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Albania vs Scotland


Gordopolis

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Fletcher has to be our first choice striker going forward. Far too many people become fixated on how many goals a "striker" scores when judging his effectiveness, when in fact a centre forward, especially in modern football. has to be more than that. I'd go as far as to say that, as a lone striker, goals are of secondary importance given that your job is to support and launch attacks. Fletcher did this admirably last night.
Lee Griffiths, on the other hand, appears uniquely interested in scoring goals, to the extent that he becomes a liability to the team. The amount of chances we had in the second half at Hampden (against Albania) would have doubled had Griffiths lifted his head when in possession. It's too important for Griff to be "number one" rather than a cog in an effective machine.
At the moment I'd keep him as an impact sub. 



Griffiths just isn’t that good. He can’t even get a game for his club.

Fletcher is a much better option.
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11 minutes ago, velo army said:

Fletcher has to be our first choice striker going forward. Far too many people become fixated on how many goals a "striker" scores when judging his effectiveness, when in fact a centre forward, especially in modern football. has to be more than that. I'd go as far as to say that, as a lone striker, goals are of secondary importance given that your job is to support and launch attacks. Fletcher did this admirably last night.

Lee Griffiths, on the other hand, appears uniquely interested in scoring goals, to the extent that he becomes a liability to the team. The amount of chances we had in the second half at Hampden (against Albania) would have doubled had Griffiths lifted his head when in possession. It's too important for Griff to be "number one" rather than a cog in an effective machine.

At the moment I'd keep him as an impact sub. 

Leigh has made it abundantly clear he doesn't want to play for McLeish.  So it's all conjecture at this point.

Given all the other options are either playing out of position, not playing for their club, or playing right back, Fletcher's about the only option they have playing the formation that they do.  

I would say the number of goals a striker scores is bloody damn important when you're a below average side like Scotland.  It's like being the bottom six of the Premiership - if you've got a Liam Boyce or dare I say it, a Kris Boyd, who scores 25 goals a season, you'll be fine, even if you have utter dumplings at centre back.

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1 hour ago, Highlandmagyar 2nd Tier said:

They probably Will, but take into context who we are playing and the fact that the manager is an incoherent mess and his two stooges haven't got a clue as to what they are saying and doing just bores out what most supporters are saying. McLeish is a train wreck of an appointment.

We're playing a team who has consistently played at the same level as us for 20 years and seem to be on a decent run of form under a new manager.

Israel finish 3rd most of the time in qualifying campaigns. We finish 3rd most of the time in qualifying campaigns.

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39 minutes ago, Savage Henry said:

Leigh has made it abundantly clear he doesn't want to play for McLeish.  So it's all conjecture at this point.

Given all the other options are either playing out of position, not playing for their club, or playing right back, Fletcher's about the only option they have playing the formation that they do.  

I would say the number of goals a striker scores is bloody damn important when you're a below average side like Scotland.  It's like being the bottom six of the Premiership - if you've got a Liam Boyce or dare I say it, a Kris Boyd, who scores 25 goals a season, you'll be fine, even if you have utter dumplings at centre back.

When did he do that?

Fletcher is probably a better option but I would still want Leigh in the squad.

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43 minutes ago, Savage Henry said:

Leigh has made it abundantly clear he doesn't want to play for McLeish.  So it's all conjecture at this point.

Given all the other options are either playing out of position, not playing for their club, or playing right back, Fletcher's about the only option they have playing the formation that they do.  

I would say the number of goals a striker scores is bloody damn important when you're a below average side like Scotland.  It's like being the bottom six of the Premiership - if you've got a Liam Boyce or dare I say it, a Kris Boyd, who scores 25 goals a season, you'll be fine, even if you have utter dumplings at centre back.

 

No-one is saying goals aren't important, the point is that just because that person isn't the last person to touch the ball before it goes into the net doesn't mean they haven't helped contribute goals to the team. As has been pointed out, with most teams playing one striker these days their role has changed. It used to be the job of the creative players to create for the strikers to score goals. In a lot of teams now it's almost the reverse, the striker is there for the attacking midfielders to play off and get goals themselves. Obviously they should still be getting a few by the fact they are going to be around the goal, but it's not solely what they should be judged on.

The other issue is what if your Boyce or Boyd gets injured or retires. Unless the player is exceptional like a Gareth Bale, then I'd much rather have a system where 4 or 5 players are expected to chip in with the goals, not just one, because as County found out when that one player isn't there you're in bother.

And even if you ignore all that, the bottom line is that Griffiths goal record for Scotland is dreadful, so even if you want a striker who is just all about goals, he isn't the man. As Lex says, he's not very good.

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5 minutes ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

 

No-one is saying goals aren't important, the point is that just because that person isn't the last person to touch the ball before it goes into the net doesn't mean they haven't helped contribute goals to the team. As has been pointed out, with most teams playing one striker these days their role has changed. It used to be the job of the creative players to create for the strikers to score goals. In a lot of teams now it's almost the reverse, the striker is there for the attacking midfielders to play off and get goals themselves. Obviously they should still be getting a few by the fact they are going to be around the goal, but it's not solely what they should be judged on.

