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Let's Talk Atlantic League


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The Atlantic League is a proposed Competition between Countries of Small Leagues. Which has been discussed since 2000. Now Let's  say it will happen due to the Big Five Leagues increased places in the Champions League and Revenue.

Countries  Involved.

Scotland                                                                                           Population -   5,42,800

Denmark                                                                                          Population-   5,785,884(2018 Estimation)

Norway                                                                                            Population- 5,302,778(2018 Estimation)

Sweden                                                                                            Population- 10,161,797(2018 Census)

Finland                                                                                              Population- 5,517,887(2018 Estimation)

Belgium                                                                                           Population- 11,358,357(Jan 2018 Estimation)

Netherlands                                                                                 Population-17,249,632(2018 Estimation)

Portugal                                                                                          Population - 10,291,027

                                                                                                             Total Population 28 Million people 

Format

I will Say Two Leagues of 16 teams with Domestic Leagues Beneath the Second Division.  Teams would be relegated back to there domestic league if they finished in the bottom of the second division.   Top two enter the Champions League. Let's say First place in the group stage and second placed place- Third Qualifying round. Third place Europa League a group stage place with the fourth entering the second qualifying position.

Yes nations would forfeit there own places. But in the long run to compete against the top five leagues which are surging ahead and will only get bigger. This maybe a worth whild chance to take. At least the gap will be reduced.

Games will be at the weekend allowing fans time to travel and clubs a week to rest.

Television

This new League will bring in much needed revenue compared to the current situation. Where TV revenue is minor. 

UEFA

There is this urban myth that UEFA will not allow cross border Leagues. Technical UEFA can not stop this due to European Union Competition laws. Which rule against restriction of trade. UEFA it already has been discussing a European Super League involving the Big Five Leagues.  A two Division Atlantic Leagues with links to Domestic football can proceed with nothing stopping it. The clubs involved would have to unite and remind UEFA of EU Laws that UEFA has to follow.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by DARREN38
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1 hour ago, DARREN38 said:

UEFA

There is this urban myth that UEFA will not allow cross border Leagues. Technical UEFA can not stop this due to European Union Competition laws. Which rule against restriction of trade. UEFA it already has been discussing a European Super League involving the Big Five Leagues.  A two Division Atlantic Leagues with links to Domestic football can proceed with nothing stopping it. The clubs involved would have to unite and remind UEFA of EU Laws that UEFA has to follow.

Scotland will be outside of EU law in March - how does your league get round that?

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10 hours ago, DARREN38 said:

Information

The Atlantic League is a proposed Competition between Countries of Small Leagues. Which has been discussed since 2000. Now Let's  say it will happen due to the Big Five Leagues increased places in the Champions League and Revenue.

Countries  Involved.

Scotland                                                                                           Population -   5,42,800

Denmark                                                                                          Population-   5,785,884(2018 Estimation)

Norway                                                                                            Population- 5,302,778(2018 Estimation)

Sweden                                                                                            Population- 10,161,797(2018 Census)

Finland                                                                                              Population- 5,517,887(2018 Estimation)

Belgium                                                                                           Population- 11,358,357(Jan 2018 Estimation)

Netherlands                                                                                 Population-17,249,632(2018 Estimation)

Portugal                                                                                          Population - 10,291,027

                                                                                                             Total Population 28 Million people 

Format

I will Say Two Leagues of 16 teams with Domestic Leagues Beneath the Second Division.  Teams would be relegated back to there domestic league if they finished in the bottom of the second division.   Top two enter the Champions League. Let's say First place in the group stage and second placed place- Third Qualifying round. Third place Europa League a group stage place with the fourth entering the second qualifying position.

Yes nations would forfeit there own places. But in the long run to compete against the top five leagues which are surging ahead and will only get bigger. This maybe a worth whild chance to take. At least the gap will be reduced.

Games will be at the weekend allowing fans time to travel and clubs a week to rest.

Television

This new League will bring in much needed revenue compared to the current situation. Where TV revenue is minor. 

UEFA

There is this urban myth that UEFA will not allow cross border Leagues. Technical UEFA can not stop this due to European Union Competition laws. Which rule against restriction of trade. UEFA it already has been discussing a European Super League involving the Big Five Leagues.  A two Division Atlantic Leagues with links to Domestic football can proceed with nothing stopping it. The clubs involved would have to unite and remind UEFA of EU Laws that UEFA has to follow.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm not totally convinced by your population calculations, but how would this affect the domestic leagues tv revenue with the best teams in each league abandoning them to play away games in Norway etc.? Can't imagine it would do much for gate receipts for the fortunate few to join the Atlantic League either to be honest.

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I agree that if UEFA continue to pander to the big leagues then other leagues should look to combine.

I think Belgium and Netherlands could combine just on their own and create a fairly strong league.

I think more thought and  imagination needs to go into the rest. Could Portugal try and join La Liga? Benfica are a huge worldwide club and could possibly challenge Barca and Real consistantly. Porto, Sporting, Braga and Boavista instead of the likes Huesco, Girona, Leganes and Eibar could make that league bigger then the EPL.

