2020 Group Draw

[forameus]

3 minutes ago, craigkillie said:

We were so "done" that we led 1-0 at half-time in the final game and were 45 minutes away from the play-offs.

Yeah.  There's a difference between being "done" and the result being an incredibly important one.  We could have gotten the points we needed against Slovakia away, England (either home or away) or the mentioned final game against Slovenia.  Granted, the Lithuania one really fucked us up, given it was the one we should have won, but it's a massive leap to say we were done after that.

The only campaign that came close to that was Levein's disastrous one as far as I can remember.  We only got two points from the two early home games, that we probably should have won.  But Belgium, Croatia and (obviously) Serbia dropped points in those games too.  But then we did go on to lose the next 4, so that probably did it.  Can't remember exactly the point we mathematically missed out, but I remember it was veeeery early.

[craigkillie]

41 minutes ago, Pie Of The Month said:

A big chunk of Astana's team aren't Kazakh, Celtic were 5-0 up from the 1st leg, it was in the middle of the summer in Astana, Celtic had played 2 league games so far compared with Astana's couple of dozen.

Other than that it's an entirely comparable situation.

Just to expand on that, the Astana starting XI had 4 Kazakh players, and the Celtic one had 6 Scottish players (of whom only two started against Albania & Israel). So we're talking about a game played almost two years previously involving a maximum of 10 of the same players under completely different playing conditions and match circumstances.

[Bully Wee Villa]

Yeah, but apart from that though. Same. 

[Marshmallo]

1 hour ago, Blootoon87 said:

1 hour ago, The Moonster said:

Yes. Have a look at their squad and tell me why you think we shouldn't be beating them. "Aye but Scotland always f**k it up" isn't a valid reason for us not to believe we can beat them.

It is, it really is. I'll be amazed if we win over there.

You're going to make a lot of money in that case. Kazakhstan will be about 4/1 if not longer.

[Blootoon87]

Yeah.  There's a difference between being "done" and the result being an incredibly important one.  We could have gotten the points we needed against Slovakia away, England (either home or away) or the mentioned final game against Slovenia.  Granted, the Lithuania one really fucked us up, given it was the one we should have won, but it's a massive leap to say we were done after that.
The only campaign that came close to that was Levein's disastrous one as far as I can remember.  We only got two points from the two early home games, that we probably should have won.  But Belgium, Croatia and (obviously) Serbia dropped points in those games too.  But then we did go on to lose the next 4, so that probably did it.  Can't remember exactly the point we mathematically missed out, but I remember it was veeeery early.

Weren't we the first European nation to be knocked out? Glory days.

[Blootoon87]

You're going to make a lot of money in that case. Kazakhstan will be about 4/1 if not longer.

Where's the phree munny gif?

[forameus]

1 minute ago, Blootoon87 said:

18 minutes ago, forameus said:

Yeah.  There's a difference between being "done" and the result being an incredibly important one.  We could have gotten the points we needed against Slovakia away, England (either home or away) or the mentioned final game against Slovenia.  Granted, the Lithuania one really fucked us up, given it was the one we should have won, but it's a massive leap to say we were done after that.
The only campaign that came close to that was Levein's disastrous one as far as I can remember.  We only got two points from the two early home games, that we probably should have won.  But Belgium, Croatia and (obviously) Serbia dropped points in those games too.  But then we did go on to lose the next 4, so that probably did it.  Can't remember exactly the point we mathematically missed out, but I remember it was veeeery early.

Weren't we the first European nation to be knocked out? Glory days.

Indeed.  Or if not, I believe we were around the same time as San Marino and the like.  

[Bully Wee Villa]

8 minutes ago, Marshmallo said:

You're going to make a lot of money in that case. Kazakhstan will be about 4/1 if not longer.

You won't get 4/1 for Kazakhstan or Draw. 

[Marshmallo]

8 minutes ago, Bully Wee Villa said:

You won't get 4/1 for Kazakhstan or Draw. 

I know, hence why I said Kazakhstan specifically. Scotland will be about 1/2 and justifiably so.

[JamesM82]

54 minutes ago, Tarmo Kink said:

By far our best chance to qualify in a long long long time and this thread is filled with people greeting about Kazakhstan away. Jesus christ.

