Burnie_man Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 I think there are a fair number of lowland league clubs are nervously looking over their shoulder at the EOS teams and thinking if they go down they will not reappear (look at HRA this year and the number of LL teams that have lost in the cup to EOS sides). This at least gives them a chance to stop a free fall and also give the EOS, SOS and WOS sides more promotion opportunities do a bit of a win win. I think it will kick in season after next when the WOS gets going.If the LL have an idea of how they want to work it, then they should just chuck it into PWG discussions and go for it next season rather than wait another 18 months. The LL was set-up in a little over 6 weeks.Personally I'd like to see them go all-in and set-up a LL2 West and LL2 East, invite Licenced clubs to apply as a priority then allow non Licenced clubs a season to get one. It would cut the SJFA right out of the Pyramid at tier 6, which is probably a concern to current LL clubs who don't fancy falling into an SJFA administered league.Not sure that will happen though. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 33 minutes ago, Blowin In the Wind said: I think there are a fair number of lowland league clubs are nervously looking over their shoulder at the EOS teams and thinking if they go down they will not reappear (look at HRA this year and the number of LL teams that have lost in the cup to EOS sides). This at least gives them a chance to stop a free fall and also give the EOS, SOS and WOS sides more promotion opportunities do a bit of a win win. I think it will kick in season after next when the WOS gets going. Hawick Royal Albert are a pretty big outlier. Prior to the creation of the Lowland League, the EoS had 2 divisions since 1987-88. HRA were in the EoS Premier Division for that first season, they were relegated at the end of it and never returned. They only reached the top division of the EoS again on a technicality when it became a single division once more. Everyone knew they would drop like a stone. And in fairness to them you haven't heard a peep about them folding or struggling to get a team out like some other clubs this year. The only two clubs I can think that would have concern about getting relegated is Dalbeattie and Edusport, but for different reasons. Dalbeattie would be leaving a very strong set up for essentially an amateur league, they would have concerns about stagnating in the SoS. Edusport with their grand ambitions could very easily be swallowed up and die. Everyone else is either working toward SPFL ambitions, fancy their chances competing against newcomers or have no fears about falling into the EoS as its where they came from. Lowland League 2 is probably more about improving the Lowland League sooner than later. Licencing can be imposed and fixed promotion/relegation between Tier 5 & 6 can be put in place. If the EoS. SoS and Junior leagues are placed equally at Tier 6 none of them are likely to make licencing a requirement. So you're stuck with the same drip feed that has been happening. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyramidic Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: If the LL have an idea of how they want to work it, then they should just chuck it into PWG discussions and go for it next season rather than wait another 18 months. The LL was set-up in a little over 6 weeks. Personally I'd like to see them go all-in and set-up a LL2 West and LL2 East, invite Licenced clubs to apply as a priority then allow non Licenced clubs a season to get one. It would cut the SJFA right out of the Pyramid at tier 6, which is probably a concern to current LL clubs who don't fancy falling into an SJFA administered league. Not sure that will happen though. If we follow this scenario - a one division LL2 for 2019/20. How many clubs would the EOSL be expected to lose for 2019/20 and what would be the impact for their league structure? Would it be a "kick in the teeth" for a supportive league or would the clubs moving to LL2 simply be replaced by ERJFA clubs? How many clubs would move over to LL2 from the WRJFA and what would be the impact on their new pyramid? What would a LL2 look like for 2019/20 if it was quickly implemented? Generally I think that it is a geat concept but it will have "knock-on" implications down both sides of the pyramid - east and west (if it happens). Edited January 13, 2019 by Pyramidic 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 Like everything else going on, we'll just have to wait and see what happens over the next few months.This time last year nobody could have predicted what subsequently happened. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 If they are having a general meeting as soon as next month, it looks like they are preparing the ground to move quickly on this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honestman54 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 52 minutes ago, Pyramidic said: If we follow this scenario - a one division LL2 for 2019/20. How many clubs would the EOSL be expected to lose for 2019/20 and what would be the impact for their league structure? Would it be a "kick in the teeth" for a supportive league or would the clubs moving to LL2 simply be replaced by ERJFA clubs? How many clubs would move over to LL2 from the WRJFA and what would be the impact on their new pyramid? What would a LL2 look like for 2019/20 if it was quickly implemented? Generally I think that it is a geat concept but it will have "knock-on" implications down both sides of the pyramid - east and west (if it happens). I agree re-what happens to those EOS clubs who are expecting to be in an EOS premier league at tier 6, where will they go - will they be offered places in this new LL2 at tier 6 and have other West and South clubs fill in the gaps. They need to be careful not to upset these EOS clubs who trailblazed last season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 1 hour ago, LongTimeLurker said: If they are having a general meeting as soon as next month, it looks like they are preparing the ground to move quickly on this. The other factor I suppose is that they might want this pushed through before the SJFA come on the scene as far as LL play-offs are concerned and start having a greater say in things. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 1 hour ago, LongTimeLurker said: If they are having a general meeting as soon as next month, it looks like they are preparing the ground to move quickly on this. They seem to have 4 General Meetings a year going by the rule book. Guessing the announcement of the LL2 Working Group from the end of October was from one of these and this is the Board getting the format of the Group in place for the next one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 2 hours ago, Burnie_man said: Personally I'd like to see them go all-in and set-up a LL2 West and LL2 East, invite Licenced clubs to apply as a priority then allow non Licenced clubs a season to get one. It would cut the SJFA right out of the Pyramid at tier 6, which is probably a concern to current LL clubs who don't fancy falling into an SJFA administered league. If you want an east and west division below the LL then isn't that just the same as having the EOS Premier and a newly created WOS senior league? Seems like it all comes back to having nothing in the west... