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Berwick Rangers 2018/2019 Thread


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1 hour ago, Disc Potato said:

There was a very interesting thread on twitter last night that has now been deleted.

Craig Hume (Surprise, Surprise) supported his brother-in-law and manager and thanked him for taking him from the bottom of the juniors to the SPFL.

Some very interesting replies that called him out for being a “grass” and players leaving because of him. 

We could stand for that if he was any good but he is awful and some of the reason we are in this mess as too many have made the move from the bottom of the juniors into one SPFL team.

 

Not sure he's signed anyone directly from the 'bottom of the Juniors'...? He had Hume (who had already played SPFL with the Shire) at Edinburgh United in 13-14 (won promotion) and Haddington (won promotion from same division) but had had him at Penicuik (top end of top division) the past few years. Penicuik left the Juniors anyway in the summer and are now EoS, as are Hill of Beath who Adamson came from. There were a few summer arrivals from Musselburgh but they had just won the middle East division at a canter at the first time of asking (and the players you signed had played with them a few years).

Edited by cmontheloknow
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11 hours ago, HibeeJibee said:

...Upon seeing the iceberg Titanic would've been better hitting it head on not swerving too late and broadsiding it. Imponderables.

Not sure where you are going with that given avoiding the iceberg outright is the best outcome and that can still happen over two legs in the playoff as well as the Albion Rovers game.

Not my club and hope a new club gets in for a bit of variety, but as things stand the only thing Berwick can do to freshen things up is make a managerial change and the last thing you want is a group of disgruntled players who suspect they are about to be handed a free transfer playing to save your league status.

A new manager to impress and a large bonus for avoiding relegation are the way to go but that costs money...

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7 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

Not sure he's signed anyone directly from the 'bottom of the Juniors'...? He had Hume (who had already played SPFL with the Shire) at Edinburgh United in 13-14 (won promotion) and Haddington (won promotion from same division) but had had him at Penicuik (top end of top division) the past few years. Penicuik left the Juniors anyway in the summer and are now EoS, as are Hill of Beath who Adamson came from. There were a few summer arrivals from Musselburgh but they had just won the middle East division at a canter at the first time of asking (and the players you signed had played with them a few years).

Genuine question as I don’t know much about junior football, I know most teams are now EOS, but wasn’t the standard in the bottom junior league horrific and most teams would struggle to cope in say Edinburgh’s top amateur league? So away from the fact he got 2 teams promoted from that division (heard he had big budgets to spend when most teams in the division weren’t even paying they’re players) what has he actually done previously? Won a cup with Penicuik? Again this a genuine question? And I’m not asking as a reflection of the outcome of his tenure now more so in his arrogance on a camera to say he has earned the right to be here. 

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It’s clear the club are not going to take any action. So the best way I can see this playing out is for 2 defeats for us and AR next week and then the crunch match Albion still 2 points ahead of us, step up ousy see after a horrific injury and such a long time out what a fitting way and great story that would be if he could snatch us a winner and 1 point clear going into the last game where again I would be happy to see us both get pumped! 

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1 minute ago, Fergie1 said:

Genuine question as I don’t know much about junior football, I know most teams are now EOS, but wasn’t the standard in the bottom junior league horrific and most teams would struggle to cope in say Edinburgh’s top amateur league? So away from the fact he got 2 teams promoted from that division (heard he had big budgets to spend when most teams in the division weren’t even paying they’re players) what has he actually done previously? Won a cup with Penicuik? Again this a genuine question? And I’m not asking as a reflection of the outcome of his tenure now more so in his arrogance on a camera to say he has earned the right to be here. 

Aye, it would be fair to say the standard was poor in the leagues he got teams out of. You'd need to get a fan of Haddington or Edinburgh Utd to comment on budget differences. I guess he'll argue he has built winning teams and yeah winning the DJ Laing East of Scotland Cup with Penicuik last season will be an achievement he'd be proud of. 2 league titles (and a good consolidation season in the middle division with Haddington after promotion) as well as the cup isn't a bad haul for 6 years of management by age of 35. His Penicuik side had won every league game when he left them in October.