The other issue is what if your Boyce or Boyd gets injured or retires. Unless the player is exceptional like a Gareth Bale, then I'd much rather have a system where 4 or 5 players are expected to chip in with the goals, not just one, because as County found out when that one player isn't there you're in bother.

And even if you ignore all that, the bottom line is that Griffiths goal record for Scotland is dreadful, so even if you want a striker who is just all about goals, he isn't the man. As Lex says, he's not very good.

No, that's fair.  I wouldn't argue with any of that.  I do think that Scotland have missed a trick by not at least including a pure penalty box poacher in their squads over the last few years.

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One of the biggest positives of yesterday's massacre was the enforced inclusion of Bates.

Not because he was particularly outstanding, but more because he should now serve as a constant rusty-haired reminder that the likes of Harper, Henderson, Gauld et al shouldn't necessarily be ignored just because they've had the temerity to move to countries which speak a different language.

I've done some research, and it turns out that a number of the world's best teams don't write players off on this basis. Who fucking knew?

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If the players are good enough then they'll be picked no matter where they play. Garry O'Connor was picked regularly while he was in Russia, Kenny Miller was picked regularly while he was in Turkey, John Collins was picked regularly while he was in France, Paul Lambert was picked regularly while he was in Germany etc.

Bates, Henderson and Gauld are all playing second tier football, so it's not like we're overlooking guys who are tearing up foreign leagues left, right and centre. And before people reply with the usual stuff about us picking English Championship players - there was only one player from that league in our team last night.

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4 minutes ago, accies1874 said:

I wonder how close last night's team was to McLeish's original team when the squad was announced.
He said Tierney was involved and I'd assume McGinn would've been. Probably Mulgrew too.

I think McLeish said as much (Tierney, Mulgrew and McGinn) in the post match stuff last night.

Despite all the call offs I never felt we lost anyone crucial - maybe because it felt like we didn't have anyone crucial! Well maybe Fraser and Forrest.

Great to finally see those two ripping into an opponent like that at long last. Hope we can get some consistency of selection now to capitalise on their abilities.

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I think McLeish said as much (Tierney, Mulgrew and McGinn) in the post match stuff last night.
Despite all the call offs I never felt we lost anyone crucial - maybe because it felt like we didn't have anyone crucial! Well maybe Fraser and Forrest.
Great to finally see those two ripping into an opponent like that at long last. Hope we can get some consistency of selection now to capitalise on their abilities.
Tierney would've been a better option at right-back, but Bates and Armstrong certainly didn't make the team worse. Armstrong arguably made it better.
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One of the biggest positives of yesterday's massacre was the enforced inclusion of Bates.
Not because he was particularly outstanding, but more because he should now serve as a constant rusty-haired reminder that the likes of Harper, Henderson, Gauld et al shouldn't necessarily be ignored just because they've had the temerity to move to countries which speak a different language.
I've done some research, and it turns out that a number of the world's best teams don't write players off on this basis. Who fucking knew?
This is another bug bear of mine, players who leave the SPL for 'lesser' teams in a higher standard are dismissed too often yet would probably stand out massively in The SPL, Steven Fletcher the example this past week.
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I thought Fletcher was excellent last night. Seemed very obvious from the line-up the three behind him would he the main men (and they were) but Fletcher's hold up play and little lay offs were excellent. McBurnie or Phillips don't have the ability or experience to perform that role. 

My only concern is Paterson at right back, but due to lack of alternatives, it has to be the same starting XI for Tuesday night. 

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44 minutes ago, BRAVELANEY said:
2 hours ago, Meadow_Jock said:
One of the biggest positives of yesterday's massacre was the enforced inclusion of Bates.
Not because he was particularly outstanding, but more because he should now serve as a constant rusty-haired reminder that the likes of Harper, Henderson, Gauld et al shouldn't necessarily be ignored just because they've had the temerity to move to countries which speak a different language.
I've done some research, and it turns out that a number of the world's best teams don't write players off on this basis. Who fucking knew?

This is another bug bear of mine, players who leave the SPL for 'lesser' teams in a higher standard are dismissed too often yet would probably stand out massively in The SPL, Steven Fletcher the example this past week.

This.  Any team apart from Celtic would be utterly creaming their pants at the prospect of signing Fletcher. He would be an outstanding signing for any of these teams. Anyone who says otherwise is talking nonsense.

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I thought Fletcher was excellent last night. Seemed very obvious from the line-up the three behind him would he the main men (and they were) but Fletcher's hold up play and little lay offs were excellent. McBurnie or Phillips don't have the ability or experience to perform that role. 
My only concern is Paterson at right back, but due to lack of alternatives, it has to be the same starting XI for Tuesday night. 


Shinnie at right back?! Don’t think he could be as bad as Paterson there.
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