A Scandinavian league might work for Sweden, Norway, Denmark and Finland.

I don't know what Scotland could do though, Old Firm fans don't want change and as they are the biggest customer to the SPL why change???? I think a Celtic (not sellic) league like what happened in Rugby would be good but Cardiff and Swansea would be unlikely to want that with the money they get being yo-yo EPL sides but if you got them and a North Wales side plus 4 Ireland teams from the Provinces like the rugby has they would have big potential along with say the top 5 in the SPL could create an even 12 team league. 

 

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  • 4 months later...
On 9/9/2018 at 10:11, DARREN38 said:

Information

The Atlantic League is a proposed Competition between Countries of Small Leagues. Which has been discussed since 2000. Now Let's  say it will happen due to the Big Five Leagues increased places in the Champions League and Revenue.

Countries  Involved.

Scotland                                                                                           Population -   5,42,800

Denmark                                                                                          Population-   5,785,884(2018 Estimation)

Norway                                                                                            Population- 5,302,778(2018 Estimation)

Sweden                                                                                            Population- 10,161,797(2018 Census)

Finland                                                                                              Population- 5,517,887(2018 Estimation)

Belgium                                                                                           Population- 11,358,357(Jan 2018 Estimation)

Netherlands                                                                                 Population-17,249,632(2018 Estimation)

Portugal                                                                                          Population - 10,291,027

                                                                                                             Total Population 28 Million people 

 

 

 

I'm late to the party, as usual, but I make it almost 66 million. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I love aw this pish so i do ! Not that i ever take it seriously or expect it to happen but its fun to theorise . On the other I don’t just automatically call an idea a load of sh1te just because it’s different , or go around red dotting things other people say I disagree with DA baracas

 

Anyway i think it’s almost inevitable that eufa will give the go ahead to cross border leagues or merging of top divisions or some form of invite only super league. For us in Scotland that usually means finding a home for the old firm to play against clubs of a similar size and strength.

Both of them would dearly love to play in england but I don’t see any appetite from the English to have them, the epl is such a strong league with so many great games that they have no need to pay over the odds for 2 OF derby games a season ( once you take the little race out the equation they would just become Cardiff v Swansea with bigotry)

More realistic options would be joining scandanavia in a unified league however the clubs in norway sweeden and finland arent that strong either and it has to be a summer season up there .

Another option were that if holland and Belgium were to merge their top divisions then our arse cheeks could try to cosey in with them ?Its a great deal for the old firm, lots of strongish clubs only an hours flight away in 2 small countries.But its shite deal for them as they currently have hardly any travelling to do .

 

Once you start including portugal and so on it just gets messy . To cold to play in the Norwegian winter too hot to play the Portuguese summer.

As much as people decry this as a load of pish, the point of leagues is to separate opponents based on relative strengths. The old firm are misfits for our league, disproportionately large in terms of support and financial clout . Rangers have been shite because of mismanagement whilst killie are up there this season because they’ve rolled a double 6 with the manager. Aberdeen have strengthened to maintain consistent high finishes but you feel they are only a bad managerial appointment away from being bottom half again. Under normal conditions youd expect the old firm to stary finishing 15+ points ahead of third again shortly

 

 

 

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 09/09/2018 at 11:56, drs said:

Scotland will be outside of EU law in March - how does your league get round that?

Before you even get to that, its a competition and you're bound by conditions of entry.

Its not restriction of trade as UEFA dont prohibit clubs trading, only participating in their competitions.

That's how the Transfer window works - You can employ any employee at any time, just cant register them to play.

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Whats everyones thoughts on this ?  will it be the usual "tae f**k with this pish! I like tae keep things the way they've aye been" ?   or is there maybe a wee realisation that a select few teams regularly dishing out pumpings with ease isn't a benefit for anybody and that leagues are meant to be roughly equal in terms of strength and standard.    A lot  of people including myself would like to see the financial balance addressed but at the end of the day this is unlikely,  we cant turn the clock back with tv money,  something on the same magnitude as the bosman  ruling  may have an affect on the game  but even then , a team with 20-30% or less  of the support of a bigger rival is highly unlikely to compete meaningfully and regularly under any circumstances.

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  • 1 year later...
On 09/09/2018 at 10:11, DARREN38 said:

Information

The Atlantic League is a proposed Competition between Countries of Small Leagues. Which has been discussed since 2000. Now Let's  say it will happen due to the Big Five Leagues increased places in the Champions League and Revenue.

Countries  Involved.

Scotland                                                                                           Population -   5,42,800

Denmark                                                                                          Population-   5,785,884(2018 Estimation)

Norway                                                                                            Population- 5,302,778(2018 Estimation)

Sweden                                                                                            Population- 10,161,797(2018 Census)

Finland                                                                                              Population- 5,517,887(2018 Estimation)

Belgium                                                                                           Population- 11,358,357(Jan 2018 Estimation)

Netherlands                                                                                 Population-17,249,632(2018 Estimation)

Portugal                                                                                          Population - 10,291,027

                                                                                                             Total Population 28 Million people 

Format

I will Say Two Leagues of 16 teams with Domestic Leagues Beneath the Second Division.  Teams would be relegated back to there domestic league if they finished in the bottom of the second division.   Top two enter the Champions League. Let's say First place in the group stage and second placed place- Third Qualifying round. Third place Europa League a group stage place with the fourth entering the second qualifying position.