 

We just lost to Israel away in the Nations League, drew at home to Lithuania in the last World Cup and lost in Georgia in the last Euros.

Scotland are not a sure thing against anyone other than the micro-nations (e.g. San Marino).

[Enigma]

They're team is filled with players playing in Kazakhstan. Unless we think that the Kazakhstan top flight is on a par with the Scottish/English Premiership/English Championship then, aye, it's fairly easy to think we'll win this one. And it's Kazakhstan we're playing in, not Mordor. 

Football isn’t played on paper.

[Melanius Mullarkey]

2 minutes ago, Enigma said:

 

Football isn’t played on paper.

 

Wait. What?

[charger29]

3 hours ago, lanky_ffc said:

I don't see that being an issue. Belgium still played close to their strongest team in the Bosnia and Cyprus matches after they'd sealed qualifying and such is their depth, I'd fancy them to beat Russia even with a handful of changes.

Yeah, I don't disagree with you there. Belgium seem destined for 27-30pts just now. I just think in terms of the perfect fixture list, I would rather it was us playing Belgium at home on one of the last two matchdays rather than Russia.

It's rare for a team to win all their qualifying games. It only tends to be one team that does it across all the groups.

[The Moonster]

25 minutes ago, Enigma said:

 

Football isn’t played on paper.

 

No it isn't. But it's a fair indicator that if any of these lads were of any real quality they'd be playing at levels above the Kazakhstan Premier.  We are better than them and should win. It's really that simple.

[TheScarf]

2 hours ago, JamesM82 said:

We just lost to Israel away in the Nations League, drew at home to Lithuania in the last World Cup and lost in Georgia in the last Euros.

Scotland are not a sure thing against anyone other than the micro-nations (e.g. San Marino).

And Croatia.

[Monkey Tennis]

2 hours ago, charger29 said:

 

It's rare for a team to win all their qualifying games. It only tends to be one team that does it across all the groups.

Indeed.

I think Spain did it in one of our qualifying groups a few years back, but it's something that seldom happens.   And yet, people on here yesterday were saying we didn't have to bother about Belgium because they'd hammer everyone. 

It's a destructive outlook that just involves abdicating responsibility.

[Enigma]

No it isn't. But it's a fair indicator that if any of these lads were of any real quality they'd be playing at levels above the Kazakhstan Premier.  We are better than them and should win. It's really that simple.

 Could be there’s foreign player limits and, like Russia, a bit of money swilling about, so the best players are encouraged to stay in the country.

 

I just hope the management and team don’t underestimate this side and get it in their heads, like some on here, that we just have to turn up. We’ve been there before.

 

[Jambomo]

No it isn't. But it's a fair indicator that if any of these lads were of any real quality they'd be playing at levels above the Kazakhstan Premier.  We are better than them and should win. It's really that simple.

I don’t disagree with you but what Scotland should achieve and what we actually achieve are often two different things and I think that is what the others mean.

I would think Scotland should beat Kazakhstan, Cyprus and San Marino home and away but I wouldn’t be betting the house on us not dropping any points along the way.

[TheScarf]

Scotland will get full points from Kazakhstan, Cyprus and San Marino.   All 3 are utter gangs.

[The Moonster]

10 hours ago, Enigma said:

 Could be there’s foreign player limits and, like Russia, a bit of money swilling about, so the best players are encouraged to stay in the country.

I just hope the management and team don’t underestimate this side and get it in their heads, like some on here, that we just have to turn up. We’ve been there before.

I have no idea what their league rules are and to be honest I can't be arsed looking it up, but a quick google suggests their wages are just slightly above Aussie football, hardly bank bursting sums.  I'm not saying we just need to turn up, we need to turn up and be competent and I absolutely believe we will be.

4 hours ago, Jambomo said:

I don’t disagree with you but what Scotland should achieve and what we actually achieve are often two different things and I think that is what the others mean.

I would think Scotland should beat Kazakhstan, Cyprus and San Marino home and away but I wouldn’t be betting the house on us not dropping any points along the way.

 

We've got one guy saying "do you really believe we'll win there?" as if someone has just suggested we'll beat Belgium with 7 men. It's fucking Kazakhstan, I don't understand the fear.