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10 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

Aye, it would be fair to say the standard was poor in the leagues he got teams out of. You'd need to get a fan of Haddington or Edinburgh Utd to comment on budget differences. I guess he'll argue he has built winning teams and yeah winning the DJ Laing East of Scotland Cup with Penicuik last season will be an achievement he'd be proud of. 2 league titles (and a good consolidation season in the middle division with Haddington after promotion) as well as the cup isn't a bad haul for 6 years of management by age of 35. His Penicuik side had won every league game when he left them in October.

Nothing too really shout home about though? So he didn’t get Haddington promoted into the top junior division? I know more about EOS football and see that but they got the easy league this year and I would imagine he had probably the biggest budget in that league, any player that signs Wayne Macintosh at that level of football isn’t shy of a bob or 2. Not sure why he didn’t st him into Berwick a proven track record of scoring double figures every season 

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1 minute ago, Fergie1 said:

Nothing too really shout home about though? So he didn’t get Haddington promoted into the top junior division? I know more about EOS football and see that but they got the easy league this year and I would imagine he had probably the biggest budget in that league, any player that signs Wayne Macintosh at that level of football isn’t shy of a bob or 2. Not sure why he didn’t st him into Berwick a proven track record of scoring double figures every season 

Yeah both Edinburgh Utd and Haddington were promoted into the middle division.

The issue any manager who comes into a club mid season is getting decent quality that is not under contract (or finding a club happy to let these players go). With the 'Penicuik 3' I think I am right in saying they all reinstated themselves amateur in order to join Berwick outwith the transfer window - not everyone would be prepared to do that.

Not saying JH is the right guy for Berwick, just that he's got a reasonable point in that the players he has brought in during the season might not have been the ones he'd have signed had he been manager back in July.

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3 minutes ago, cmontheloknow said:

Yeah both Edinburgh Utd and Haddington were promoted into the middle division.

The issue any manager who comes into a club mid season is getting decent quality that is not under contract (or finding a club happy to let these players go). With the 'Penicuik 3' I think I am right in saying they all reinstated themselves amateur in order to join Berwick outwith the transfer window - not everyone would be prepared to do that.

Not saying JH is the right guy for Berwick, just that he's got a reasonable point in that the players he has brought in during the season might not have been the ones he'd have signed had he been manager back in July.

I have no issues with promoting from the lower leagues atall, everyone starts somewhere, I just don’t understand his arrogance when really he doesn’t have any track record. Touching on the fact he  couldn’t bring in the players he wanted because only limited available etc. He knew that before he arrived at the club and pretty much every player he’s released has went onto find a league club in a better position than Berwick? With the exception of murrell. 

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Just now, Fergie1 said:

I have no issues with promoting from the lower leagues atall, everyone starts somewhere, I just don’t understand his arrogance when really he doesn’t have any track record. Touching on the fact he  couldn’t bring in the players he wanted because only limited available etc. He knew that before he arrived at the club and pretty much every player he’s released has went onto find a league club in a better position than Berwick? With the exception of murrell. 

He'd call it building his own team but young managers will make mistakes. Experienced managers are those that learn from them!

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Being successful at a lower level is all well and good - better than being unsuccessful at a lower level.

When he was appointed I saw an enthusiastic young man who had won things lower down and - in the absence of a rush of more experienced applications - I was happy enough with his appointment. 

But right now, it comes down to his team and his selections. Where was Brydon? (does anyone know?) Instead we get yet another penalty given against serial offender Bob Wilson - he gives penalties away because he isn't quick enough in feet or thought. 

And who would have picked Rose, or kept him on? He is offside all the time because he is playing way above his level of competence. 

And with Brown as sub, who would have picked Hume? He gets waltzed around in the box because he just isn't good enough. 

Hope I'm wrong but I don't see how this team under Johnny Harvey can pick up another point this season. I hoped I'd be wrong yesterday, but once again we didn't even come close. And it's the not even coming close that really dejects the fans. 

 

 

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On 09/03/2019 at 20:16, Muzza81 said:

That’s not true at all, there is no precedent for cup games I don’t believe. League games are totally different anyway - what if the player in question scored all 3 goals in a 3-0 win? 

SoS League cannot award a team points and that seems just. It is only right you can be deducted points but you should not get points you have not earned.