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Ginaro said: If you want an east and west division below the LL then isn't that just the same as having the EOS Premier and a newly created WOS senior league? Seems like it all comes back to having nothing in the west... Effectively yes but all part of the Lowland League at tier 5 and 6, 48 clubs, all Licenced in the next few years. Helps when knocking on the door of the SPFL wanting more promotion spots. Edited January 13, 2019 by Burnie_man 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amigan Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 I think it makes sense from 2020/21 if there is a West League in place for 2019/20 in terms of a balance between sides from different areas of the country. Would teams effectively skip a division i.e. win either Eos WoS or SoS then gain promotion to the Lowland League or would these clubs be promoted to LL2? Also, with the weaker SoS at tier 6 I wonder if it would be an even splitnif teams between the three leagues, possibly four if there is an ERJFA League too. Interestingly SPFL League Three also popped up in another article recently. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 27 minutes ago, Ginaro said: If you want an east and west division below the LL then isn't that just the same as having the EOS Premier and a newly created WOS senior league? Seems like it all comes back to having nothing in the west... I don't see the EoS placing licencing as a requirement for entry to the EoS Premier. They would want to retain movement between their leagues without a barrier like that. Without the certainty of Tier 5 and Tier 6 being entirely licenced i'm not sure you would see fixed promotion between the Tiers. Whereas any league set up by the Lowland League is going to place licencing as a requirement long term. That'd be the major difference. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Burnie_man said: The other factor I suppose is that they might want this pushed through before the SJFA come on the scene as far as LL play-offs are concerned and start having a greater say in things. ...which would be an effective veto on any future restructure if all the leagues involved have to sign off on changes to pro/rel as appears to be the case at the moment. If they want to do this, they are better off moving quickly. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 1 minute ago, LongTimeLurker said: ...which would be an effective veto on any future restructure if all the leagues involved have to sign off on changes to pro/rel as appears to be the case at the moment. If they want to do this, they are better off moving quickly. Correct. Let's say a solution is found re ERJFA and everyone signs-off on Play-off changes and the Junior come on board, then the LL table that they are starting a new division(s) and want to take over tier 6, and that future play-offs are for tier 6, not 5. You might find the Juniors reps wont play ball if they see power being taken away from them in the West. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevsmart Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 (edited) On 06/01/2019 at 15:17, honestman54 said: I love these sorts of comments. Why dont you look at the Scottish Rugby Union set up and see that in Division THREE Orkney travel south to Carrick in Ayrshire and vice versa and many other clubs make these very long journeys on a lot less income The reason Orkney have to travel south to Carrick in Ayrshire is that they are in a NATIONAL league not regional. Edited January 13, 2019 by kevsmart Spellcheck 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevsmart Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 On 06/01/2019 at 19:41, Auld Heid said: Do Orkney not pay towards opponents travel? Travel is a major issue to many teams - they often want the status but not always the associated travel. SRU help with costs for clubs that have to go to Orkney 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, Burnie_man said: Effectively yes but all part of the Lowland League at tier 5 and 6, 48 clubs, all Licenced in the next few years. Helps when knocking on the door of the SPFL wanting more promotion spots. Going by the rumours most unlicensed clubs who will be in the EOS Premier next season have applied or are working towards their licence anyway, given they need one to be promoted. Apart from being under LL control, presumably the only difference between a LL2 East and EOS Premier is you would be kicked out of LL2 if you weren't licensed in a few years? But then again, they haven't done that to clubs without floodlights in the LL... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnie_man Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, Ginaro said: Going by the rumours most unlicensed clubs who will be in the EOS Premier next season have applied or are working towards their licence anyway, given they need one to be promoted. Apart from being under LL control, presumably the only difference between a LL2 East and EOS Premier is you would be kicked out of LL2 if you weren't licensed in a few years? But then again, they haven't done that to clubs without floodlights in the LL... It's all guesswork at the moment as to what will happen or what the LL plan is. I think the main reasoning has to be a touch of self-preservation for existing members allied to a bit of empire building to provide more clout when it comes to SPFL access, with an added benefit of keeping the SJFA at arms length. Worst case scenario for the EoS is that they lose 16 members, but it still leaves them with 23, with perhaps a few more newbies next season. The EoS encourage members to get Licenced, and I guess that will continue without it being compulsory anytime soon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GNU_Linux Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 my own preference is a 16 team LL2 all in formed with an 8/8 of east & west clubs (counting SOS as west here) as be a good step in fixing the LL being east heavy (ofc this is because no west clubs got on board). See no reason for east/west LL as the EOS/SOS already exist & possibly the west juniors or a WOSL could be in for next season. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auld Heid Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 9 hours ago, Ginaro said: Going by the rumours most unlicensed clubs who will be in the EOS Premier next season have applied or are working towards their licence anyway, given they need one to be promoted. Apart from being under LL control, presumably the only difference between a LL2 East and EOS Premier is you would be kicked out of LL2 if you weren't licensed in a few years? But then again, they haven't done that to clubs without floodlights in the LL... Rules definately need tightened, there should not be situations where teams can participate but not progress - that defeats the whole concept of a pyramid. It's becoming clear that not every team is in that position and that's shouldn't be acceptable going forwards. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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