Israel v Scotland

[1320Lichtie]

Players have been getting slagged rotten for this but I feel sorry for them here to be honest, don't think there's a poor player in that team last night (except McDonald), some really good/promising ones actually, they just looked like they did not have a clue as to what they were supposed to be doing or how Israel would play.

It was the worst performance I can remember for a long time. Even the Georgia games, they weren't pummellings, Israel dominated that game and had 23 attempts on goal. Bar and post both hit, some good saves from our keeper.

We managed two shots on target, a soft penalty and a shot that was saved comfortably.

McLeish had to hit the ground running, before his appointment he was everything the fans did not want he was the lazy stereotypical appointment the fans are used too from the SFA. One good 45 minutes against Albania and a sneaked win in Hungary. 5 defeats. Pish.

I'd be tempted to mix it up and change the formation next game. Yes you don't get the attacking qualities of Tierney down the right hand side when he is right full back but he's still sound defensively. Would trust him more than SOD tbh.

McGregor

Tierney
Souttar
McKenna
Robertson

McGinn
Armstrong

Forrest
Fraser
McGregor

Griffiths

Is the next best shout for me. Was confident in the formation before last night in fairness but that was absolutely bogging.

[sjc]

Let's face it, we've got the National team we deserve. How long have we let the idiots in charge of our game and Club sides mismanage its governance?

Whether this is through ineptitude or downright corruption, from grassroots levels, coaching and all the way up to the running of our professional leagues it's shambolic and none of us as fans have used our collective power to hold any of them accountable.

[forameus]

18 minutes ago, 10menwent2mow said:

Why are the SFA continually arranging friendlies that we have zero chance of winning

[SpoonTon]

9 minutes ago, well fan for life said:

Tbf that France team is outrageous.

That's what everyone thought going into the World Cup a couple of months later, but it didn't quite work out for them!

16 minutes ago, RobbieD said:

When did we look that bad and unorganised under Berti Vogts?

 

The away draw in the Faroe Islands. That was a particular low point. It wasn't a terrible lineup all round either, with Lambert, Weir, Ferguson, and Dailly all starting. But it was a mess of a lineup, and to this day I'm not sure what we were meant to be playing. 

The 6-0 defeat in Holland was a lesson in disorganisation from our point of view. All the more puzzling considering it came just after Vogts seemed to have finally been getting somewhere. It was clear that he never really understood the players he had available to him though. The home defeat against Norway and away draw against Moldova that finished him were also a similar mess. 

Last night had that feel to it. The same goes for most of the Burley and Levein Scotland teams as well. They all tried to give themselves time at the start by talking up the rebuilding job but it never actually gets better. 

[Granny Danger]

Scotland fans all over the country will be raging, just as they are on here, and probably nothing will change.

 

[sjc]

3 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Scotland fans all over the country will be raging, just as they are on here, and probably nothing will change.

 

Not as long as they keep buying tickets and merchandise, they won't....

[TheScarf]

18 minutes ago, 1320Lichtie said:

Players have been getting slagged rotten for this but I feel sorry for them here to be honest, don't think there's a poor player in that team last night (except McDonald), some really good/promising ones actually, they just looked like they did not have a clue as to what they were supposed to be doing or how Israel would play.

It was the worst performance I can remember for a long time. Even the Georgia games, they weren't pummellings, Israel dominated that game and had 23 attempts on goal. Bar and post both hit, some good saves from our keeper.

We managed two shots on target, a soft penalty and a shot that was saved comfortably.

McLeish had to hit the ground running, before his appointment he was everything the fans did not want he was the lazy stereotypical appointment the fans are used too from the SFA. One good 45 minutes against Albania and a sneaked win in Hungary. 5 defeats. Pish.

I'd be tempted to mix it up and change the formation next game. Yes you don't get the attacking qualities of Tierney down the right hand side when he is right full back but he's still sound defensively. Would trust him more than SOD tbh.

McGregor

Tierney
Souttar
McKenna
Robertson

McGinn
Armstrong

Forrest
Fraser
McGregor

Griffiths

Is the next best shout for me. Was confident in the formation before last night in fairness but that was absolutely bogging.

It's totally the manager/coaching team's fault.  Scotland have far better players than last night's result suggests.  They don't know what the fuck formation they're supposed to be playing.  Or what they're individual role in said formation is.

[Distant Doonhamer]

35 minutes ago, sjc said:

Is it true that the Palestinians turned up  last night waving Scotland flags demanding an end to the Israeli occupation of the Scottish penalty area?

 That sir is fecking tremendous. Top notch 

[sjc]

19 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

It's totally the manager/coaching team's fault.  Scotland have far better players than last night's result suggests.  They don't know what the f**k formation they're supposed to be playing.  Or what they're individual role in said formation is.

Whilst this is true, it does paper over the cracks of the fundimental issues within our game from top to bottom.

[well fan for life]

3 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

It's totally the manager/coaching team's fault.  Scotland have far better players than last night's result suggests.  They don't know what the f**k formation they're supposed to be playing.  Or what they're individual role in said formation is.

Aye. Somehow that team last night was massively worse than the sum of its parts. There's nothing really wrong with playing a 3-5-2 but if it's badly coached and implemented it's tragic. In possession we looked devoid of any ideas going forward, and out of possession we looked like nobody had any idea where they were supposed to be filling in.

[The_Judge]

1 minute ago, well fan for life said:

Aye. Somehow that team last night was massively worse than the sum of its parts. There's nothing really wrong with playing a 3-5-2 but if it's badly coached and implemented it's tragic. In possession we looked devoid of any ideas going forward, and out of possession we looked like nobody had any idea where they were supposed to be filling in.

I feel you're letting the players off too lightly.  If any of these guys 'are' top players then I expect them to do better (against that calibre of opposition) than last night (even if you were the coach).