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The reaction to that interview has been extremely reasoned. Like Redcar, I've just watched it through a second time this morning. For me, I'm torn between empathy and whether this is a genuine meltdown and it's all on top of him , or whether he's outed himself as a bit of a p***k, and that those weird accounts that seem to pop up on here and Twitter are justified in what they've been telling us. 

The interview itself starts off okay, before quickly descending into oddball territory when he starts talking about how he can't defend crosses. Maybe this is finally the explanation as to why he played a coach at centre half in Stirling. Johnny then says his usual - 'the less said about the game, the better'.

He then goes on to throw the players under the bus. When doing something like that I think you have to be extremely clever about how you go about it. Here, I think Harvey makes a total mess of it. There's not a chance he can retain the belief of that changing room following that. If he's staying, the only chance we really have now is if they self-manage and form a team spirit that actually works against him, and we lack the leaders to do that. It's time for him to go. 

The interview continues to descend. After a reminder that he can't defend crosses, he becomes a victim. It's not his fault, it's the players, and more than the players, it's the fans. He quickly establishes that he's essentially going to hold the club to ransom (and does this again towards the end of the interview), and then brings Horn into it which is arguably the most incredulous part. 

We're 5 games from the Lowland league, supporting a team that have 1 win in 21 with a manager who chops and changes seemingly at random, and he can't believe there's negativity. His face as he goes on another tirade about crosses is genuinely concerning - it's here where I empathise most cause it looks as though this is too much for him and he needs to walk for his own good. 

Next up is the discussed 'back me or sack me'. There's an odd threat within it about finding someone who'll work harder (perhaps we need someone working smarter). But moving it away from JH for a moment, this comes back to the board. Last week we didn't hear a peep. Yesterday is the most absolutely evident warning sign yet - with their recent form, Albion have shown they can pick up points and it is not entirely inconceivable that by the time we have our game against them, they'll be five or three plus GD clear. Whichever route they decide on, they have to act fast. Yet here we are again and I guess the silence will continue.

To go back to the dichotomy in my first paragraph, my feeling is that it was more meltdown than p***k, but the answer is irrelevant, because whatever the answer, it shows he isn't fit for the role. 

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You've got 3 league games left and 1 win might be enough to finish 9th.  Give your team your 100% support and, who knows, maybe it will lift the players just enough.  They've not earned your gratitude with their performances this season but it must be hard to play without fear with so much negativity in the air?

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10 minutes ago, The_Judge said:

You've got 3 league games left and 1 win might be enough to finish 9th.  Give your team your 100% support and, who knows, maybe it will lift the players just enough.  They've not earned your gratitude with their performances this season but it must be hard to play without fear with so much negativity in the air?

Since the start of December I've seen 2 draws and the following defeats as I've stood in the Ducket on Saturday afternoons, all supportive and hopeful at 3pm. 

0-5,  0-3,  1-2,  0-3,  1-2,  0-2,  0-3.

Interspersed I was relieved to miss the 0-4 and 0-6 defeats at Annan, and the 1-7 at QP. 

Please will people stop telling me not to be negative as it may adversely affect the team. Perhaps the team could sort itself out so as not to adversely affect the fans. 

 

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Struggle to grasp how people and Jonny think any sort of ‘abuse’ toward him is undue. For starters it’s hardly abuse, it’s common football shouts that will be heard across any ground in Britain when there team is getting pumped week in week out. The man is paid to do the job, not that that itself should allow anybody to be ‘abused’, but a huge percentage of the clubs funds to pay this mans wages comes from guess who... the fans. Now for him to come out and target us the way he did get is extremely poor, and shows he has cracked. I’m sure if he had approached it explaining he understands the fans frustrations and he understands the heckles from the terrace but if everyone could just stick together for these next three weeks we will get out of it. With regards to him working hard, I’ve already said on here I have no doubt about the work rate and effort JH puts into  the role, but there are about 24 other part time managers in the SPFL who are all doing the same thing mate, and dozens sitting without a jobs willing to work just as hard,  yet I’ve yet to see another interview where a manger stresses how much work he is putting in. And unfortunately in case he wasn’t aware it’s about results on the field not about how hard he works. 

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Whilst I appreciate that your manager isn't doing the business and you will all be very frustrated, shouting abuse at the guy has been scientifically proved to be 100% unsuccessful in improving his, or the team's, performance.

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