some sort of terrible hardship, rather than a comfy deal that most working parents in the country would rip your arms off for.