New Hampden

[Gordopolis]

So we're staying at Hampden.

Now, what can we hope for in terms of renovations?

Post your ideas for stadium models, potential financing sources and anything else related here.

 

So far I've heard two attractive proposals:

 

The 'Stuttgart model' (transforming a bowl into a square)

 

 

 

The 'BC Place model' (two tiers with elegant top tier veiling off mechanism)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Barry Ferguson's Hat]

It would be a nice touch if the seats in the Rangers and Celtic ends matched their respective colours. 

[Diamonds are Forever]

Don't really get the fuss about the Stuttgart model, doesn't really 'do it' for me. I get it's just because it's a comparable situation, but it still seems far too shallow behind the goals so if you're at the back behind the goals you're still miles away, and the pitch is still pretty far away from the pitch at the sides too. Obviously it's far better than it was and you're limited with what you can without knocking the whole thing down and starting again, but if we're going to spend the money on it I'd be wanting something more than that. Not convinced it's worth the money if that's the difference it's going to make.

 

[Gordopolis]

Don't really get the fuss about the Stuttgart model, doesn't really 'do it' for me. I get it's just because it's a comparable situation, but it still seems far too shallow behind the goals so if you're at the back behind the goals you're still miles away, and the pitch is still pretty far away from the pitch at the sides too. Obviously it's far better than it was and you're limited with what you can without knocking the whole thing down and starting again, but if we're going to spend the money on it I'd be wanting something more than that. Not convinced it's worth the money if that's the difference it's going to make.
 

Fair point: ideally you'd want the stands looming over the pitch like at Tynecastle or Parkhead.
Fair to assume that whatever they do it won't be perfect

[Enigma]

Nothing of note will happen for years unless there’s a successful 2030 World Cup bid.

[Bishop Briggs]

53 minutes ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

Don't really get the fuss about the Stuttgart model, doesn't really 'do it' for me. I get it's just because it's a comparable situation, but it still seems far too shallow behind the goals so if you're at the back behind the goals you're still miles away, and the pitch is still pretty far away from the pitch at the sides too. Obviously it's far better than it was and you're limited with what you can without knocking the whole thing down and starting again, but if we're going to spend the money on it I'd be wanting something more than that. Not convinced it's worth the money if that's the difference it's going to make.

 

???? 

[GordonS]

2 hours ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

Don't really get the fuss about the Stuttgart model, doesn't really 'do it' for me. I get it's just because it's a comparable situation, but it still seems far too shallow behind the goals so if you're at the back behind the goals you're still miles away, and the pitch is still pretty far away from the pitch at the sides too. Obviously it's far better than it was and you're limited with what you can without knocking the whole thing down and starting again, but if we're going to spend the money on it I'd be wanting something more than that. Not convinced it's worth the money if that's the difference it's going to make.

 

I get what you're saying, but the angle of the stand makes no difference to the distance from the pitch; 20 rows is 20 rows, whether it's 20 degrees or 35 degrees. The problem is the sightline.

Anyway, the discussion is moot - there's no way there's going to be money to rebuild the least valuable parts of the ground, with the lowest ticket prices and least interest in hospitality.

[RandomGuy.]

10 hours ago, GordonS said:

I get what you're saying, but the angle of the stand makes no difference to the distance from the pitch; 20 rows is 20 rows, whether it's 20 degrees or 35 degrees. 

I don't think that's right tbh. 

[GordonS]

37 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

I don't think that's right tbh. 

It is.

The horizontal distance from the pitch is determined by how much legroom you have - the distance between each row of seating. If you increase the height of each step it doesn't change the distance between each row. Remember, you're not on a slope, you're on horizontal steps. If there is a metre between each row of seats (generous I know but just for the sake of argument) then row 20 would be 20 metres back from the front, whether its angled at 20 degrees or 35 degrees.

Technically, your distance from the pitch is greater if the stand is steeper, because you're getting higher above it too - a bit of Pythagoras shows you that. But it's a better view (up to a point) because you get a better sense of where everyone is on the pitch.

[bendan]

16 hours ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

Don't really get the fuss about the Stuttgart model, doesn't really 'do it' for me. I get it's just because it's a comparable situation, but it still seems far too shallow behind the goals so if you're at the back behind the goals you're still miles away, and the pitch is still pretty far away from the pitch at the sides too. Obviously it's far better than it was and you're limited with what you can without knocking the whole thing down and starting again, but if we're going to spend the money on it I'd be wanting something more than that. Not convinced it's worth the money if that's the difference it's going to make.

 

Totally agree. Sounds like that typical reaction of rushing to judgement without any thought at all. Stuttgart is better than before but not a great stadium. We need to totally rebuild three sides. If we don't put any fancy facilities underneath the three sides, the cost shouldn't be more than about £1500 per seat. It could be designed so that extra hospitality or accommodation could be added underneath later.