Yes nations would forfeit there own places. But in the long run to compete against the top five leagues which are surging ahead and will only get bigger. This maybe a worth whild chance to take. At least the gap will be reduced.

Games will be at the weekend allowing fans time to travel and clubs a week to rest.

Television

This new League will bring in much needed revenue compared to the current situation. Where TV revenue is minor. 

UEFA

There is this urban myth that UEFA will not allow cross border Leagues. Technical UEFA can not stop this due to European Union Competition laws. Which rule against restriction of trade. UEFA it already has been discussing a European Super League involving the Big Five Leagues.  A two Division Atlantic Leagues with links to Domestic football can proceed with nothing stopping it. The clubs involved would have to unite and remind UEFA of EU Laws that UEFA has to follow.

Yep. I've always liked the Atlantic League idea. It'd give some attractive games, and could off-load an Old Firm fixture to enable Scottish Premiership expansion. 

The format I'd use would be something like two divisions of 7, teams playing one another just once.

Edited to add -

I'd schedule the fixtures for during the winter breaks and/or late-season mid-weeks when most teams have been knocked out of European football and/or pre-season mid-weeks before European football has begun for these clubs and/or pre-season weekends once mid-week European football has already begun for these clubs.

Edited by prodcast
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  • 3 months later...

Now the idea is back in vogue. The most recent idea is to have a Atlantic League with sides from Scotland, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, and Ireland. 

I am fully in support of Scotland joining this. As long as there is promotion and relegation. Plus that perhaps other countries could enter teams such as Finland, Poland, the Baltic states, Russia, Belgium, and the Netherlands. 

We could originally have Glasgow Celtic, Glasgow Rangers, Aberdeen, Hearts, and Hibs in the Atlantic League. 

I would even be happy for the idea to be done even if it is just Denmark, Scotland, Sweden, Ireland, and Norway. 

This would increase the TV revenues, and sponsorship deals for Scottish sides.

I am against European Super Leagues when they are just set up as a closed shop, or just for the big countries., 

But this new idea would have promotion and relegation, so the likes of Dunfermline and Falkirk could be promoted into the system if they get investment,  

In the present era no Scottish team other than Celtic or Rangers could even win the Europa League. So we need to develop the system Scottish sides are in, to let Scottish clubs have a pathway to develop under investment into super clubs. I think the Atlantic League is that pathway. 

 

I honestly think every single soccer club in Scotland with investment could win promotion to this league in the same way that Ross County, and Clydebank made their ways up through the Scottish League system with investment. 

Let me reiterate. I do not support closed shops, in terms of no relegation and promotion. There has to be relegation and promotion from the national leagues. Plus there has to be compensation from the new league to the original national leagues to make up for the leagues losing their biggest club sides. 

If we want Scottish clubs to challenge the big sides in other countries we need to have an Atlantic League.

I want all Scottish club sides and the Scottish national side to do well. 

It would be an improvement in quality of football and finances for the Scottish sides. 

Imagine games like Aberdeen V Malmo, Rosenborg v Glasgow Celtic, Glasgow Rangers V IFK, Hibs v Bronby, Hearts v Copenhagen.

 

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18 minutes ago, Thistle Scotland Europe said:

Imagine games like Aberdeen V Malmo, Rosenborg v Glasgow Celtic, Glasgow Rangers V IFK, Hibs v Bronby, Hearts v Copenhagen.

We get that in the current set up. I prefer going to away games by bus in the general way of things. European away trips should be special.

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Some sort of Atlantic cup with following best teams not to have qualified for Europe through their leagues. With following teams doing group phase to get 4 clubs to join last 16. 

Livingston, Bronby, HJK, AIK, Odd, Utrecht, Mechelen, St Patrick's, Famalicão, Crusaders, Stjarnan, Caernarfon Town

The best clubs from these nations that been eliminated from Europe  prior to Christmas would be eligible to compete in the knockout stages. Take this year for example I will assume anyone that had finished 3rd in europa e.g. Standard Liege would have dropped into conference league so not giving them spot in this. 

So teams that got the furthest but not in Euro comp after xmas (where two teams from same nation out on same round highest ranked in previous season get the slot) would join Atlantic cup in the last 16 

Dundalk, Cetic, FC Midtjylland, Gent, Willem II,   are examples of plus the others from the 12 nations involved. 

Last 16 - 4 teams get in from the earlier qualifying rounds. They will be in separate pot so can only play each other  in last 16 thus guaranteeing 2 quarter final slots for theydiddy clubs that didn't qualify for Europe. For likes of Livy this year would have been a real opportunity to have a go at getting to final 8. Also good if we have years where Celtic and Rangers for example in Europe after Christmas and the financial bonus of that the next best Scottish team e.g. Aberdeen would get a boost from last 16 tie in this. 

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