froggie Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, griffiti on the wall said: Or maybe the game itself will die when punters stop going due to officials killing the game Least you will always be there to hold his whistle Obvious 'hold his whistle' means something else where you're from, so I 'll leave it to you to hold it and blow it for him, as coherent debate might be a giant leap too far for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffiti on the wall Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 Obvious 'hold his whistle' means something else where you're from, so I 'll leave it to you to hold it and blow it for him, as coherent debate might be a giant leap too far for you.Oh dear that took an unpleasant and unnecessary turn I guess your not as smug as you would like to portray Night night ya creep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froggie Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 9 minutes ago, griffiti on the wall said: Oh dear that took an unpleasant and unnecessary turn I guess your not as smug as you would like to portray Night night ya creep As I was saying... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
not man of the match Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 £37.50 p/h.....really? My mate says a Junior ref is on around £55? Arrive an hour before the game, do the game, go home and do the admin - thats when the job is done so I think you’re way off.As he once put it to me, a player will make more match changing mistakes than a referee ever will but refs are like goalkeepers, nobody forgets their mistakes. Wouldn’t be me but now I know a couple of lads that do it and the commitment that’s involved, I’d say they are undervalued and underpaid at this level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweep Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 12 hours ago, Kennie said: As a neutral official of the Region's Management committee, I have been going to random games, where I have no allegiances to either team. Standing between 2 sets of supporters can sometimes be a revelation. In instances where it is a 'tight call' he has either got it wrong and is an effin idiot (or worse) or he's 100% bang on and it's "Well done ref, good decision." 99% of the time, he's actually got it right. I've been at games and wondered if I'm watching the same game as the supporters. Both sets just seem to be wearing glasses tinted in their own colours. You were perfectly placed on Saturday at the game you attended to call right or wrong .Was the penalty a penalty? Was the last goal offside? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froggie Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 Just now, not man of the match said: £37.50 p/h.....really? My mate says a Junior ref is on around £55? Arrive an hour before the game, do the game, go home and do the admin - thats when the job is done so I think you’re way off. As he once put it to me, a player will make more match changing mistakes than a referee ever will but refs are like goalkeepers, nobody forgets their mistakes. Wouldn’t be me but now I know a couple of lads that do it and the commitment that’s involved, I’d say they are undervalued and underpaid at this level. They deserve every penny they get, in my opinion. That doesn't mean some appear better than others to the untrained eye, but tell me when that isn't true in life. What appears beyond some is that without referees there is nothing to watch. Nobody likes mistakes, but if they are honest mistakes, so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 2 hours ago, griffiti on the wall said: 3 hours ago, froggie said: I'm certain I didn't suggest every fan knows nothing about the game, which is why, if I had said it, it would indeed be nonsense, but I didn't. It is like me suggesting all spectators at football are fair minded, objective observers, who only call out bad decisions be they for or against their team. That is just as nonsensical, which why I'm not suggesting that either. Referees are not and should not be above criticism, but there is an irony in that many of the loudest moaners about referees have a limited understanding of the laws of the game amidst their outrage. Good rate of pay? if you say so, £37.50 p/h considering the living wage is around the £7 40 mark I would say so The living wage is £8.75. For a referee in the East Superleague it's £55, or £50 for the North/South Divisions. If they're at the ground for 3 hours, plus let's say 1:30 return travel time, that's £12.22 or £11.11 per hour. Do you think that's enough to make it worthwhile for refs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froggie Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, Ginaro said: The living wage is £8.75. For a referee in the East Superleague it's £55, or £55 for the North/South Divisions. If they're at the ground for 3 hours, plus let's say 1:30 return travel time, that's £12.22 or £11.11 per hour. Do you think that's enough to make it worthwhile for refs? Always a dangerous tactic to resort to hard facts, but in this case wholly justified! Maybe it will provoke a sensible response to the observation that without a ref, there is no game...you never know, stranger things have happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffiti on the wall Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 