LongTimeLurker Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Just now, Cyclizine said: This was before the creation of "The Pyramid" though. No-one has yet applied to the HFL, ... The pyramid was around when Lithgae and Banks o' Dee got licensed. My recollection is that Lithgae were told that they could stay junior for now but might eventually be forced to move to the EoS or lose their license. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Cyclizine said: No they weren't, many folk including myself have explained the circumstances behind the choice of clubs. Remember, this was before current licencing existed as well. Banks o' Dee are sitting pretty: SFA member, licenced, guaranteed access to the Scottish Cup, walking the NRJFA Superleague and cups. It's almost like some of the big guns in the West; they're a big fish in a small pond. I can understand Strathspey Thistle being chosen over them to keep a geographical spread, but I don't get why they weren't chosen over Turriff or especially Formartine whose pitch was still a bog years after they joined. The rumour at the time was that the top sides were wary of the competition. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclizine Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: The pyramid was around when Lithgae and Banks o' Dee got licensed. My recollection is that Lithgae were told that they could stay junior for now but might eventually be forced to move to the EoS or lose their license. But is wasn't around when Banks o' Dee last applied. It's interesting that Linlithgow were told that they'd potentially have to move to the EoSFL a couple of years ago (when they had no intention of moving), yet no suggestion was made regarding Banks o' Dee (or Girvan). I think if Banks o' Dee applied to the HFL, they couldn't be rejected without opening a huge can of worms for the league. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Cyclizine said: ...I think if Banks o' Dee applied to the HFL, they couldn't be rejected without opening a huge can of worms for the league. It's too bad this has never been tested in some ways. Given the HL member clubs knocked back the plan to split that league that revolved around clubs like Banks O'Dee applying so they could have a 10-10 format, I don't think it's safe to make any assumptions on how far they would go to keep their 18 club status quo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclizine Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 5 minutes ago, welshbairn said: I can understand Strathspey Thistle being chosen over them to keep a geographical spread, but I don't get why they weren't chosen over Turriff or especially Formartine whose pitch was still a bog years after they joined. The rumour at the time was that the top sides were wary of the competition. I'm sure there was a degree of this. Strathspey were always going to be elected based on geography. I think Turriff was again probably geographical. Formartine is a little more shady. Both the latter also had significant financial backers. I'm sure there was a degree of tactical voting by certain clubs, but that's never going to be proven. Certainly, it wasn't the shoe in that Banks o' Dee (and most of us) assumed. It also seems that their presentation (or lack of...) to clubs left a lot to be desired. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclizine Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 1 minute ago, LongTimeLurker said: It's too bad this has never been tested in some ways. Given the HL member clubs knocked back the plan to split that league that revolved around clubs like Banks O'Dee applying so they could have a 10-10 format, I don't think it's safe to make any assumptions on how far they would go to keep their 18 club status quo. That was the terrible "Stables plan". It would've involve a 22 game season and a sectional cup to make up games. It was rightly voted down. The current plan is to split after 20 clubs, not at 20. I still think this issue could've been avoided if the HFL hadn't come into the pyramid at level 5, above what at the time were "equal level" EoSFL and SoSFL. If separated North/South leagues had been created from interested parties; the HFL, EoSFL and SoSFL could've sat quite happily below these and we'd have had a ready made regional setup, particularly if the SoSFL enlarged to cover similar territory to the WRJFA. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer1969 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 On 26/04/2019 at 10:48, Ginaro said: I wondered what the EoS would look like if for example Fauldhouse or another ERJFA club started a second exodus. Sorted teams by conference position and points, then added Juniors and finally the two new teams and split into A/B/C like last season. Haven't included Tayport or the two Perth clubs below the dividing line, but apart from Newburgh to the Borders three times (that might change as they are likely to drop a position or two) it doesn't look too bad for the Juniors... Youve missed Leith Athletic out. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Doonhamer1969 said: Youve missed Leith Athletic out. I posted that on Friday, assuming EK or Berwick would win the play-off so another EoS team would leave to fill Selkirk's place, meaning Leith would be in the Premier Division. Looking more likely Cove will win, so Leith might not move up. Of course Glenrothes and Syngenta won't be in there as well. Edited April 30, 2019 by Ginaro 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer1969 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, Ginaro said: I posted that on Friday, assuming EK or Berwick would win the play-off so another EoS team would leave to fill Selkirk's place, meaning Leith would be in the Premier Division. Looking more likely Cove will win, so Leith might not move up. Of course Glenrothes and Syngenta won't be in there as well. Wouldnt it be Sauchie who move up to the EoS Premier ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) Sauchie are almost definite to move up unless WW go down without an EoS club moving up, which is only theoretically possible if rules are applied in an unlikely way in the event of Cove being promoted. Leith would be the second sixth place team to be in EoS premier if WW are not relegated and an EoS premier eligible club fills the Selkirk vacancy. There's no conceivable way at this point for all three sixth placed teams to be in EoS premier next season. Edited April 30, 2019 by LongTimeLurker 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer1969 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said: Sauchie are almost definite to move up unless WW go down without an EoS club moving up, which is only theoretically possible if rules are applied in an unlikely way. Leith would be the second sixth place team to be in EoS premier if WW are not relegated and an EoS premier eligible club fills the Selkirk vacancy. There's no conceivable way at this point for all three sixth placed teams to be in EoS premier next season. Is there a situation where Whitehill will not be relegated ? i understood they were certain to go down as the last placed team. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Yes, if there is no licensed EoS champion and Cove don't get promoted they definitely won't get relegated under any conceivable interpretation of the rules and the Selkirk vacancy will get filled by application to bring things up to 16 again. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert James Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, LongTimeLurker said: Sauchie are almost definite to move up unless WW go down without an EoS club moving up, which is only theoretically possible if rules are applied in an unlikely way in the event of Cove being promoted. Leith would be the second sixth place team to be in EoS premier if WW are not relegated and an EoS premier eligible club fills the Selkirk vacancy. There's no conceivable way at this point for all three sixth placed teams to be in EoS premier next season. If, because of further SFA Board delays, licences aren't awarded in time, before the Lowland League's AGM, to EoS clubs who applied for them before 31st March 2019, it would be an appalling error. Should this happen, the obvious choice for promotion by application, would be Linlithgow Rose. They are already licensed, and have floodlights. Former Lowland club Preston Athletic, are licensed, and may have applied. There are few other clubs which would be licensed applicants (with lights), eg Hawick RA, Threave Rovers, etc. "Theoretically possible"............... but very unlikely in my view. Edited April 30, 2019 by Robert James typo error 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert James Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 On 30/04/2019 at 14:57, LongTimeLurker said: It's too bad this has never been tested in some ways. Given the HL member clubs knocked back the plan to split that league that revolved around clubs like Banks O'Dee applying so they could have a 10-10 format, I don't think it's safe to make any assumptions on how far they would go to keep their 18 club status quo. Should Cove Rangers win the SPFL Club42 Play-off, there would be a 'vacancy' within the present HFL 18 club format. However : * if Cove win promotion, would BoD change its (reported) position that it no longer wishes to join the HFL ? * or, if BoD did apply to fill this 'vacancy' , would/could the SFA prevent the HFL from doing so, as it has confirmed in the past, that it wants to reduce the number of clubs from 18 to 16 ? * also, as the North Juniors apparently don't now wish to join the pyramid, would BoD lose its SFA Membership , if the club chooses to stay with the juniors, thereby remaining outside the pyramid ? I agree with your view, that it would not be "safe to make any assumptions" at this stage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 The Highland League doesn't have a fixed number of teams, so Cove getting promoted wouldn't create a vacancy.Any club could apply to join right now, even if Cove stay down. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fife Journeyman Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 so the presumption that "the juniors are in next year" is officially not happening. few posters been quiet recently. hopefully its all resolved for 20/21. probably the best solution until they find a proper way too address the pyramid and not rush something through 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert James Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 4 hours ago, craigkillie said: The Highland League doesn't have a fixed number of teams, so Cove getting promoted wouldn't create a vacancy. Any club could apply to join right now, even if Cove stay down. Yes I think most posters on here know that it isn't a closed shop, but unlike the Lowland & EoSL, they don't advertise/invite applications to join the HFL. The Banks O'Dee "rejection" of their application in 2009 has not been forgotten, either by Banks themselves, or by any other North junior club. Time to move on ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 Was interesting on Si Ferry's recent interview of Gordon Smith that Gordon Smith mentioned that when he first took the CEO job at the SFA he didn't really understand his role and that his powers were pretty much non-existent. Have to wonder whether something similar has happened with Ian Maxwell and that the penny has finally dropped that there is no such thing as a "board directive" when you actually take the time to read the SFA's constitution. It was too bad that Si Ferry didn't ask any pyramid related questions because Gordon Smith was deeply involved in trying to get the pyramid going at one point, but understandable enough that most people want to hear about playing for Jock Wallace, John Greig, and Alan Mullery and how he messed up the last minute must score chance for Brighton. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 Smith once came and addressed the Ayrshire Referees Association whilst he was SFA chief exec. Obviously the main bulk of his presentation was about refereeing, but then he had a brief Q&A at the end when someone asked him about the pyramid. It was clear that he was keen to get it going, but he didn't seem to have much of a clue about any of the various non-leagues involved. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclizine Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 Sorry, pedantry alert. Can we please stop calling Banks o' Dee "Banks"? They're "(The) Dee" It's like calling Ross County "Ross" rather than "County", just sounds wrong! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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