Scotland v Belgium (07/09/18)

[Diamonds are Forever]

3 hours ago, No_Problemo said:

 

 

The other aspect with McLeish is that he was immediately derogatory to the squad as soon as he took over.

Going on and on about how this squad isn’t as good as the one he had previously. Setting them up to fail. I wouldn’t particularly even agree with that either.

 

 

 

I agree he shouldn't have been openly derogatory, however he is absolutely right. The team he had was on a different planet to the one we have now. Go and look at the starting line-up for that game against Italy. Every single player in that starting 11 either; played in a side that reached the UEFA Cup Final (Hutton, Weir, Ferguson, McCulloch, Boyd) that season, reached the last 16 of the Champions League that season and the one before (McManus, Brown, Hartley, Miller) , won a Champions League that season (Fletcher), or played for the team that finished 6th in the Premiership 6 months before/after (Naysmith, McFadden). The other player - Craig Gordon - was playing in the Premiership and around that time was excellent for Scotland, far better than he is now. When you look back at their names they don't seem particularly special players, but they were all at the peak of their careers playing at an extremely high level every week in huge matches. This is what people don't quite realise when they bring up McLeish's win ratio last time, he had a really good side, far better than people realise and far better than any other manager had in the last 20 years.

Compare that to now; a bunch of Celtic players who can't get by the 3rd qualifying round (and a striker who can't even get a game for them), a League One player, a Hearts player making his debut, a couple of Championship players, one good full-back playing as a centre-back, and one excellent full-back. It's not even comparable. Nevermind the 20 years of not qualifying, even in 10 years we have significantly regressed. I'm genuinely baffled when folk say they think we have a good young squad and are optimistic. We have the most unbalanced, untalented squad we've ever had.

Good to be optimistic eh!

[Guest bernardblack]

Listened to Football Weekly earlier and may have misheard that the top ranked side in each section (we would be C) get added to the playoffs, if a team in that section qualify from the typical qualifiers?

Is that right?

If so you can guarantee the SFA won’t take a strategic approach to arranging friendlies to maximise ranking points

[the snudge]

1 hour ago, Scary Bear said:

If only we were world leaders in football.

Can you monetise self-loathing?

Nirvana did. 

[Ian George]

The problem I have is arranging games against the likes of Belgium and even Portugal as we don't learn anything from them apart from the fact we're miles away. Need to forget last night's shambles and get a win on Monday.

[Scary Bear]

On a positive note Scotland fans got to see some decent footballers.

[The Ghost of B A R P]

7 hours ago, No_Problemo said:

 

So you don’t want Mulgrew at CB or Tierney - who might be this random 17 year old you think should play that’s better? There weren’t any other options due to injuries last night - I would still want Tierney and Robertson in the same team but just in a 4-4-1-1.

 

Agree.

7 hours ago, pandarilla said:

I'd like to see Tierney LB and Robertson LM.

Gareth bale started as a LB so let's try something more positive with Robertson.

f**k knows who our centre halves will be though. Maybe we can invent a new formation where we don't play with any?

Agree.

Back four, 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1, best players in the starting 11, everything pushed a bit further up the pitch, aggressive and committed approach from minute 1 to minute 95. Is it really that difficult?

I'd have McGregor in for Gordon, Paterson in at right back, Jack nowhere near Hampden.

If we don't win on Monday, McLeish might as well bolt; I'm sure they could find a 'health grounds' explanation... but it's the SFA we're talking about here, so dream on...

[Miss Tea Spoon]

The pundits over her - in Belgium - weren't very impressed with how we played.

They said the result was good but also that we merely scored out of big mistakes made by the Scottish players, apart from the Hazard goal.

The pundits at half time were complaining how we didn't properly press in the center of midfield and how we would get in big trouble playing like that against better teams.

So you didn't exactly see a Belgium at full pomp yesterday either.

[JamesM82]

10 minutes ago, Miss Tea Spoon said:

The pundits over her - in Belgium - weren't very impressed with how we played.

They said the result was good but also that we merely scored out of big mistakes made by the Scottish players, apart from the Hazard goal.

The pundits at half time were complaining how we didn't properly press in the center of midfield and how we would get in big trouble playing like that against better teams.

So you didn't exactly see a Belgium at full pomp yesterday either.

I can see where the Belgian pundits are coming from.

Until Belgium scored the first goal, we were doing alright. We restricted Belgium to few (if any) clear chances and had worked the ball into some decent areas ourselves. Better players / teams would have made more of those situations. We then gift them a goal and our morale totally collapsed after that.

Belgium didn't do much beyond their normal level to force those errors or break us down. I think they would have wanted us to keep up what we were doing in the early period, because at least that would have been something of a test. What in fact happened was football suicide.

[shawfield shed boy]

I still blame Del amtri and council

[kenny131]

3 hours ago, Estragon said:

Learn to read please, the low ebb we both referred to was Belgium's. 

Obviously. 

In no point was i refering to belgium learn to read. I was stating wales took them to task in the group stage and we are a million miles away from even putting a glove on them.  Its allowed were shite and havd been for decades unless yoh think otherwise i have no idea what the f**k your on about ya mutant

[kenny131]

33 minutes ago, The Ghost of B A R P said:

Agree.

Agree.