[sjc]

4 minutes ago, Distant Doonhamer said:

 That sir is fecking tremendous. Top notch 

They've even put their protest on the wall!

[blue manalishi]

Scotland done well............

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

to keep it down to 2-1..

[charger29]

2 hours ago, LondonHMFC said:

I touched on this last night when people were complaining that he doesn't take a man on. At Liverpool he has the likes of Mane tucking inside to give him the freedom to get up the wing, he also knows if he loses the ball he has the quality behind him to clear up. If he loses the ball for Scotland, we have the prospect of Souttar clogging an attacking winger.

I've watched most Liverpool games from the start of last year. It's quite rare for him to take a man on there too. Most of the time he turns back and passes inside to Van Dijk. He tends to get in good positions by making a run and getting the ball played to him, rather than doing everything himself. He's impressed most as a defender at Liverpool imo. He should start at LB and cut off the opposition's right flank and give up an option outside Fraser when attacking.

1 hour ago, 10menwent2mow said:

Why are the SFA continually arranging friendlies that we have zero chance of winning. Since 2016 we've played Italy (n), France (a), Canada (h), Holland (h), Costa Rica (h), Hungary (a), Mexico (a), peru (a), Belgium (h) and Portugal (h)

Realistically we are going to get scudded in most of those fixtures. Arrange more friendlies against pish, yes its not going to sell tickets but it's an opportunity to take the team around the country, get some confidence in the players and improve the world ranking. You get more points for beating shite than getting scudded by the best teams.

From what I've read the new ranking system is atrocious. Unless something changes with it soon, we'll get to the point where rankings barely change as the points gained from winning games isn't high enough. There'll be no more jumping from #86 to #14 in three years (not without reaching a finals tournament or two anyway).

[10menwent2mow]

You also suggested that by going around the country (playing against pish) we'd gain more confidence and improve the world ranking.  Can't see how that 1-1 draw with Canada in front of 9,000 at Easter Road achieved either?

Play it at paisley. Or mcdiarmid then. f**k. Did we draw that game. I thought we won. Still you get more ranking points for a draw against Canada than for a spanking off Belgium.

[the snudge]

We're approaching Gibraltar levels of fitba. How depressing is that? 

[The_Judge]

1 minute ago, the snudge said:

We're approaching Gibraltar levels of fitba. How depressing is that? 

Doesn't depress me our club game is booming.

[10menwent2mow]

From what I've read the new ranking system is atrocious. Unless something changes with it soon, we'll get to the point where rankings barely change as the points gained from winning games isn't high enough. There'll be no more jumping from #86 to #14 in three years (not without reaching a finals tournament or two anyway).

I didn't even realise there was a new rankings system. Shows how much attention I pay to internationals.

[ekfootball]

Absolutely embarrassing last night. When McLeish was announce I was extremely disappointed but I decided to get behind him as he seemed to be picking more proper Scottish players as opposed to a lot of English championship players who weren't really interested.

However he has literally picked one of the worst in Kevin McDonald yet overlooked so many others. I could name around 15 central midfielders who would play ahead of him IMO. He is one paced and isn't even  good on the ball. He was hooked at HT in the Albania game for being rank yet starts again this game. He has fallen out the Fulham side and they are a team who have conceded a lot of goals with him in the team.

Stephen O'Donnell was decent at home vs Albania but I think adrenaline and being at home when Albania in all honesty played poorly helped his cause. I think he got over hyped due to the shock factor that a guy from Kilmarnock came in and done a job. He has been played in a position he is not used to and was left heavily exposed by Souttar who refused to come out and cover him after he had bombed forward.  Souttar continually stayed narrow when not marking anybody and that killed us the whole game. 

Naismith is another one who just isn't of the level we should be continuing with to try and progress. Ok he done fine against Albania and got his goal but he also missed a sitter and is at a stage in his career when he is on the path to being finished.  I understand Griffiths is as much to blame as McLeish in that scenario but he is our only decent striker when fit and we shouldn't be going down the bath of Levein falling out with Fletcher when he was at his peak or Boyd etc. We don't have the luxury of leaving players of his quality out the squad.

Forrest should of started absolutely, now I know he has failed to perform for Scotland on a number of occasions but he was on the back of scoring 4 goals and in an away match we need ball carriers to get us up the pitch.

The formation is purely set up to get KT and Robbo in the same team without KT having to play right back. KT struggles in a back 3 and Robbo struggles when he is the only player on the left wing. Why not play one LB and the other LM, they are both more effective when they can play 1-2s and put crosses in the box. Ok that still means one of them is out of position but that is going to be the case no matter what we do  unless one drops to the bench. We seen KT get forward more against Albania and when they worked together that is where the first goal came from.

Jonny Russell is another one who looks decent in short spells but for me isn't the answer to start international matches. I would keep him in the squad and use him more as an impact sub.

John McGinn will be fine long term but you have to accept that he will put us in trouble from time to time. His energy was no existent last night and on that performance is no better than a Shinnie or Jack.  But I still feel with a better player around him he will be fine long term.

All in all too many players got found out last night big time after the hype of the Albania game. What I learned is that O'Donnell, McDonald, & Souttar are no more than cover for this team. Souttar is worse than Jack Hendry and I am basing this on the times I've seen them for Scotland. McKenna is miles ahead of anything else we have at CH and he needs to play. Armstrong has to play as we have no midfielder capable of breaking lines from the midfield unless he plays.

Rant over, see you fuckers in Albania

[Big Fifer]

Quite a few times last night the camera panned to the coaching staff and McFadden and Grant were talking to each other over McLeish. He was just kinda sitting there. Reminded me of when we take my dementia suffering Grandad out these days, nods along, doesn't really know where he is or why. Fucking terrifying.