The living wage is completely different from the minimum wage which the vast majority are on which is around £7.40 and nobody I know gets paid for there travel times so taking that and there travel fares it's probably still 3 times more than the guy on the sidelines earn so I don't understand all this bedwetting about there pay They choose that career nobody forces them to become a referee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuttonDressedAsLahm Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 4 minutes ago, griffiti on the wall said: The living wage is completely different from the minimum wage which the vast majority are on which is around £7.40 and nobody I know gets paid for there travel times so taking that and there travel fares it's probably still 3 times more than the guy on the sidelines earn so I don't understand all this bedwetting about there pay They choose that career nobody forces them to become a referee The National Living Wage is £7.83. I fail to understand why comparing referees to the lowest possible pay rates in society helps your point. The complaints about the standard of referees are hardly supported by stating “they chose that career”. If that’s the case, and you believe that, i’m really unsure what your grounds for complaint are... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffiti on the wall Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 The National Living Wage is £7.83. I fail to understand why comparing referees to the lowest possible pay rates in society helps your point. The complaints about the standard of referees are hardly supported by stating “they chose that career”. If that’s the case, and you believe that, i’m really unsure what your grounds for complaint are...Read the other posts then stupid and you will see that others brought up the issue of pay Its hardly rocket science scroll back loudmouth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
energyzone Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 I attended Stoneyburn v Armadale on Saturday where during an Armadale attack the ball was crossed into the penalty box an Armadale player clearly handled the ball and to everyone’s surprise Armadale were awarded a penalty. The Stoneyburn manager had words with the referee and received a red card.The consequences of this decision is that the manager could receive a £100 fine caused by a referee’s horrendous decision. Justice was done as we missed the penaltyWhat exactly did the manager think he was going to achieve by having words with the ref? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuttonDressedAsLahm Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 20 minutes ago, griffiti on the wall said: Read the other posts then stupid and you will see that others brought up the issue of pay Its hardly rocket science scroll back loudmouth You’re the one who claimed they were well paid. Others highlighted the reality. And yes, it’s hardly rocket science - you’re making that abundantly clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffiti on the wall Posted September 17, 2018 Share Posted September 17, 2018 You’re the one who claimed they were well paid. Others highlighted the reality. And yes, it’s hardly rocket science - you’re making that abundantly clear.Look I can't really be bother replying to your nonsense Other claimed why do the job for such a pittance / abuse etc so I pointed out they are better paid than the punters so it's hardly the worse job to earn a crust But you keep posting what you believe you read Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archieb Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 4 hours ago, not man of the match said: £37.50 p/h.....really? My mate says a Junior ref is on around £55? Arrive an hour before the game, do the game, go home and do the admin - thats when the job is done so I think you’re way off. As he once put it to me, a player will make more match changing mistakes than a referee ever will but refs are like goalkeepers, nobody forgets their mistakes. Wouldn’t be me but now I know a couple of lads that do it and the commitment that’s involved, I’d say they are undervalued and underpaid at this level. 4 hours ago, Ginaro said: The living wage is £8.75. For a referee in the East Superleague it's £55, or £50 for the North/South Divisions. If they're at the ground for 3 hours, plus let's say 1:30 return travel time, that's £12.22 or £11.11 per hour. Do you think that's enough to make it worthwhile for refs? In the West Premier £55 goes to the referee and £27.50 to each of his assistants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbaxters Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 12 hours ago, griffiti on the wall said: Why would I put my name forward ? Does having an opinion mean I want the job ? They choose to do the job and are paid well for it so like in every walk of life if you fail to do your job properly then you will face criticism. Dung. Just because these lads get a modest income for this does not allow daft men to roar obscenities at them for 90 mins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omar Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 I took the referees’ course in 2002. At that time I was playing, but wanted to do the course with an eye on helping out mates running teams in schools’ / youths’ football. The