Back four, 4-4-1-1 or 4-5-1, best players in the starting 11, everything pushed a bit further up the pitch, aggressive and committed approach from minute 1 to minute 95. Is it really that difficult?

I'd have McGregor in for Gordon, Paterson in at right back, Jack nowhere near Hampden.

If we don't win on Monday, McLeish might as well bolt; I'm sure they could find a 'health grounds' explanation... but it's the SFA we're talking about here, so dream on...

When guys like malky mckay are getting employed by the sfa tells you where were at.

[Richey Edwards]

[BFTD]

30 minutes ago, Miss Tea Spoon said:

The pundits over her - in Belgium - weren't very impressed with how we played.

They said the result was good but also that we merely scored out of big mistakes made by the Scottish players, apart from the Hazard goal.

The pundits at half time were complaining how we didn't properly press in the center of midfield and how we would get in big trouble playing like that against better teams.

So you didn't exactly see a Belgium at full pomp yesterday either.

They really did look like they were having a charity kickabout at times, which was the most depressing part of yesterday's game. It's one thing to take a tanking from a top side giving it their best, but anyone who watched the World Cup will be well aware that Belgium went easy on us.

You can't blame them either; they've got a much tougher competitive game on Tuesday against...Iceland  

[Coooombe]

1 hour ago, bernardblack said:

Listened to Football Weekly earlier and may have misheard that the top ranked side in each section (we would be C) get added to the playoffs, if a team in that section qualify from the typical qualifiers?

Is that right?

If so you can guarantee the SFA won’t take a strategic approach to arranging friendlies to maximise ranking points

I believe by "top ranked" it means the best runners up in the groups. I'd imagine this would work in the same way as the Qualifiers in that it would discount results against the bottom teams in the groups of 4 and the next best second place team would go into the playoff.

I could be totally wrong here, but that's how I interpreted it.

[Richey Edwards]

I expected nothing but a defeat from last nights game, but you used to at least be able to say that Scotland battled and tried to stop superior opponents from playing. The "valiant defeat" that we used to see often.

Last night was an embarrassment against a side who did not even need to break sweat to put four goals past us. If Belgium were in the mood, it could have been at least seven.

I did not particularly want McLeish back but was willing to give him a chance. A defeat on Monday night and all remaining goodwill will evaporate.

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

We're one of the world's most passionate footballing nations. We have a football history like no other.

I'm struggling to think of a more embarrassing, humiliating experience at Hampden (outside Aberdeen v Motherwell) than the one we had last night. Thank God that Belgium took some kind of pity on us after 60  minutes. 

[Alan Stubbs]

By my estimations, we're about 1 or 2 games away from the bit where the parochial wee band of fannies who get paid to talk about Scottish football circle the wagons around their jobber pal and start getting all pissy about the fans. Same thing happened last time, even though it was Strachan finally giving the fans what they wanted that kickstarted the campaign (too late).

Talking of Strachan, apart from the fact that he didn't appear to be a raging alcoholic, I don't think McLeish being shite makes him look any better. They're both dinosaurs and a pair of slavering wankers to boot. It's not some click of the fingers solution and it could easily be a disaster but I would love a left-field foreign appointment next time. The gamble of it would be a real thrill compared to this depressingly predictable drudgery.

[Ira Gaines]

Using McLeish as a way to try and talk up Strachan is stupid. McLeish may be the wrong decision to replace him, but that doesn't mean it was the wrong decision to get rid of someone who brought his multiple failures on himself.

[BB_Bino]

Unbelievably and very unfortunately 20,000 gullible souls turned up. If they had any idea whatsoever they would have charged £15-20 for adults and £5 for kids.  

I was one of those gullible fools, but only because it’s nearly impossible to take my 7 year old son to International games due to them all being mid-week these days!

However, I’m not that gullible. Due to the pricing, I did not buy an Albania ticket, so the SFA got the same amount of money out of me (less if you throw in all the extras on match day) and have 1 extra empty seat. It’s their loss.

For what it’s worth, I think there has been a bit of an over reaction on this thread. Remember, Belgium aren’t the 2nd best team in the world for no reason at all.

I’m no happy clapper saying that we were great, far from it, but I thought there were positives.

McLeish said on the radio today that he will be going with McGregor in goals on Monday night but that aside, I thought Robertson, Souttar and Tierney were a good foundation to build on at the back (although I would rather have KT at Right Back), I thought McGinn worked tirelessly in Midfield and tried to make things happen as did Fraser. I thought Snodgrass was very effective when he came on for Armstrong, and must start on Monday night and without being super, I though Griffiths did well as the lone striker.

I though Mulgrew was really poor, but he’ll not be playing a team like Belgium again any time soon, Naismith was poor when he came on and looked lost, Gordon looked surprisingly shakey, despite a few decent saves and Callum McGregor and Armstrong were just anonymous.

Just my 2p’s worth, but let’s hope the lads can re-group and get the victory we all crave on Monday night.

[neildrake]

It is funny to see all the rage at McLeish.  Any Motherwell fan  could have told you twenty years ago that he was hopeless.  He is the very example of better being lucky than good. 

He kept the media onside and was never criticised for the terrible job he did at Fir Park. I have never had any time for him and as for the SFA appointing him when it was clear that he was done and no one else would look at him.  We have got what we deserve.