[eez-eh]

15 hours ago, Enigma said:

Nothing of note will happen for years unless there’s a successful 2030 World Cup bid.

This is probably a good point that hasn’t been mentioned before. If we actually want serious redevelopment in the next decade we’ll probably have to hope England ask for us to join their 2030 bid.

[realmadrid]

I think the SFA may be pinning their hopes on getting funding via the 2030 world cup bid, at a guess we would get a maximum of 2 stadia in Scotland in the bid and the other may not need much spent on it (probably Murrayfield)

I guess the rebuild could be done in 2 stages

Stage 1, move the pitch closer to the South stand, bring in the East and West stands to two ,two tiered stands behind each goal , thus giving the option of closing some areas for smaller cup semi finals.

Stage 2 , then bring in the North stand by around 15m and create a large single tier safe standing stand with TV facilities moved to that side, so again in cup semi finals and finals the split of fans would always look 50/50 and the top tier would not show in the South stand for smaller attendances.  I am not sure if they could create some money making facilities under the new North stand or if the houses behind it are too close for that to happen.

 

[AyrTroopMajor]

17 hours ago, Diamonds are Forever said:

Don't really get the fuss about the Stuttgart model, doesn't really 'do it' for me. I get it's just because it's a comparable situation, but it still seems far too shallow behind the goals so if you're at the back behind the goals you're still miles away, and the pitch is still pretty far away from the pitch at the sides too. Obviously it's far better than it was and you're limited with what you can without knocking the whole thing down and starting again, but if we're going to spend the money on it I'd be wanting something more than that. Not convinced it's worth the money if that's the difference it's going to make.

 

I'd previously have agreed, but having travelled to see Stuttgart v Hertha BSC in January, I can assure you the view is great and the atmosphere was absolutely magic. Definitely helped by the Ultras Section behind the goal and the fact it is terraced, but imo if we could replicate that at Hampden, we'd be doing very well.

[forameus]

13 minutes ago, AyrTroopMajor said:

I'd previously have agreed, but having travelled to see Stuttgart v Hertha BSC in January, I can assure you the view is great and the atmosphere was absolutely magic. Definitely helped by the Ultras Section behind the goal and the fact it is terraced, but imo if we could replicate that at Hampden, we'd be doing very well.

To be fair though, it'll take a lot more than just building a stadium to match it to improve atmosphere.  I'd imagine if you put a traditional German game in Hampden and packed it out, you'd get a far better atmosphere than you'd see at a Scotland game.  

Most games, even in a tremendous stadium, would be an average atmosphere for us.

[The new Kia Ceed]

Is there any reason why we cannot build a new stadium at one of the many areas lying vacant in Glasgow?     

Hampden could easily be sold for housing.  

[velo army]

5 minutes ago, The new Kia Ceed said:

Is there any reason why we cannot build a new stadium at one of the many areas lying vacant in Glasgow?     

Hampden could easily be sold for housing.  

I’m fairly sure the whole thing is only worth about £5m or £6m to a developer, so the sfa  would sell it for no profit. They’d then have to start from scratch with no funding. 

Also think this argument has been covered comprehensively in the other thread.

[AyrTroopMajor]

1 hour ago, forameus said:

To be fair though, it'll take a lot more than just building a stadium to match it to improve atmosphere.  I'd imagine if you put a traditional German game in Hampden and packed it out, you'd get a far better atmosphere than you'd see at a Scotland game.  

Most games, even in a tremendous stadium, would be an average atmosphere for us.

True enough, I think we have a potentially great atmosphere though, it's just a shame our songbook is absolutely rank. 

[Bishop Briggs]

44 minutes ago, velo army said:

I’m fairly sure the whole thing is only worth about £5m or £6m to a developer, so the sfa  would sell it for no profit. They’d then have to start from scratch with no funding. 

Also think this argument has been covered comprehensively in the other thread.

Spot on. The price that the SFA paid Queens Park for Hampden reflects its development value. IIRC Sevco bought Ibrox from the administrators for a similar sum. The big issue is funding the necessary modernisation, e.g. debentures, selling hospitality boxes, the Scottish Government or the National Lottery.  

[DAFC.]

It should be totally rebuilt with a brand new model. Use Celtic Park and Ibrox during the process and Easter Road/Tynecastle for the smaller games. 

I'll start financing it. £395 and a lighter: a Colibri, refillable. 

[GordonS]

Can I just ask, do folk here really want public money spent on this? After a decade of austerity we can't even adequately fund rape crisis centres, we're closing libraries and youth music services and withdrawing classroom assistants and all sorts of stuff. Our public sector has shrunk by about one-eighth in a decade. I don't know about anyone else but I'd be really angry if public money were used just to improve the sightlines at a football stadium. We pay for this ourselves or we say it's not that important.