overwhelming arrogance of the two instructors was the thing that shone through. The best demonstration of this was one saying, “Most of the time when you turn up at the park, you are the only one who knows anything about football.” (It took great restraint for me not to walk out.) The issue is that this mentality permeates through to many young referees. I have no problem with referees making mistakes: it happens and I was pragmatic enough when playing to realise that they wouldn’t get everything right and I don’t go bananas now on the touch line when they give a throw-in the wrong way. However, too many referees behave as if they are untouchable. Players and coaches are dismissed like wee boys, when attempting to speak to referees in a reasonable manner. Cards are dished out quickly, with no or little explanation. The result is then that it becomes ‘them and us’ and it is totally adversarial. This is not always caused by the referee, but the referee in my opinion can help to set the tone. If players want to behave like idiots, deal with them, however don’t begin with the starting point that all players ARE idiots - they aren’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Moomintroll Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Look I can't really be bother replying to your nonsense Other claimed why do the job for such a pittance / abuse etc so I pointed out they are better paid than the punters so it's hardly the worse job to earn a crust But you keep posting what you believe you read Where do you work Griff? I fancy turning up for two hours to scream and shout abuse at you, while doing everything I can to make your job harder. Then as a bonus, will round up a few mates to walk you back to your car whilst threatening you every step of the way. Refeering standards are getting worse, there is no doubt about that, but it is no wonder when the vast majority of potential officials are being put off by what is happening on a weekly basis out there. The enemy within do not help either as the more "human" refs do not have a hope in hell of moving up the grades and get disheartened. I wasn't the best (just like the players) but tried to talk my way through games which most teams appreciated after the 90, in the end I gave it up partly due to my real work and partly because I didn't need the stress and intimidation.To be honest I get your frustration with grade 2 officials at the moment but for the reasons I have stated above a lot of them are overpromoted, again this is due to the lack of options and the box tick nature of progression, this is not going away any time soon and the pool will dwindle further.Try to go to a game as a neutral and just watch the referee for the full game and do it from his pov, the injury feigning, the dripfeed of comments from players and dugouts and the one eyed crap that flows from the crowd. It is stressful as hell and in the midst of it all you have to stay calm and try and make the right decision every time, trust me it is not easy, either mentally or physically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
griffiti on the wall Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Where do you work Griff? I fancy turning up for two hours to scream and shout abuse at you, while doing everything I can to make your job harder. Then as a bonus, will round up a few mates to walk you back to your car whilst threatening you every step of the way. Refeering standards are getting worse, there is no doubt about that, but it is no wonder when the vast majority of potential officials are being put off by what is happening on a weekly basis out there. The enemy within do not help either as the more "human" refs do not have a hope in hell of moving up the grades and get disheartened. I wasn't the best (just like the players) but tried to talk my way through games which most teams appreciated after the 90, in the end I gave it up partly due to my real work and partly because I didn't need the stress and intimidation.To be honest I get your frustration with grade 2 officials at the moment but for the reasons I have stated above a lot of them are overpromoted, again this is due to the lack of options and the box tick nature of progression, this is not going away any time soon and the pool will dwindle further.Try to go to a game as a neutral and just watch the referee for the full game and do it from his pov, the injury feigning, the dripfeed of comments from players and dugouts and the one eyed crap that flows from the crowd. It is stressful as hell and in the midst of it all you have to stay calm and try and make the right decision every time, trust me it is not easy, either mentally or physically.Why you talking utter shite Where did I say it was acceptable to abuse the referee I spoke about standards So don't waste my time with made up stories about abusing anyone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Moomintroll Posted September 18, 2018 Share Posted September 18, 2018 Why you talking utter shite Where did I say it was acceptable to abuse the referee I spoke about standards So don't waste my time with made up stories about abusing anyone Calm down there, I am agreeing with you about the standards, I am trying to give my opinion, as an ex amateur level ref, why its happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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